OK guys I did some testing on my 12F with 168 Berger's VLD and I shot 5 shot group after the barrel was fouled and it shot the best with the bullet just touching the lands, I tryed jammed, just touching, .020 off, .030 off it just got worst. My gun loves them Berger's touching the lands. It was better at 200yds then 100yds. Where I was at I could not shot any passed 200yds I would like to see what they would do at 600yds. Do you guys thank it would be stable at 1000yds with the 12 twist? I have never shot them ranges I would like too.