Fred put up some numbers in the link below from testing he's done with the .38Spl case mod. Basically it's good for roughly a 2-lb reduction in lift effort on average.Originally Posted by JeepsAndGuns
https://www.savageshooters.com/conte...Bolt-Lift-Kits
"Life' is tough. It's even tougher if you're stupid." ~ John Wayne
“Under certain circumstances, urgent circumstances, desperate circumstances, profanity provides a relief denied even to prayer.” —Mark Twain
Nice work again Dave. You are an inspiration to offset some of the negativity we see on here at times. God bless you.
Looks really good, Dave! Unfortunately (for the purpose of this topic, anyway), my Savage has the cocking indicator that shows through the BAS.
Yes the Axis style. I guess that is pretty much standard on all new 110 series? I don’t have much play with those, but several I trust say they don’t suffer from the heavy bolt lift we know. Robin is fond of that style I believe. Right Robin?
Thank you my friends for the encouragement. I do enjoy posting here. Some negativity no matter what other forum, unfortunately. Seems some people can’t exist without attempting to cause pain & anguish. I posted the video of bolt operation on Calguns, and a stranger there argued basically how “unimpressive” it was. Which is fine. Everyone is entitled to their opinion. But he continued arguing that I should have made the lift kit like the Lampeth kit and use the penetrator from a 3006 AP round??? I became confused with the jibberish, and realized he was simply a bitter person content on making others bitter. Best off just not arguing.
I'm pretty sure Savage began using the cocking indicator-style firing pins on 110 series rifles in 2005 with the launch of the 14/114 Classic series. They are primarily used on bottom bolt release models as the "flag" on the top bolt release models acts somewhat as a cocking indicator.
"Life' is tough. It's even tougher if you're stupid." ~ John Wayne
“Under certain circumstances, urgent circumstances, desperate circumstances, profanity provides a relief denied even to prayer.” —Mark Twain
Good idea. Best not to enter into an argument with an ignorant hater. They will drag you down to their level of stupidity and pummel you with their experience.
I watched your video and it was what you said it would be - showing the ease of movement after your lift kit was installed.
Question: will a bolt from an older Savage without the pass-through cocking indicator function SAFELY in a rifle that came originally with that type assuming all else is equal (.308 in a .308, center-feed, etc)?
You said it man. I’m getting VERY acquainted with the “Ignore Function” there. Maybe a Commiforni thing?? So many Libtards it makes EVERYONE nasty?
Hmm, I’ve never thought about what you are asking. I believe so. The headspace will need reset I’m sure. But not sure you would want to. Robin has extensive use with BOTH, and prefers the the style firing pin/spring assy. with the indicator bolt. I would ask him about it’s “trick”.
Jim, or Robin should know this better than me.
One thing you have to keep in mind when fiddling with the firing pin is total mass (weight) of the FP and energy provided by the spring. Where a lot of guys make mistakes is thinking they can somehow decrease the lock time by going to a lighter FP or spring without taking mass and energy into consideration. This usually ends up in ignition troubles with light primer strikes. Couldn't begin to count the number of folks who have showed up here over the years with ignition issues after installing one of Tubb's SpeedLock Kits when he used to offer them for Savage's.
As much as Savage gets wrong, one thing they did get right was the FP spring rate. The problem is their FP springs can vary by as much as 2-lbs. JeepsAndGuns noted earlier in the other thread that he thought Fred replaced the spring on his rifle when he T&T'd it, but it's still the factory spring. What Fred does is measure the initial rate, and if it's higher than it should be he essentially takes the O.D. down until it measures the spec he wants it to (pounds per one inch of compression). That's why the spring wire looks flat rather than round.
As for Chris's question, yes it would perform normally. When the FP with cocking indicator first came out a lot of guys ordered a replacement solid BAS and old-style FP assembly to replace the new style simply because they didn't like it.
"Life' is tough. It's even tougher if you're stupid." ~ John Wayne
“Under certain circumstances, urgent circumstances, desperate circumstances, profanity provides a relief denied even to prayer.” —Mark Twain
I have seen that and it is a good read. However I meant specifically comparing the OP's tungsten insert and Silicone Nitride ball bearing to the 38spl and regular ball bearing. I was just curious if there was a noticeable difference going from the 38spl case and the OP's hard metal version.
I indicated in the beginning, not likely to see any discernible increase. Just something I’ve wanted to do. Using the hardest BB & opposing surface(Si3N4 & Tungsten), providing “optimal” conditions, is what I was after.
Ill say, these would not be profitable to sell anyway. Besides the much higher cost of the materials, machining costs & time are WAY above normal. On another site I posted this, I made a comment about Ti being “nice” to machine, but need to be careful of the heat generated and fire. I guess I’m not very good at sarcasm. LOL! An adoring fan in California couldn’t wait to tell me no REAL machinist ever said Titanium was nice to machine. Ugh... Sarcasm aside, I had to explain I’m not a real machinist...just a one armed cripple that loves doing this stuff. LOL. But he’s the owner operator of AR15barrels... so I’m glad he’s got it all figured out. I sure don’t!
This has been great though. Thank you Jim & Robin for all the info. Knew some of it...DIDN’T know ALOT of it! And I LOVE learning new things!
What is the disadvantage of using a washer between the base of the BAS and the bolt to offset the additional thickness of the pieces instead of cutting it?
Thanks.
Not sure I follow. What washer are you referring to? The BAS is the screw. (BAS = Bolt Assembly Screw). What other screw is the reference? The BAS must be shortened, otherwise the extra length of the plate & BB would preload the firing pin spring WAY to much! Possibly even bind the coils.
Dave, some have used a washer under the stock bas screw to move it back to avoid machining the screw.
Yes - a washer to move the BAS back the thickness of the pieces that were added internally.
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