243 for Moose

[bootarcher]

Everyone stating that a bow only produces less than a 100 pounds of energy and that a 243 produces more. Well you are comparing apples to oranges. A bow uses its energy for penetration and cutting causing massive blood loss. Where a bullet uses its energy to cause massive damage by the energy it releases and the shock it produces. My wife this year had a cow elk tag and she usually uses a 6.5x284 as her go to rifle. Well we moved this year and have had no room to reload in our tiny apartment, and ammo is way to expensive for that rifle and I wasn't about to buy any ammo for it. So we decided to use our 243 with 100 grain Nosler Partition. My wife shot a cow elk at 30 yards right behind the shoulder an absolute perfect shot and the bullet blew right through the cow. We watched the cow run off up the hill and then about 30 sec later she came running down the hill all wobbly legged and crashed 50 yards from us. Well we waited about 10 minutes gathering up our stuff and giving each other high fives. We started walking up to the elk and we were about 15 yards away and the cow jumped up and ran off. Well I immediately thought this isn't good. I decided it was a lethal hit and we would give the elk more time. We hiked 2 miles back to the truck and got my pack frame and hiked back in all it took us about 2 hours to get back with the pack frame to where my wife shot the elk. We started tracking the elk and had gone about 100 yards and we were seeing a decent amount of blood, when I heard an animal take of running. I got my wife in front of me and we were able to get to an opening and were lucky enough to see the cow standing in a opening about 50 yards away quartering away slightly and my wife fired and the elk ran off stumbled and went down for good. Upon further inspection of the elk when gutting it it had a perfect dime size hole through the lungs and about a quarter size exit hole so that tells me the bullet opened up. I came to the conclusion that there just wasn't enough energy and damage caused by the 100 grain Nosler Partition, and this elk suffered because we used a 243 on a elk, which I will never do again. Now a Moose is twice as large as a cow elk and I think your doing yourself an injustice to the animal by using a 243. Now a bow that is using a good broad head that has at least 55 pounds of kinetic energy would of killed my wife's elk with the same shot a whole lot faster than that 243 did. Just my opinion and experience.

[yobuck]

thanks for posting that. your an honest man. those type experiences being shared with others are what its all about
in my opinion. really good news tends to travel quickly. bad new has a way of not traveling at all.
now might i ask about the car? im guessing 46 or 47 maybe even 48 cadilac?

[JASmith]

bootarcher,

Thanks for that post. A partition bullet should weigh at least 150 to 170 grains to have a good chance of quickly bringing down a 1650 lb moose. Cows weigh less, but we should exercise some conservatism.

I thought I did not have image posting privileges, but Thomae showed me how to do it by sending this link: "You need to read this first: http://www.savageshooters.com/showth...man-can-do-it!"

Back to the thread:

The source of the recommendation is in this table (Note the "150 to 170" comes from the fuzzy nature of the underlying data and the fact that many moose weigh a lot less than 1650 lb):



You can read the basis for the table and weight recommendations here: Ideal Bullet Weight

[sniper15545]

Gotta get to the lungs first!

[Tim300wsm]

a less than perfect shot on a whitetail with a 243 means possible hours of tracking. if you have to ask if its possible its not responsible. as a hunter you owe the animal the quickest and most painless death. if you even slightly miss the perfect shot with a 243 than the animal WILL suffer.

[NOOTKA NICK]

Being on the ROCK, unless you are in the CITY a nos. partition at less than 75 yards should not be a problem boy!
lots of people using .30-30s (St.ANT .)

.303 same class as .30-06. I looks towards ya.

[limige]

Agree with what's been covered. Can you? Yes. Should you? No
I love my 6.5 cm. I've seen videos of people dropping large game such as bison and elk where it worked fantastic . But for me to go moose hunting ill have $1-2000 easily wrapped up into hunting and it can all come down to one shot at what could be the bull of a lifetime. Would you really want a 243 at that point ??

Personally I picked up a 300 wsm and plan to shoot barnes 175 lrx bullets.

But in moose country they will tell you, keep shooting till it goes down or you dont see it any longer. You want all the blood loss you can get. Dont worry about meat there's plenty there.

[yobuck]

where a person lives is meaningless when it comes to cartridge selection and shooting skills.
guides are hired for their knowledge of the area and the animals that reside there.
beyond that its best to be counting on yourself and your own knowledge and ability.
what locals use is often based on what they have not whats best.

