Cleaning my McGowen

[319]

I have put 45 rounds through my McGowen Premier Match 6.5X284 Norma barrel, and while I am extremely happy with the accuracy, I am scratching my head over the cleaning. I have never had a barrel so hard to get perfectly clean!! I am using about 100 patches after each 15 rounds. I know about most of the "break in" methods, but I just don't have the time, nor the right conditions to do 1 clean 1 clean ect. I have never broken in any of my "hunting" rifles, and none have ever taken so long to clean. Any ideas? I use Hoppe's 9, Barnes CR-10, and Tiptons Truely Remarkable solvents. My hand lapped Lilja .223 cleaned up with 11 patches, are the non lapped bores really that much harder to clean? If so how do I go about lapping my bore, or can I just use the bullets with the lapping compound on them? Maybe I just don't know how to clean a rifle??

[desertdog]

McGowan barrels are hand lapped? have a few McGowan barrels they shoot great. just shoot it and let your groups tell you when you need to clean. that's what i do. but everybody is not the same??

[319]

No, Mcgowen barrels are not hand lapped, at least not that I know of. My LILJA barrel is. I guess I have always been condtioned to clean my rifle when I get back from the range, especially with a new barrel. I want to get all the fouling out before I shoot again.

[viper9696]

[quote][Made from only certified 416R Rifle Barrel steel, button rifled and hand-lapped to ensure consistency and ease of cleaning.
/quote]

from Mcgowens website
http://www.mcgowenbarrel.com/catalog2.htm

I would call them.

[82boy]

McGowan barrels are lapped.
Trow away the Hoppe's, Barnes, and Tipton solvents. Use a bronze brush, and a GOOD solvent like shooters Choice, Butch bore shine, or Montana extreme. Let them sit in the bore and work for a few minutes.

Why must you get all the fouling out? When to shoot groups, most likely you are going to shoot fouling shots, to get the barrel to settle down. There is a point to where a barrel is clean enough, and anymore than that is just wear and tear.

[319]

Holy crap, isn't hand lapping supposed to make things easier to clean???? At least that is what it says in the quote! I am just going to let a sleeping dog lie on this one. I have never shot groups before like I am getting at 100yds out of this one. I guess I will have to live with buying 1000 patches every other month.

Call them???? Are you kidding? I have called them 3 times on my .260 barrel I have never received a call back.

82boy, it is interesting you bring up the bronze brush. I have read and been told never to use a brush of any kind. A jag with a patch and never scrub back and forth. Some guys don't even pull the jag back through the bore, they unscrew it every time. I have also been told that this is a bunch of crap, and use a brush and scrub the bore with the patched jag. How does a guy know what to follow?


How are the solvents I use any different from the solvents you listed? I have never used them so just curious. Thanks for the info!!!

[82boy]

Lets put it this way.
Starting with the solvents, some have better chemicals that others. Hoppe's as absolutely worthless, the only thing it is good for is cologne. (Back 30 years ago it was good, they removed a chemical (I believe it was benzene) do to EPA standards, and it has not been the same.) A solvent needs to have copper, and carbon cutting property's.

On a bronze brush, Steel is hard, and if a soft bronze brush can hurt it, then firing a bullet would completely destroy it. This is an old wives tale. Not using a quality one piece rod, and a bore guide is what destroys barrels

You ask how can you know what to do. I offer you this; got to a competition shooting match, and watch the shooters clean there rifles. In benchrest they stride for the ultimate accuracy, and a high majority of shooters clean there rifles after each round (Basically after 5 to 10 shots) I have never see anyone that removes a brush, at the end of a muzzle. Majority of shooters I know use a bronze brush, and pull it back and forth. I can say in my experience that I use a bronze brush, and have shot thousands of rounds, without any notice loss in accuracy.

In the end it is all personal preference, some like Ford some like Chevy and some like Toyota. Find what works for you .

[319]

I wish I could, but I don't know of any shooting comps in my area, at least not any closer than 90 miles. I would love to check one out!

[Slowpoke Slim]

319,

I have the exact same barrel on my target action. You do not need to clean it that frequent. The last time I had it out, I shot my best 5 shot group ever with that barrel. I was load testing another bullet, and my best group was a 5 shot, one hole group that was shot numbers 40-45 of a 50 shot cycle. All 50 test loads were fired without cleaning the barrel.

