Results with Savage 12 FV 6.5mm Creedmoor

[CFJunkie]

The mag I measured was an MDT. I eventually found an AICS mag from Accuracy International with internal dimensions that would support a 2.880+ O.A.L. so that will work fine.
I'm hoping that the high rings on the NightForce scope with the 56mm front objective will get the optical axis high enough to let me get behind the scope comfortably.
If not, I will have to find some extra high rings and they will be expensive.
I expect to try the Oryx stock on my 12 FV 6.5mm CM shortly.
We'll see if the sturdier, less flexible stock can outshoot the cheap factory plastic stock.

I have a set of extra high rings on the way for my .223 so I can try the Oryx on 12 FV .223 with the 36X42mm Sightron scope. I'm hoping that will make the optical plane high enough to get behind the scope. Medium high rings that shoot great on the 12 FV factory stock were way too low ion the Oryx.
Fortunately, the AICS magazine for the .223 has more O.A.L. space than I could ever use.
Even a 77 gr bullet would be out of the neck if I ever loaded it out to the end of that mag.

[CFJunkie]

This is the second time that I claimed that when I provided the last two results that I would close this thread and change the stock on the 12 FV 6.5mm Creedmoor. Well, I still wanted to shoot the 6.5mm Creedmoor and the new Oryx frame that arrived is mounted on the 12 FV .223 because the .223 magazine would accommodate the O.A.L.s that I want to shoot to get the best accuracy and the 6.5mm MDT mag wouldn’t. I had to wait for x-high rings for the .223 because the lowest setting for the Oryx stock cheek weld is 0.5 inches higher than the Savage stock and I couldn’t shoot it comfortably with the scope mounted so low. The x-high rings are now mounted and the action has been moved to the Oryx frame so I intend to shoot the 12 FV .223 with the Oryx stock tomorrow and will start a new thread to document its performance and then compare the results to the factory stock. The AICS mag with enough space for the 6.5mm CM O.A.L. I use hasn’t arrived yet, so this post still has data from the 6.5mm factory stock. When the AICS mag for the 6.5mm CM arrives with sufficient internal space to support the O.A.L. I desire, I’ll consider switching the Oryx frame to the 6.5mm. If the .223 results tomorrow are encouraging, I’ll probably order another Oryx frame. If not, I’ll try it on the 6.5 mm. If it doesn’t show any improvement in accuracy in either rifle, I guess a lightly used Oryx frame will be on the market.
The following are the results with the Savage 12 6.5 mm Creedmoor shot in Northern Virginia on Tuesday morning, July 2^nd at 100 yards. Temperatures on Monday were from 74 to 86 degrees with winds from calm to 3 mph. Altitude of the range is 250 feet above sea level. Temperatures were warm so once I shot the first 10 rounds, I had to let the barrel cool until I could shoot the next set. I usually only got about 7 to 9 rounds down range before the barrel was over the 122-130 reading on the temperature strip I have on my barrel. It took a while to get the three loads finished.
All rounds were shot using Lapua brass and CCI BR-4 primers with an 8x32x56mm NightForce scope with a NP-2DD reticle. All bullets were loaded to achieve a 1.360 msec. exit time which should be the sweet spot for a 26-inch 3% carbon steel barrel with a 0.040-inch recessed crown. The action screws were torqued to 35 in.-lbs. prior to this session.
For this session, I loaded IMR4451 Enduron powder and I planned the seating depths so all the different bullets would achieve the same jump to the rifling – 0.020 – and then adjusted the seating depth by less than 0.005 thousandths to achieve the 1.360 exit time. This morning I shot Sierra TGK 130 grain bullets, Hornady ELD-M 140 grain bullets, and Hornady ELD-X 143 grain bullets.
The load description field shows the powder and charge, the O.A.L., the trim length, and the bullet exit time from the 26-inch barrel.

# Grps	Load Description	Bullet	Weight	Velocity	Average	Median	St Dev	1	2	3	4
4	IMR4451 38.9 gr 2.830 1.906 wf 1.360 * 74/74 deg. F. 35 in.-lbs.	Sierra TGK #4330	130	2702	0.250	0.267	0.076	0.146	0.241	0.293	0.318
3	IMR4451 39.0 gr 2.850 1.908 wf 1.360 * 78/82 deg. F. 35 in-lbs.	Hornady ELD-M #26331	140	2669	0.301	0.283	0.056	0.257	0.283	0.364
4	IMR4451 38.7 gr 2.852 1.911 wf 1.360 * 82/86 deg. F. 35 in.-lbs.	Hornady ELD-X #2635	143	2656	0..288	0.292	0.053	0.220	0.289	0.291	0.349
11					0.278	0.289	0.071

The first group of the 130 grain TGK was incredible - five shots into one ragged hole to start the day after one sighter to foul the barrel. The first three rounds were literally in the same hole and the next two enlarged it a bit to the right. I had great expectations after that but it went back to normal from there on although shooting a 0.278 average for 11 groups with the worst load barely larger than 0.300 is nothing to complain about.
The 143 ELD-X bullets continue to impress and today’s results bettered the initial session average of 0.298. The combined average for the 143 ELD-X with IMR4451 powder is now 0.304. Not bad for a hunting bullet. The 130 TMKs are also not shooting badly and performed best today, although the overall average for IMR4451 powder is 0.345.

