Recoil lugs and barrel nuts

[scpaul]

Hope everone's doing OK. It's been a while since I've had a chance to get on the forums. I've been busy working on my build, the 7mm Valkyrie. I've had quite alot of advice and counciling by AckleymanII because this was my first build. A stainless Savage 116 that was originally a 7mm Rem. Mag. I bought a reamer from PTG and made a stabilized reamer drive with a flex joint and a hand fitted a bushing for the rear of the action to hold the reamer drive in alignment, and re-chambered the 7 Rem. to a & Val. Re-did the trigger with the help of Foxx who sent me some spring wire for the trigger until I can get an aftermarket trigger. I put it in a Boyd's heavy thumbhole varmint stock and had to fit the thumbhole and L.O.P. to me, I'm 5'6" maybe. Floated the barrel. Bedded the action and added pillars. Got a magazine and bottom metal w/trigger guard from Accurate-Mag. The magazine length is 3.850 so I could load 160 - 175 gr. bullets without using too much case volume. Installed and fitted a Limbsaver recoil pad. New firing pin and a 17 lb. (?) Wolff firing pin spring. Put on Leupold base and rings with a illuminated dot 2.5 - 10 x 56 sf 30 mm Weaver scope.
OK, now to the point, I bought a 32" stainless barrel to rechamber to +/- 30". I need opinions on the barrel nuts and lugs from "Northland Shooters Supply". I've never done any business with them and I'm seeing the lugs and barrel nuts from them very reasonably priced and basically the same thing for sale other places considerably more expensive. Just how good is the Northland Shooters Supply parts, spacifically the barrel lugs and nuts for a regular shank Savage barrel? Thanks, your opinions will be greatly appreciated, Thank You, Paul E-Mail address neese.paul@yahoo.com

[Idaho]

I too and doing a re-build although not as complex as yours and I'm looking at NSS for a barrel nut and recoil lug and plan to call them tomorrow. When you contacted them did they indicate that they have these items in stock and ready for shipping?

[Robinhood]

Do you have a lathe? Turn a mandre and cut some threads and turn the face on your own nut. Buy the heavy Recoil lug from Fred or Jim.

[barrel-nut]

You won't find better parts or people than Northland. Give Jim a call.

[scpaul]

I don't have the equipment, a friend is showing me what to do. I haven't spoken to anybody. I'm just checking around. I'd much pay 2x the price for a part if it's worth it. I'm just checking on NSS And SSS, now that somebody suggested them, to see what kind of dealings others have had in the past as well as the quality of the parts. Thanks, Paul

[LongRange]

call jim at north land...and yes they are fantastic parts and very well made.

[scooterf79]

Yep, give NSS a call, Jim will hook you up with what you need. Good parts and great to deal with too.
Scooter

[Robinhood]

I don't have the equipment, a friend is showing me what to do.

How was this done?

made a stabilized reamer drive with a flex joint and a hand fitted a bushing for the rear of the action to hold the reamer drive in alignment, and re-chambered the 7 Rem. to a & Val.

I want pictures. I love improvising. I have lots of tools though...

[J.Baker]

The "precision" nut is really a waste of money. In discussing nuts with Fred the factory ones only vary by one or two thousands at worst. If you want to dress yours up a little to call it a "precision" nut, just tape some 600 grit sand paper to a piece of glass and rub the mating surface of the nut over it a few times and ta-da...it's now as precision as it's going to ever get.

As for recoil lugs, stick with SSS or Jim Briggs as there are some other ones out there that aren't near the quality that those two are.

[Dennis]

The "precision" nut is really a waste of money. In discussing nuts with Fred the factory ones only vary by one or two thousands at worst. If you want to dress yours up a little to call it a "precision" nut, just tape some 600 grit sand paper to a piece of glass and rub the mating surface of the nut over it a few times and ta-da...it's now as precision as it's going to ever get.

As for recoil lugs, stick with SSS or Jim Briggs as there are some other ones out there that aren't near the quality that those two are.

Fred has proven this concerning the barrel nuts. Mating an inside threaded nut with an outside threaded barrel will be off a few thousandths.

