7mm08 Accuracy

[gunrack]

I am having trouble getting acceptable accuracy on paper with my 7mm08 with any factory ammo. It just will not shoot the 140 gr stuff from any manufacturer that I can find so I started re-loading. It's still giving me fits but I did find a load that is finally not key holing when it hits the paper. I don't know what to think about it. I've had some say that it was the burn rate of my powder making them do that but I don't know. If it was the burn rate of the powder why does the factory stuff do it? I was of the thought that it was the twist rate of my barrel. My rifle is only a year old and was lead to believe it was a 9 twist if this is the case should it shoot the heavier bullets better, right? The only load I can find that will shoot near an inch is 160 gr speer spritzers, over 40 grains of IMR4320, .015" off the lands, with Winchester LR primers.

Any input would be greatly appreciated.

[JW]

If the twist is actually 9, you should have no problem shooting 140 bullets
I would check the twist to make sure it is 1 in 9, if it is not lighter bullets (120 gr) might be your answer
If it is 1 in 9, sounds like your barrel has a problem and I would be contacting Savage

Jack

[LongRange]

What other powders have you tried? 4320 is a little fast you might want to try something in the 4350 to 4831 burn rate.

[gunrack]

I just measured the twist and the best I can come up with is 1:9.5" and there could be some error in that measurement.

[gunrack]

None other than the 4320. Going to a gun show today and will look for some other powders.

[LongRange]

Look for some imr or H4350 H4831 and or RL-17 and clean your barrel, get all the carbon out and most of the copper. Is this a hunting or target riffle?

[gunrack]

Look for some imr or H4350 H4831 and or RL-17 and clean your barrel, get all the carbon out and most of the copper. Is this a hunting or target riffle?

It's a hunting rifle and kills deer no problem. I just want to get the most accuracy I can out of it.

Bryan

[LongRange]

Gotcha...try some nosler and maybe some sierra game kings and skip the RL-17....a lotta guys claim the RL-17 gives them problems with drastic temp changes...I personally have never experienced the temp issues with the RL line of powders. And im sure you know this but once that riffle shoots tiny groups dont clean it if your close to a hunt.

[gunrack]

If the twist is actually 9, you should have no problem shooting 140 bullets
I would check the twist to make sure it is 1 in 9, if it is not lighter bullets (120 gr) might be your answer
If it is 1 in 9, sounds like your barrel has a problem and I would be contacting Savage

Jack
I measured the twist and it appears to be a 9 or 9.5 depending on the error in the cleaning rod method. Thought there would be more of a science to reloading but It appears to be like shooting.....hit or miss. LOL I picked powders and bullet weights that the book says will work and loaded them to the T. Sized the brass and made sure the bullets were seated correctly, IDK?

[olddav]

gun rack,
What is the load that performed the best with the 140gr bullets?

[gunrack]

gun rack,
What is the load that performed the best with the 140gr bullets?

Off the shelf rem stuff.

[olddav]

I had a 223 that would shoot 69 grain factory bullets but any hand loads I produced with 69 grain bullets would keyhole. I assumed that I could not reproduce the speed of the factory rounds, so I abandoned the 69 grain bullets. One point that may be worth noting is I was using a fast powder. Don't know if this is helpful seeing how you said that you can load 160 grain bullets that perform fairly well.

[gunrack]

I think that is the case but I can't get any powder for a few days. I am shooting IMR4320 which is listed in the book but several have told me I am shooting too fast of a powder. It did not shoot the 140 stuff good which is why I started hand loading. The 140 stuff would shoot 2" groups but I managed to get 160" bullets with the IMR4320 to shoot 1.0 inch. I am going to get some 4350 as soon as I can get some. I went to a gun show today and there was not one grain of powder or stray bullet in the whole stinking show that was not ready made.

[JW]

Fort Thompson in North Little Rock was stocked full with powder a few weeks ago

[darkker]

Yikes we have a mess of a thread here.
We need a lot more info, and a lot more very specific wording from you.

You have been loose with descriptions and phrases. Does EVERYTHING(factory also) you've shot keyhole, or only the bulk of your reloads? Do things keyhole, or is it a fine deer killer? You've said both.

