10" Gong from 857 Yards.... Tips, tricks, suggestions?

[SageRat Shooter]

Hi Guys,

So, I took my .260 out this weekend and setup my 10" gong @ 857 Yards. Decided to shoot out of the Bed of my truck as I had some old rock mounds that were blocking my view of my target. Fired 14 rounds total and if the gong was a living, breathing critter, I'd have given it a heart attack from scaring it to death. I didn't get a hit this time, but I was dang close (I know horseshoes and hand grenades)...

Looking for any tips or suggestions from you long range guys out there as to what I should be looking to change in my setup. I'm pretty sure I need to get out of the truck bed and down to the ground, but anything other suggestions you might have I'd like to hear.

I also was having a bit of a problem getting my rear bag steady and with enough elevation to keep my crosshairs on target (I'm figuring this to be the biggest issue?) but this was only my first attempt at anything over 450 yards, so I'm not sure if I'm missing something that you veteran shooters might be willing to share??

Thanks,

[Evlshnngns]

Group size at 450?

[SageRat Shooter]

Group size at 450?

Just over an inch spread. 2 shots 2 hits 12 mph winds (cold bore)... 1/4 MOA roughly.

[gbflyer]

I don’t have a ton of experience.

What I do with a load or setup I’m just starting with is verify at 300 to make sure my come up/wind from Strelock / MD Ballistics is right and dialed in. If I go past that to start with, I usually waste a lot of ammo. Then I go to 600, dial up again and verify. If that goes well then I’m happy to stretch it out. If I find that my scope is tracking correctly/BC number for the load is right I can then start at a longer range the next time out.

Hope that makes sense. It’s really fun to ring steel that far away.

[yobuck]

Well recently Lonewolf made a comment on the thread about action truing that was spot on in my opinion.
To summarize, his comment would add up to ( learn how to do it,) and that dosent always mean shooting smaller groups.
Even 1moa accuracy is good enough to hit that plate (without wind issues), pretty consistently.
Id bet that every shooter on this site could do that with the right setup.
The right setup wont be laying on the ground or in a pickup bed using a bipod at those type distances.
Ok for Lonewolf, or others who have worked hard at it, but not for average Joe occaisional shooter.
My advice would be to change your shooting setup if you want faster easier results.

[LoneWolf]

If your rear bag is too small and requires too much tension to get steady then you may need one that is both larger and stiffer. One of my favorites for a long time was a simple old pair of boot socks with a bag of rice in them. I now use a Reasor Precision Game changer bag pretty much universally regardless of where it is supporting the rifle. Shooting out of a truck bed is not the problem. Getting steady (even in the prone) can sometimes be tough. Correct bipod height and rear bag combo play into this equation. Were you missing consistently? high/low or left right? If you were all over then it is most likely due to the shooting position you built. Figure out to get rid of the wobble and you will find the target gets easier to hit/spot misses, and adjust accordingly.

[SageRat Shooter]

Thanks LW!!

I was having a very difficult time getting my rifle setup so my natural POA was on the target, but as I mentioned it just wasn't working that day, as it was the first time I'd even been to the shooting site. It was "a first run" and a kind of discovery trip figuring out what works and what won't. I never really felt relaxed because of having to manipulate the rear bag constantly (used sweatshirt under my bag to raise elevation enough, but then it would wobble left or right when I shot, and I also felt like I couldn't keep my reticle as still as I normally do... Probably because I was not relaxed from having to manipulate my POA. Out of the 14 shots, most of them were just left of target with one or 2 being right of target, but that was wind gusts and a bad trigger pull. My elevation was pretty good although not perfect as I never got on plate at 857 yards. I have trued my app at 450 yards though. I was shooting across a canyon and the wind was doing really funky things in the draws/ridges... Quite different then the consistent wind in the PD fields...

Even though I wasn't successful this time, I was still pretty happy with how I shot given that I'd never shot past 450-500 yards before, and with all the things discussed above that were working against me, I still scared the thing to death... I always appreciate your input/suggestions.

Thanks Again,

SRS

[LoneWolf]

Some people make long range shooting sound like this big complicated event... (Yes I shoot thousands of rounds a year and normally go through a barrel or 2), but it's all fundamentals. Using the right gear to get stable and applying the fundamentals. If you are not stable you can't be precise. Dry fire, rebuild the position, and practice it so you learn what "right" is.

Couple of my buddies hitting on the fundamentals of prone. They are putting together a solid series if you care to check them out.

https://youtu.be/m_YGOUghmZY

[SageRat Shooter]

LW,

Your Link is just black space... can you repost it perhaps?

[LoneWolf]

LW,

Your Link is just black space... can you repost it perhaps?

I edited it with just the link since it doesn't seem to want to drop the video in the post.

[Stumpkiller]

So, I took my .260 out this weekend and setup my 10" gong @ 857 Yards. Decided to shoot out of the Bed of my truck as I had some old rock mounds that were blocking my view of my target.

Back up the truck 400 yards. ;-)

Shoot at a larger target face to establish the center of your group at that range. Then adjust your scope. Then: practice, practice, practice.

It is a combination of natural talent, acquired skill, equipment choice and load development. Work on #2 & #4 because you're born with or without #1 and you already have #3.

[LoneWolf]

Back up the truck 400 yards. ;-)

Shoot at a larger target face to establish the center of your group at that range. Then adjust your scope. Then: practice, practice, practice.

It is a combination of natural talent, acquired skill, equipment choice and load development. Work on #2 & #4 because you're born with or without #1 and you already have #3.

The only natural talent involved is eye sight and ability to sit still..... other than that it can all be learned/practiced.