[jerry shaw]

My experience has been really good with Jim Briggs. He has had a lot of opportunities to sell me the wrong thing, but he has always done right by me.

[J.Baker]

My experience has been really good with Jim Briggs. He has had a lot of opportunities to sell me the wrong thing, but he has always done right by me.

Jim's a great guy to do business with, never meant to imply he wasn't. What I was getting at is that buying one of his precision nuts isn't going to gain you anything over a factory nut. If you need to buy a nut and you're already ordering some other stuff from Jim then great, but if you have the factory nut I wouldn't bother.

[scpaul]

Mr. Hood,I started with a stainless Savage 116 in 7mm Rem.Mag. The reamer has a 3/8 drive like a ratchet, I ground the female end on the outside of a 3/8 drive 6" extension until it would go into the action from the rear like a bolt. The part of the extension that I had ground down was smoothed going around the circumferance to keep it as smooth as possible with fine emory cloth. If you go slow enough when you are grind the end of the extension it can help you by acting as a loose guide. Then I took some good quality electrical tape (thicker and more like rubber than the cheap stuff, fairly wide rubber bands might work even better if they made the joint tight enough)and cut strips to go into the female end of the extension until the joint of the extension went on the reamer fairly tight because of the tape. It had some resistance to flexing but it would flex some if necessary.That served as a flex joint so that the bushing on the end of the reamer would act as a guide and to flex to minimize any deviations by me. I got the bushing from Lowes that had a 1" outer shoulder, the main outer body of the bushing was .700 (very close to the inner diameter of the action, I think the description on the bag was 1.00" x .700" x .500", I'm not positive) and the hole through the center was .500". I marked the bushing so that I could keep it clocked to the same spot on the action and marked both. In order for the bushing to fit into the action I had to file/grind the bottom 1" outer shoulder (flange) approximately .150" until it would allow the .700 body of the bushing would go into the rear of the action straight. I kept plenty of lube on everything from here on. I put the reamer into the chamber, then put the modified extension on the reamer, with the tape in the female end of the extension. I then put the bronze bushing on the extension and clocked until the marks on the bushing and the action matched and the shoulder that I had worked down allowed the bushing to fit into the action straight and the shoulder sat flat on the back of the action. I then put a handle for the larger taps (the type with 2 handles,you would tighten 1 handle to hold a tap in the handle) and put it on the end of the extension. From here I turned the tap handle slowly with light pressure and kept it lubed and kept it as straight as I could. To begin with I would remove the reamer about every 5 or 6 rotations, flush the chamber with WD-40 and let the oil and the chips go through the barrel into a pan under the muzzle. I did this until the go-gauge was getting close to letting the bolt close. Then I went to 2 then 1 rotation and lighter pressure until the bolt closed on the go-gauge with slight resistance. Use plenty of cutting oil, flush often to keep the reamer from picking up a chip and scarring the chamber and/or messing the reamer up. I put cutting oil into the chamber and on the reamer before I put the reamer back in. Hold the bushing down to make sure that it doesn't try to turn or pop up and allow the reamer to get mis-aligned. You have to be patient and go slowly. All total, it probably took me 6 hours because it was my first chamber and I didn't want to screw up a $130 reamer. I got the reamer and go-gauge from PTG, and except for the wait being a little longer than expected, I'm very happy with both of them. Mr. Hood if you have any questions the best way to reach me is my e-mail neese.paul@yahoo.com watch out for the dot between my first/last names. I try to check my e-mail daily. So far, working up loads, I've had 1 three shot group about 30 caliber with this 7mm. I've had several about 1/3 MOA. I didn't have any way to measure it, but I do have a witness. Good luck and have a good one, Paul

[DanSavage]

Incredible job Paul! It's things like this that the gunsmith's don't want you to know.. and nothing beats the feeling of doing everything yourself, and see outstanding results.