[TC260]

what locals use is often based on what they have not whats best.

Yup. That and most locals I've known in different parts of the country that hunted with marginal rounds are head/neck shooters. Not because they're expert marksman but because they don't know any different. Hang around a public shooting range during sight-in season and the myth of these mysterious all-knowing "locals" gets exploded pretty quickly .

[JASmith]

Getting to "know' what rifle, cartridge, bullet combination is most sensible is a truly complicated pastime.

Yes, the 22 LR has been used to take rather large game animals. Yes, the .243 Win has been used by some to take moose, but it seems a lot of wounded animals are lost with this caliber. Some animals are also lost by users of large cartridges like the .375 Magnum.

The .243 Win takes what, in effect, is a lucky shot and precise marksmanship.

The .375 Mag takes a hit in the vital zone to have a high chance of quickly bringing the animal down. The vital zone on a moose is large, but all too many shooters of the .375 have not developed the shooting skills in the face of heavy recoil to have a reasonable chance of hitting the vital zone.

There is a happier middle ground where vital zone hits with a bullet will routinely take the animal down in a short time and the bullets are light enough that the average shooter can develop his or her shooting skills to regularly place shots in the vital zone.

Threshold bullet weights for moose are shown in the list below. The threshold, however, is rather fuzzily established because there is some randomness in the effect of even the largest hunting rounds. Nonetheless, these weights are the minimum (plus or minus 10%) that should be considered when 1650 lb moose are the hunting objective:

• Classic softpoint, including plastic tip: 225 grains
• Bonded Bullets: 200 grains
• Partition Bullets: 175 grains
• Lead free expanding bullets: 150 grains

The impact velocity for the bullet must be in the manufacturer's recommended range of velocities for the bullet chosen.

These weights explain why moose rifles are typically in the larger calibers and why modern bullet design adds confusion to choices of what makes sense.

Read more here: Ideal Bullet Weight

[NOOTKA NICK]

And the local yocals ON THE ROCK and here in B.C keep on getting their moose year after year with their LIGHT rifle rounds.
bigger caliber will not make up for poor marksmanship.
I think this thread is becoming a bit of a pissing contest
what works for one may not work for another. I wish everyone a good day. I am off to the range to try my NEW model. 1904 portugese mauser in the rare 6.5x58mm. only have until early September to work up a moose load. N.N

[Stockrex]

And the local yocals ON THE ROCK and here in B.C keep on getting their moose year after year with their LIGHT rifle rounds.
bigger caliber will not make up for poor marksmanship.
I think this thread is becoming a bit of a pissing contest
what works for one may not work for another. I wish everyone a good day. I am off to the range to try my NEW model. 1904 portugese mauser in the rare 6.5x58mm. only have until early September to work up a moose load. N.N

Well said, you haf theory vs practice, most people who hunt for the meat and don't pay an outfitter $5k and have a different mindset.
Having travelled out to parts of Asia where most families have a shot gun and probably 1 or 2 rifles, the rifle is most of the time a left over .303 or some vintage left over from the last "war". or even a .22. Next time you have a craving for some Filipino food or Laotian food (Pha) talk to the owner and they will tell you how they hunt elephants in that part of the world with a .22 caliber.

Anyway, what is reality of ELK hunting in CO, I was surprised to learn that most of the ELK is taken with a 243 and that is the preferred hunting caliber for the game wardens themselves.

There is no limit to how big a gun you can use to hunt squirrels. Most big guns will make you flinch in anticipation of the shot. Hence I love my browning BAR in 06, I can shot box of 180g partitions if different positions and keep them in a 4 inch box at 100 yrds and not cry at the end of day. it is very important for me to be comfortable with my gun and keep focused on the animal and take a shot quick if the opportunity arises.