[SageRat Shooter]

Thanks guys,

You have confirmed for me what I was thinking... Just good to hear it from those who have succeeded before me. I will definitely keep practicing... Thanks for the video with the tips too LW.

[Stumpkiller]

I qualified the variables. I didn't quantify them. ;-)


PS - Brilliant choice of caliber. My current favorite (if 1:8" or faster). :first:

[SageRat Shooter]

I qualified the variables. I didn't quantify them. ;-)


PS - Brilliant choice of caliber. My current favorite (if 1:8" or faster). :first:


It is an 8 twist... I spent 2 years researching which way I wanted to go... 6.5 Creedmoor or .260 Remington.... I was always leaning more towards the .260 because of 260 Rips on youtube... First time I saw him hit a rabbit at 1000 yards had me going..... "You have got to be kidding me!!"

I just want to be able to do that too.... :thumb:

[LoneWolf]

I went with the 6.5x47. All 3 are just as capable as the other when using proper reloading techniques. As long as you shoot a 140 with a good BC between 2700-2850 or a 130 between 2850-2950 you will have no problem accomplishing that with practice. I didn't take enough ammo and was shooting from the ground instead of up in the tower that would have canceled out the mirage better as well as make spotting impacts much easier, also was given the incorrect distance of 2100yds. When the target was at 2122yards. But target was a full size IPSC and I got within an IPSC of it within 5 shots, but needed my ammo for the match the next 2 days of the weekend. Good loads, Good data, and application of the fundamentals. Just keep practicing and learning and if you have a question throw it up like you did today.

Something you can do to test your reloads is to set up a target between 600-700yds, put a fresh coat of white paint on it, and then put a horizontal "water line" across the center. Use the water line as your vertical hold and a target that's wide enough to cancel out wind if it's a particular windy day. The point of this is to test 2 things, 1. the data your calculator is providing for that distance. 2. The vertical spread being produced by your reloads. Your vertical spread typically correlates to the Standard Deviation (SD) and Extreme Spread (ES) collected by a chronograph (I prefer the Magnetospeed Chrono's). Having good consistent reloads produces lower SD/ES's which correlates to more consistency down range as well as more accurate data produced by the calculator. This is how the serious guys work as it increases the hit ratio of the weapon system and puts all the work on the trigger puller.

Do you need to get into all that in order to be successful in the beginning.... Nope, but I can tell you once I started tying it all together my hit ratio began increasing dramatically.

[SageRat Shooter]

LW,

That's just Awesome!! I haven't gotten down the rabbit hole quite that far YET... but I'm sure I'll get there, as the perfectionist in me will want to have a hit every time I pull the trigger... My barrel has gained some speed in the last 100 rounds and now I'm getting in the 2850 FPS ballpark according to my Strelok app when I trued @ 450 yards. When I first got it, I was just barely getting 2750 FPS and I'm shooting the 143 ELD-X bullet (G7=.315 G1=.625)

Because of the recent gain in MV, I'm actually considering dropping my load back .2 grains or so to get me 2800 FPS... My primers are pretty flat when the temp gets above 51 degrees or so. I was only ever trying to get to the 2800 FPS mark anyway. I'm a little hesitant about it, because the load shoots so well, and I don't want to mess it up... It took me about 200 rounds of load development and testing different powders to find this load...

[Robinhood]

this time of year in these parts mirage and wind is a killer. Flags and back that power back to 16X or play with parallax to focus in front of the target to help read the mirage. depending on the light sometimes it helps me.

[yobuck]

Wind flags aren't a reality in the terrain type situation where the op was shooting.
But a spotter, meaning a person watching him shoot and seeing the hits, would have helped him a lot.
I feel that if the truck was at a poor angle to the target, it was at least part of his problem.
When using a bipod, i prefer sitting the gun on my bench and aligning it on the target.
Then without moving the gun, align myself behind it.
I think a bipod can offer a false sence of security as for proper body angle to the target.
But reality is that it isn't much different than conventional prone shooting in that regard.
No muscle effort should be required to align the gun on the target, if the body is at the proper angle behind it.
This is a major reason why many long range hunters use a bench or other types of rest.
It isn't better and certainly not more solid than the ground, but movement is easier, and theres also less weeds and brush in your face.
Frankly standing behind it rather than sitting or just kneeling on the ground is even better when hunting because of it being easier to stay aligned behind the gun, and it also gets you away from the obstacles more.
I frankly rarely use a bipod when hunting. On my setup the gun never moves for traversing, only up and down via a crank on a fast thread rod supporting the front cradle.
For traversing, the whole top rotates very smoothly 360 deg if necessary. But since the gun dosent move, the top itself is very small.
Its just easier to move around behind it in order to stay on the animal if it rapidly moves off to a different location following a shot.
That's simply not always possible when shooting off the ground.
But if shooting from ones belly is important to them, then best spend some prep time at the locations with a pick, shovel and brush cutters.
The new battery powered saws can be handy also, and very quiet.

[SageRat Shooter]

Yobuck,

You are correct about the truck being at a poor angle as well as not being level... In fact, I was so canted that my crosshairs looked like they leaned over to about 2 o'clock... I trusted my bubble level (telling me I was level, even though it looked canted to the right so badly). I confirmed when I got home that my bubble level was "Correct" by using my plum line. My Pop was spotting for me, but his eye sight at 74 isn't the greatest. I had to use muscle effort to elevate the butt of my rifle to get reticle on target. Created a lot of "bouncing" of my reticle I don't normally have. I had a streamer ribbon tied to my gong stand so I could see wind direction.... I had some wind gusts though and wind would be different angles when it gusted as it shot straight up the canyon wall.
I plan on taking the shovel and perhaps a pick the next time I go, so I can build my spot the way I want it. I'll get on plate the next time, I'm pretty sure.