[J.Baker]

Mr. Hood,I started with a stainless Savage 116 in 7mm Rem.Mag. The reamer has a 3/8 drive like a ratchet, I ground the female end on the outside of a 3/8 drive 6" extension until it would go into the action from the rear like a bolt. The part of the extension that I had ground down was smoothed going around the circumferance to keep it as smooth as possible with fine emory cloth. If you go slow enough when you are grind the end of the extension it can help you by acting as a loose guide. Then I took some good quality electrical tape (thicker and more like rubber than the cheap stuff, fairly wide rubber bands might work even better if they made the joint tight enough)and cut strips to go into the female end of the extension until the joint of the extension went on the reamer fairly tight because of the tape. It had some resistance to flexing but it would flex some if necessary.That served as a flex joint so that the bushing on the end of the reamer would act as a guide and to flex to minimize any deviations by me. I got the bushing from Lowes that had a 1" outer shoulder, the main outer body of the bushing was .700 (very close to the inner diameter of the action, I think the description on the bag was 1.00" x .700" x .500", I'm not positive) and the hole through the center was .500". I marked the bushing so that I could keep it clocked to the same spot on the action and marked both. In order for the bushing to fit into the action I had to file/grind the bottom 1" outer shoulder (flange) approximately .150" until it would allow the .700 body of the bushing would go into the rear of the action straight. I kept plenty of lube on everything from here on. I put the reamer into the chamber, then put the modified extension on the reamer, with the tape in the female end of the extension. I then put the bronze bushing on the extension and clocked until the marks on the bushing and the action matched and the shoulder that I had worked down allowed the bushing to fit into the action straight and the shoulder sat flat on the back of the action. I then put a handle for the larger taps (the type with 2 handles,you would tighten 1 handle to hold a tap in the handle) and put it on the end of the extension. From here I turned the tap handle slowly with light pressure and kept it lubed and kept it as straight as I could. To begin with I would remove the reamer about every 5 or 6 rotations, flush the chamber with WD-40 and let the oil and the chips go through the barrel into a pan under the muzzle. I did this until the go-gauge was getting close to letting the bolt close. Then I went to 2 then 1 rotation and lighter pressure until the bolt closed on the go-gauge with slight resistance. Use plenty of cutting oil, flush often to keep the reamer from picking up a chip and scarring the chamber and/or messing the reamer up. I put cutting oil into the chamber and on the reamer before I put the reamer back in. Hold the bushing down to make sure that it doesn't try to turn or pop up and allow the reamer to get mis-aligned. You have to be patient and go slowly. All total, it probably took me 6 hours because it was my first chamber and I didn't want to screw up a $130 reamer. I got the reamer and go-gauge from PTG, and except for the wait being a little longer than expected, I'm very happy with both of them. Mr. Hood if you have any questions the best way to reach me is my e-mail neese.paul@yahoo.com watch out for the dot between my first/last names. I try to check my e-mail daily. So far, working up loads, I've had 1 three shot group about 30 caliber with this 7mm. I've had several about 1/3 MOA. I didn't have any way to measure it, but I do have a witness. Good luck and have a good one, Paul

Yeah, tried to read that but it just turns into a big blur after the first two lines. The return key and separated paragraphs are your friends.

[DanSavage]

I like it,, it's like an instruction manual.LOL

[Tom Thomson]

scpaul
you said that you installed a new firing pin spring. is the stock spring more or less than 17#? did this affect the bolt lift effort? have you experienced any misfires with old or new spring?
tommyt

[scpaul]

Tommy, I may have been wrong about the strength of the firing pin spring. I had been working with 3 at one time. I got mine from Wolff sprin gs. They can probably tell you

what the original was and if they have any heavier. It seems that I went up 2 or 3 lbs. but can't be sure. It didn't make any difference on the bolt lift that I can tell. Maybe a

scale can tell you, but I can't

I bought a used Savage 116 for this project and yes it misfired about 10% of the time. I streached the firing pin spring about 1/2 or 3/4" and the misfiring stopped. I have no

idea how long that it might have been put up with the f. pin spring compressed. I always put my f.pins down. Snap caps are nice. In a bind you can make one by de-priming

a case and fitting a piece of dense rubber into the primer hole. I also glued mine in with H.D. (Marine ?)"Shoe Goo" (Walmart).