I use Butch's Bore Shine in mine. I've started using a chamber plug (Sinclair's sells them), and standing the rifle up and literally filling the bore full of Butch's, and letting it stand for like 30-45 minutes, then dumping the solvent out and 4-5 dry patches down the barrel and it's clean. I like this method, as usually when I'm back from the range, I have 3 or 4 rifles to clean, and I use the same method on all of them. This way, no matter how many or how few rounds down the barrel, they all get clean with minimal scrubbing.

If I'm shooting it a LOT, then maybe every 40-50 rounds I'll run a couple of wet patches and a few dry patches after. You need a better solvent. The foaming cleaners are great too. I've also used Shooter's Choice, but last time I bought solvent, I found the large jugs of Butch's, so I'm using that one now.

I still use Hoppe's to wipe down the outside of my blued guns to get the finger prints off of them, and to wipe the sharpie ink off of my brass casings ( I write powder charges and other relevant info on the casings when I'm running test loads), but that's ALL I use it for. I agree it's worthless for a bore cleaner.

[lostart]

does anyone use the birchwood casey dual action solvent. (nitro and copper)? I got some and I think that i could do alot better. Im goin to try that shooters choice.

[Hutch]

Just recently tried the Shooters Choice. I must say I am very impressed with it's ability to clean a factory savage barrel. It no longer takes an hour of scrubbin an cursin. I am sold on Shooters Choice. I've also used Butche's Bore Shine with great results.

Brushes are good. But, use the good nylon one's "if" you decide to use a copper solvent.



Hutch

[319]

So does the fact that I only get a chance to shoot once every 10-20 days change any thing? With my work schedule and 7mo old son I don't get to shoot as much as I would like. Is it ok to shoot 15 or so and let it sit for that long without cleaning? I am picking up some different solvent and may check on a chamber plug as I just saw them in my Sinclair catalog. I was always told not to let solvent sit in my rifles for any length of time. Looks like I need to relearn every thing!! Oh, well, the day you stop learning is the day you stop breathing!

[82boy]

So does the fact that I only get a chance to shoot once every 10-20 days change any thing?

Wow, must be nice to shoot that much! I don't shoot much more than you do. It is sad basically the only time I get to shoot is at matches, I hardly have time to shoot in between. Most of the match's I shoot in are once a month. So most times I shoot every 30 days. With my custom barrel guns I clean at the range, usually after every 10 or 20 rounds. With my Factory Savage barreled guns, I find they shoot best dirty, and I don't clean them until accuracy drops off. (Could be a few months between cleanings.)

Most hunting rifles don't get cleaned until hunting season is over, (could be a couple of months) because of the animals sensitivity to the harsh solvents. These guns don't seem to complain or act hurt.

My 22 rim fires are never cleaned, at best I may pull a bore rope through them. I only clean them when accuracy drops off, or I change brands of ammo. It may be years or decades between cleanings.

In old times when corrosive primers was used, I would say that a gun had to be cleaned after firing. If I shoot military guns, with surplus ammo, you better believe it gets cleaned the second after I am done shooting. Black powder is another one I would not let sit dirty. Most bore solvents work there best when they are allowed to sit in the barrels. Some bore solvents state not to let sit longer than 15 minutes such as Sweets 7.62. Again I don't thing I would let a chrome lined, or military rifle barrel sit with solvent in it. I would still not let any barrel with any solvent sit longer than overnight.

The thing is with the new modern powder, and primers, and well made barrels found on a savage rifle, and the better made solvents on the markets today, It is really hard to screw up a barrel. You risk doing more damage shooting them, or using a cleaning rod than from the solvents.

My advise is clean at the range, it keeps the smell out of the house, and the mess as well. Just remember there is a point when a barrel is clean enough and anything more is just overkill.

[Slowpoke Slim]

Butch's Bore Shine says you can leave the solvent in the bore for extended periods. I have left it in for hours at a time with no problems. If your solvent has any ammonia in it (like Sweets does - read your bottle), then that is TOTALLY different, and I would not leave it in for more than 10-15 minutes and dry patch it several times, then "rinse" with something harmless (like Hoppe's #9, about the only other thing I'll use it for), then dry patch again several times and light oil patch (like Break Free or similar).