Twist rate means absolutely nothing without velocity. Not sure what book told you to use that powder, but it is VERY fast for a 160 class bullet. What is your velocity, not what a book told you, YOUR velocity? That will answer whether or not the keyhole issue is due to stabilization, or bore issues. What specific factory ammo have you shot? Weights, amounts, brands?

The most important things haven't gotten asked above your specific load troubles, is your equipment. What is the status of your trigger? Weight, creep, let-off, consistency? Is your barrel floated? Is the stock properly secured, what is the quality and state of your optics and mounts?
If absolutely NO ammo, factory or otherwise works; something else is going on. You say this has been for a year now, surely you haven't tolerated an abysmal rifle and not double checked any of these things in that amount of time?

Love to help, but need some more specific info first :)

[gunrack]

Yikes we have a mess of a thread here.
We need a lot more info, and a lot more very specific wording from you.

You have been loose with descriptions and phrases. Does EVERYTHING(factory also) you've shot keyhole, or only the bulk of your reloads? Do things keyhole, or is it a fine deer killer? You've said both.

Twist rate means absolutely nothing without velocity. Not sure what book told you to use that powder, but it is VERY fast for a 160 class bullet. What is your velocity, not what a book told you, YOUR velocity? That will answer whether or not the keyhole issue is due to stabilization, or bore issues. What specific factory ammo have you shot? Weights, amounts, brands?

The most important things haven't gotten asked above your specific load troubles, is your equipment. What is the status of your trigger? Weight, creep, let-off, consistency? Is your barrel floated? Is the stock properly secured, what is the quality and state of your optics and mounts?
If absolutely NO ammo, factory or otherwise works; something else is going on. You say this has been for a year now, surely you haven't tolerated an abysmal rifle and not double checked any of these things in that amount of time?

Love to help, but need some more specific info first :)

Sorry for the confusion darkker291509,

The barrel is floated, the action is pillar bedded, and the trigger is right at 2 lbs (on the light side with slight creep but very consistent) the scope and mounts are secure. I have no idea what the velocity is because I do not have a chronograph and do not know anyone within an hours drive of me that does. The factory ammo I have shot is the Remington 140 grain SP, the Winchester 140 grain, and the Federal Fusion 140 grain. As far as bullet choices on these loads the are all what the various manufactures use in their factory ammo all of them have been soft point. The factory ammo did key hole.

The 160 grain speer spritzer's that I loaded with the 40 grains of IMR4320 do not Key hole and the POA vs the POI are very close. I wish I had taken pictures of the groups so you guys could see them but I did not. However, it was obvious this load was hitting the paper as they should. I probably got lucky with that load and landed in some weird window where things just worked out but that is not what I am looking for and is why I asked for help. I am using a Lee Loading Manual if that helps.

If the Lee is not good enough what are the best manual to use?

Bryan

[olddav]

I missed the part about factory ammo producing a keyhole, and can not wait to see whats causing this!

[LongRange]

Ive found the lee book lists loads quite a bit higher than most of the bullet makers books but I also think the bullet makers load date is conservative. The nosler book is right about where the lee book is so personally I think your ok using the lee book just work up slow if your getting toward the max loads. Also like I said I think your riffle will preform better with a little slower burning powder. Key holing is usually caused by not enough velocity, gas escaping from one side of the barrel or shooting to heavy a bullet for the barrel, and im sure there are a few others. Try cleaning the barrel real good it you havent and if it continues have a smith bore scope the barrel or replace it.

Also you said the riffle is only a year old? Did you buy it new or used?

[olddav]

Does the bullet fit into the muzzle of the barrel?
I realize this is a long shot but could the barrel be over sized (bored incorrectly)?

[NVBighorn]

Try some Speer 130 grainers or Hornady 139s. Get some IMR4064. Very middle of the road stable powder. Go back to the basic standard OAL. If you can't get them to shoot there is a problem. If you can get them to shoot then start tweaking ONE variable at a time. You have too many things going on to draw any conclusions.
Just MHO.