Jim, I double spaced just for you. Sorry that I

don't know where one paragraph ends and

another one starts. I hope that this helps

some anyway.

I haven't spoken to you in a while, you doing

OK? I guessed at where this paragraph

started, hope that I was right. Catch you

later Jim and I hope that I helped you some

Tommy. Y'all have a good one, Paul

[scpaul]

To whom it may concern: It read like an instruction manual is because that was what I thought he wanted. I just realized my mistake......I tried to think. I'll try not to make

that mistake again Jim. Sorry, but I remembered to double space !!! Later, Y'all, Paul

[Tom Thomson]

scpaul
read abt your firing pin and spring. how heavy is the stock spring? is 17# more or less? if less, have you had any misfires?
did the change affect bolt lift effort?
tommyt

[Tom Thomson]

oops i should have read page #2 sorry
tommyt

[scpaul]

No problem Tommy, I'd hate to tell you how many times I've done the same thing or had it all run together and I jump a line or two. I hope that I didn't make Jim mad, it was

all ment as a joke. I don't know how to drive this thing and my memory is so short that I forget from day to day. Like I told my wife, atleast I've never seen the

same movie/program twice.

I know this thing can do some things that I'd like but I don't know how to turn them on/off.

Anyway Tommy, if there's anything that I can help you with my email is neese.paul@yahoo.com. I try to check it daily. I figure that someone here probably knows the answer to your question already. Later, Paul

[northlander]

Jim Baker's comments about the Precision barrel nut not being worth consideration does not hold water. When you take apart almost every Savage factory rifle you will see where the factory barrel nut is only making solid contact in three or four places, don't take my word for this, look at the factory barrel nuts you have laying around.

The externally threaded barrels match up to the internally threaded barrel nuts. If the barrel nut is warped at all it will cause an alignment issue for the barrel nut and the front surface of the recoil lug. As long as the barrel nut is not able to draw down square the resulting misalignment of the barrel nut will cause the barrel to set off from square with the action threads. Show of hands, how many of you have seen factory rifles with the barrel not centered in the barrel channel?

I have had at least 10 or more Savage shooters that have contacted me because their rifles shot so far to one side that they did not have enough scope adjustment to get them zeroed. At least two of the factory sponsored Savage Shooters have purchased recoil lugs and barrel nuts for their rifles to correct just this problem. I have not had a single shooter come back to me and say that their rifle was not made better, I did say better not perfect.

There are always going to be skeptics as to how much better you can make the receiver and barrel alignment. I have never had a single shooter advise me that these upgrades have not made an improvement in their rifles receiver/barrel alignment.

Jim Briggs
NSS

[devildogandboy]

i have noticed the uneven contact points on the factory barrel nuts and lugs, that's why i always replace them on a new build without exception! in my mind this has got to be an improvement of some degree when you have better contact between surfaces.

Bruce

[J.Baker]

Tommy, I may have been wrong about the strength of the firing pin spring. I had been working with 3 at one time. I got mine from Wolff sprin gs. They can probably tell you

what the original was and if they have any heavier. It seems that I went up 2 or 3 lbs. but can't be sure. It didn't make any difference on the bolt lift that I can tell. Maybe a

scale can tell you, but I can't

I bought a used Savage 116 for this project and yes it misfired about 10% of the time. I streached the firing pin spring about 1/2 or 3/4" and the misfiring stopped. I have no

idea how long that it might have been put up with the f. pin spring compressed. I always put my f.pins down. Snap caps are nice. In a bind you can make one by de-priming

a case and fitting a piece of dense rubber into the primer hole. I also glued mine in with H.D. (Marine ?)"Shoe Goo" (Walmart).


Jim, I double spaced just for you. Sorry that I

don't know where one paragraph ends and

another one starts. I hope that this helps

some anyway.

I haven't spoken to you in a while, you doing

OK? I guessed at where this paragraph

started, hope that I was right. Catch you

later Jim and I hope that I helped you some

Tommy. Y'all have a good one, Paul

Ahh yes, that's much better Paul;. LOL