The easiest way I've found to clean is with the chamber plugs. The second easiest is with the foaming cleaners, which I think are best for factory Savage barrels that may be rough or other wise "hard" to clean.

[Rooster 50]

I like the Bore Tech products. and when I am lazy a foaming cleaner. The trick I have found is to get the gross fouling out and then scrub it good with a bronze brush and then just let it set or fill it with a foam of some kind. The more I do this the less I want to run thru my barrels. I try to let the chemicals do the cleaning instead of me.

Having said all that I would recomment to the OP here that you need to use a few treatments of JB bore paste to smooth your barrel out. take a worn out brush saturate a patch with JB and scrub the crap out of it. You won't hurt it a darned bit and it will clean up better each time you do this. Remember tho you still need to get the gross fouling out first.


Just my 2 cents and I don't need for anyone to agree or disagree. It's what I do. BTW I heard the other day that Bore Tech is coming out with their own version of a mildly abrasive product similar to Rem Bore or JB

[pa hog]

I'm shooting a McGowen 250AI, I use Bore Tech Eliminator exclusively- 3 Wet patches/Brush 10-15 times with a tight fitting NYLON brush/3 Wet patches/ Let sit 3-5 Minutes/Push dry patches thru until they come out clean. No smell,works well on all barrels. I use Shooters Choice too but not very often anymore, Bore Tech does everything it does,but better with no smell.

[319]

Thanks to all for the info! My wife picked up some Butch's for me this afternoon, so I can give that a shot after my next trip to the range. I have a bunch of nylon brushes so I will be using them along with the Butch's.

If I shoot military guns, with surplus ammo, you better believe it gets cleaned the second after I am done shooting.

My father was a Vet and he is the one who taught me about cleaning my rifles. He used Hoppe's and Sheath, but as I have learned that must have been before the formula for Hoppe's changed.

Having said all that I would recomment to the OP here that you need to use a few treatments of JB bore paste to smooth your barrel out.

I will give this a shot. I doubt my local store has any, but I suppose I can wait a few days for it to arrive in the mail. Is there any special cleaning instructions for getting the JB out after scrubbing?

Again, thanks to every one for the info, I really appreciate it!

[Rooster 50]

This might make some people cringe but I only do it a couple time when they are new. or if I just cannot get something to come clean. keep in mind I use a bore scope religiously so clean is CLEAN.

I wil wrap the JB patch around the brush and after shortstroking the barrel down and back at least 3 times. I put a DRY patch over a pointed jag one caliber smaller and do the same thing with it.

Then I will take gunscrubber and spay it down the barrel followed by a dry patch and if it does not come out white on the second patch I wet one with M-Pro 7 and make a few passes then back to the dry patch.

This will ALWAYS remove those stubborn streaks of copper and also ANY carbon that does not want to break up.

One thought about carbon. Since I started using Bore Tech Carbon cutter it is not the problem it used to be. I always start with it on a soft bronze brush and then let it soak to "break up" the carbon. Then another pass with the same stuff. It just flat works. Nuff Said

[desertdog]

whats wrong with jb?

[GUNFANATIC]

I have put 45 rounds through my McGowen Premier Match 6.5X284 Norma barrel, and while I am extremely happy with the accuracy, I am scratching my head over the cleaning. I have never had a barrel so hard to get perfectly clean!! I am using about 100 patches after each 15 rounds. I know about most of the "break in" methods, but I just don't have the time, nor the right conditions to do 1 clean 1 clean ect. I have never broken in any of my "hunting" rifles, and none have ever taken so long to clean. Any ideas? I use Hoppe's 9, Barnes CR-10, and Tiptons Truely Remarkable solvents. My hand lapped Lilja .223 cleaned up with 11 patches, are the non lapped bores really that much harder to clean? If so how do I go about lapping my bore, or can I just use the bullets with the lapping compound on them? Maybe I just don't know how to clean a rifle??

BOY, DID YOU OPEN A HORNET'S NEST! ::) Notice how many different opinions there are about what solvents to use. JB, no JB.

You got some good solvent now. Just remember that it's not as critical to clean that barrel after every trip to the range. I know what you mean though. I think most of us were trained to keep our guns clean after we shot em. I know I had to retrain myself to not be so anal about it. ;D