[varget204]

The ORYX has adjustable cheek rest,lots of adjustment

[CFJunkie]

Yes, it does. I was able to use that feature with the x-high rings.
But with the original scope rings that fit the 42 mm front optic on the Sightron perfectly and obviously allowed the rifle to shoot pretty well (http://www.savageshooters.com/showthread.php?63914-First-results-with-new-12-FV-223), the adjustable cheek rest was at the bottom adjustment limit and the rings that were perfect for the 12 FV in the Savage factory stock were still too low for the straight (no drop) stock.

If Oryx wanted to provide the 'drop in' feature that they claim, they could have recognized that the 'AR look' they were trying to emulate was created and the shape was forced by its recoil tube that eliminates the possibility of 'drop'. Their choice added another $78 to the Oryx stock cost. IMO, I would have preferred to drop in the action and be able to shoot it without having to change scope rings.

To me the 'look' means nothing. The only thing that matters is that the rifle shoots accurately. All I wanted was a stock that didn't flex. I should have bought a Hogue with the full aluminum frame for 1/2 the price.

I had to get high rings on my Les Baer .223 also for the same reason, only the Les Baer is an AR with a recoil tube.

When I get the longer internal magazine I hope the high rings on the 6.5mm Creedmoor to clear the 56mm front objective on the NightForce provide enough clearance.

[varget204]

I have a Sightron III 10-50-x 60 medium rings,my scope sit about 1/8 " above barrel,have to raise check piece,5/16-3/8",wish barreled action sat lower in chassis,don't know why inletting was not lowered .100 to .125 more than it is; but the more i shoot it the more i like it. Have heard Hogue stock flexs ,on other sites

[CFJunkie]

Hogue makes two different stock for the Savage hidden mag models.
One has aluminum pillar beds but does not have an aluminum frame. I suspect that one would flex, especially if the caliber was 6.5mm Creedmoor and larger.
Hogue also makes a stock with an aluminum frame and aluminum pillar beds that is about $ 100 more expensive. I would think that one would not flex.

By the way, I just moved the Oryx to the 6.5mm Creedmoor 12 FV with the NightForce 30mm tube mounted on high rings and I was able to get a comfortable cheek weld with the cheek piece set at the same height as for the x-high rings on the 1-inch tube Sightron. It feels like it should work. I intend to try it tomorrow or Tuesday.

[Texas10]

Lot's of detail in your spread sheets, very good information. Thanks for posting.

Questions for you CFJunkie:

When torquing the action screws in your 12FV, did you torque both screws the same, or did you perform a torque tune of the rear screw as per this link?https://www.accurateshooter.com/tech...torque-tuning/

Secondly, have you tried the new Hornaday A-Tip in your 6.5 CM?

[CFJunkie]

Torquing:
I tried several different methods to torque the action screws since I had to do retorque the action screws almost every time I cleaned the 6.5mm Creedmoor.
One time, I torqued the front screw and then torqued the back screw.
Then I tried torqueing each screw incrementally until they were both at 35 in.-lbs as recommended in the Savage manual.
Then I tried torquing the rear screw to 35 in-lbs. and then torqued the front screw the same amount.

As long as they were both torqued to 35 in.-lbs. the rifle shot great.
When I torqued the action screws to 45 in.-lbs. the averages were 0.1 inch larger.

Yesterday, I tried the Oryx chassis off my 12 FV .223 with the action screws torqued to 60 in.-lbs. and the 6.5mm Creedmoor shot about 5 % more accurately without any flex at all. It might do better when I get used to the different feel. It usually takes me at least one session to get comfortable with a new set up.

Today, I ordered another Oryx chassis for my 12 FV 6.5mm Creedmoor. I put the original Oryx chassis back on my 12 FV .223 and shot it this morning. It shot about 12.6% smaller groups so far with the Oryx chassis than the factory stock (comparing only the bullets and powders that were shot with both the factory stock and Oryx chassis).
The Oryx chassis also seems easier to keep my set up on the .223 more consistent with the more stable chassis.

Hornady A-Tip bullets:
I haven't ordered any of those yet. I have had great results with the 130 ELD-M, 140 ELD-M, 147 ELD-M and the 143 ELD-X.
I saw that the A-Tips require a different seater for the seating die, so I really wasn't all that hot to go through that drill.