Can a animal like Moose/Elk be taken with a 243 - Yes

[NOOTKA NICK]

STOCKREX, I believe for years the largest elk shot in Colorado (Black canyon) was shot with a borrowed .30-30. a fellow across the straight of Georgia from where we live(Knight Inlet) was a guide for grizzly and raised pigs. he always carried an old .30-30. another famous female guide for elk and grizzlyHEIDI GUTTFRIECH in HANCEVILLE north central B.C carried a .257 Roberts. SHE had several high powered rifles ,gifts from satisfied clients but favored the.257BOB. she was often mentioned in outdoor magazines some years back. I believe the piece missing in these posts is that people ,like myself shoot every week because of location. Some folks shoot mabe a few days before DEER season, the spend a week or two in the woods with a firearm that's not seen daylight since the previous fall hunting season. Its akin to using a screwdriver or a chainsaw, you need to be very familiar to be able to use it correctly. Cheers

[Vince]

Will a .243/6mm kill a moose?
Yes.
Is the .243/6mm optimal for moose hunting?
No.
Would I use a .243/6mm for moose?
Maybe.

[rednekhuntr]

I hunt moose in northern Ontario, one of the older fellas in our group uses a .243 with core locts. I e seen him drop quite a few moose with it. He's an excellent shot and waits for a broadside.
That being said I use a 111 in 300 winmag with 180 grain federal blue box. Premium bullets work, but aren't necessary

[NOOTKA NICK]

I hunt moose in northern Ontario, one of the older fellas in our group uses a .243 with core locts. I e seen him drop quite a few moose with it. He's an excellent shot and waits for a broadside.
That being said I use a 111 in 300 winmag with 180 grain federal blue box. Premium bullets work, but aren't necessary

WELCOME R.N.H back in the 60s I lived in MARATHON and worked at the mine in MANITOUAGE. Old fellow that took me hunting out your way used an old SAVAGE lever action in that anemic .303SAVAGE round........ guess what, it killed a moose stone dead after it made that 50 yard dash!!! no moose on Vancouver island but ELK on a lottery draw or lots of BIG blackbear.......I also have a FCXP3 IN .300WIN MAG. and if I hunt on the upper east side of the island, coast or Nimpkish valley,i carry that rifle stoked with hornady 220gr.roundnose because we have grizzly there now. any where else I may carry the .300 but more likely my scoped .44mag early model ruger carbine or a factory refurbished Italian carcano rifle in 6.5x52mm with hornady 160gr.roundnose CRUISE MISSLES or another carcano in 6.5x54 MS..... it will drop an elephant so a big blackbear is in dire straights if I have him in my sites.. why would I NOT carry that rifle in the grizzly territory?????? WTF I may have my opinions but I am NOT nuts!!!!!!!!!!!!! I want to live long enough to capture a SASQUATCH!!!!! some years back the our old premier/ Govenor made it ILLEGAL to shoot any great ape /SASQUATCH in the wilds..........but they may be captured if unharmed and turned over to the provincial wildlife department!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Xbolt]

Keep your shots under 150 yards and use primium bullets (partition,ttsx, aframe to name a few) and heaviest u can find but I suggest 270 win or 308 as a minimum

[NOOTKA NICK]

Update, 6.5x52 carcano...120gr.nosler hunting ballistic tip = 83 LAZER MEASURED yards just under 300lb.vancouver island black bear..........early November central B.C. young bull moose
1904 Portuguese mauser 6.5x58mm 120gr.ballastic huntingtip/nosler....just over 100yards open sites neck shot moose stumbled on its feet, back end dropped and down it went.... still alive when approached ..put another round back of head........dead.............. partner DID have my back with a .300 WSM just like hunting grizzly,JUST IN CASE.......... lots of advice probably by most whom have never even seen a SWAMP DONKEY........but that's just an old mans humble opinion who really does not care too much what all the EXPERTS have to say ......... p.s. looking to take my 2nd. blackbear with a model 84 11 mm mauser(.43 cal)

[Rooster 50]

For the record Nick the Elk you mention from Colorado was shot by John Plute with a 30/40 Krag. It was shot in some of the blackest timber i have ever seen and i have hunted that area.
I doubt that the shot was over 100yards but I can't say for sure.

[D.ID]

What can be done and what should be done are very different.
What some one that had no choice was able to do or had to do is not really relevant.
.
Grandpa may have walked 40 miles to school in two feet of snow, uphill both ways...............I think I'm going to drive anyway, because I can.

[foxx]

what can be done and what should be done are very different.
What some one that had no choice was able to do or had to do is not really relevant.
.
Grandpa may have walked 40 miles to school in two feet of snow, uphill both ways...............i think i'm going to drive anyway, because i can.

lol