In need of some advice

[RyanG]

As I have stated in a couple of other threads I am going to start my first build on a 110 flat long action here shortly. I have decided that I want to build a 264 Win Mag. The action that I have has a standard bolt head on it for large rifle, I think that its a 270 actually. I am going to need to change the bolt head to a mag. I see that places like Midway have them (on back order) listed for 23 bucks. SSS has them listed for 60+ What is the difference between the two? And how do you tell about the firing pin hole size? Large or small?

I do know that I am going to replace the bolt body to a fluted one just not sure what one as of yet and new tactical bolt handle.

Oh and while I am thinking about it.... the recoil lug.... what is the desired one out there? Thickness etc. Thanks guys!

Ryan

[scythefwd]

who are you going with on the barrel? I ordered my lug at the same time as my barrel through Jim Briggs over at Northland Shooters Supply (one of those links at the top of the page).

[scope eye]

264 Winmag a man after my own heart, Brownel's has them I just got two of them myself, I truly feel putting a machine recoil lug on an action that has not been trued, is like washing your feet and putting your dirty socks back on, in machining all touching faces must be trued or it is all in vain, that means "the nut the lug and they action" that's just machining 101 basics.

FYI an 85gr Sierra HP with 70gr of Hybrid will launch at 4000 FPS and not tax your brass.

Tanks Dean

[scope eye]

I got mine from Mcgowen It's is a 10 twist 26 inch SS varmint and could not be happier.

Dean

[scythefwd]

scope.. that makes sense, but at the same time.. the machined lug is thicker, has less distortion (not just around the reciever, but where the nub is stamped in it), and may still be a proper fit. Mine fits perfectly flush with my reciever and barrel nut, which is also trued.

[RyanG]

Ok now I have even more to think about! THANKS!!!!! I read about the truing of the action on here but Im not sure what that really does? I also was reading in my Sierra manual this morning that the 264 can be hard to reload for because of short throats and long bullets. But the Sierra manual is the only one that says anything about this that I can find.

I am going to order a barrel, a Shilen, from Jim at NNS which means that I will try and order the barrel nut and the lug at the same time. I am going to order a bolt handle from SSS for sure.

So if I am going to have the action trued and timed.... I will need to rebuild the bolt first then contact SSS and have them do the work? Sorry for all these questions I new to all this....

Again thanks for all the help.

Ryabn

[scythefwd]

The nice thing about the savage is that the bolt head is floating. As long as you are using the same bolt head, you could have the timing done before or after.

Timing an action just make sure things are cut right between the lugs on the action vs. lugs on the bolt. He also does some tweaks in when things get cocked..haven't found a clear explination on that. It supposedly fixes heavy bolt lift issues.

Truing an action .. not 100% sure what Fred means by that.. but most places it means truing up the face of the action to be perpendicular to the threading. Making sure the action body is aligned perfectly.

[scope eye]

Come to think of it, anything is better than that factory piece, but what I said still remains true, pardon the pun.

Tanks Dean

[J.Baker]

The nice thing about the savage is that the bolt head is floating. As long as you are using the same bolt head, you could have the timing done before or after.

Timing an action just make sure things are cut right between the lugs on the action vs. lugs on the bolt. He also does some tweaks in when things get cocked..haven't found a clear explination on that. It supposedly fixes heavy bolt lift issues.

Truing an action .. not 100% sure what Fred means by that.. but most places it means truing up the face of the action to be perpendicular to the threading. Making sure the action body is aligned perfectly.



Fixed: TRUING an action just make sure things are cut right (square) between the lugs on the action vs. lugs on the bolt. It also squares up the face of the action, the mating face of the barrel nut, the face of the bolt head, and removed the rounded corner where the shank of the bolt head meets the rear side of the lugs on the bolt head.

He also does some tweaks in when things get cocked...meaning the TIMING of how and when the various components that interact during the cocking/firing process so the action will cycle smoothly rather than the typical "from the factory" hard spot in the bolt lift when cocking due to those same components binding up because they're not interacting in sequentially timed fashion.


For a more in-depth explanation of timing, see this link:
http://www.savageshooters.com/content.php?161-Fred-Moreo-Timging-Truing-Explained

[J.Baker]

I see that places like Midway have them (on back order) listed for 23 bucks. SSS has them listed for 60+ What is the difference between the two?

IIRC the SSS bolt heads come complete with extractor/ejector parts whereas those from Midway USA are just the bare bolt head - no small parts.

[acemisser]

[QUOTE=scope eye;151257]264 Winmag a man after my own heart, Brownel's has them I just got two of them myself, I truly feel putting a machine recoil lug on an action that has not been trued, is like washing your feet and putting your dirty socks back on, in machining all touching faces must be trued or it is all in vain, that means "the nut the lug and they action" that's just machining 101 basics.

FYI an 85gr Sierra HP with 70gr of Hybrid will launch at 4000 FPS and not tax your brass.

What good is a trued recoil lug and nut if your action is not trued as well? Think about it..And how do they true a recoil lug anyway?
if it is flat then is nothing to true..So if your old one is flat then whats the difference in the two? Explain it to me...Forgot to mention,if your bolt face is not trues as well..then what..You have gained NOTHING..

[scythefwd]

less flex in the lug if nothing less. There is always the chacnce that the action is true.. but if nothing else and the action isnt true, you still have a stouter recoil lug with a larger contact patch with the stock. That should transfer the recoil int the stock better, flex less making it more repeatable even. May not do a thing, but there are several people that do see changes after swapping them out.

[stangfish]

[QUOTE=scope eye;151257]
What good is a trued recoil lug and nut if your action is not trued as well? Think about it..And how do they true a recoil lug anyway?
if it is flat then is nothing to true..So if your old one is flat then whats the difference in the two? Explain it to me...Forgot to mention,if your bolt face is not trues as well..then what..You have gained NOTHING..

Not sure what you are asking but I can gurantee you, the factory recoil lugs are not flat. I have blanchard ground about ten of them. It usally takes .004 on one side and .010 to .015 on the other side sans the anti-rotation nub. You can take a fine flat diamond hone and gently brush the face of the action and you will see how poor the surface quality is.
http://www.ptreeusa.com/Peach%20Graphics/3pc_diamond_hone_305_200.jpg
Do this to the nut also and the situation is vastly improved...but not trued. remember that any defects on two mating faces will distort axial alignment due to a lack of parallelism. Bedding the lug is another thing to consider.

[scope eye]

Factory recoil lugs are stamped, lay one down on a piece of glass and you will see how bad they are, after market ones are machined so they true.

Tanks Dean

[thomae]

I have blanchard ground about ten of them. I had no idea what blanchard grinding was, so I looked it up For those of you who are as ignorant as I am, here's a brief description:
Blanchard grinding is used to quickly remove stock from one side of a large part. Typically, ferrous metals are subjected to the Blanchard grinding process, since the part is often held in place by a magnetic chuck as it is ground.

In a Blanchard grinding machine, the grinding wheel is mounted on a vertical spindle, and moves in a direction counter to the rotation of the magnetic chuck. The tolerances provided by Blanchard grinding machines can be as little as one-thousandth of an inch, with similar flatness. Tolerances, however, vary between materials and work pieces. Due to the design and operation of a Blanchard grinding machine, it will grind different work pieces to a uniform size, a benefit for extensive production runs.Now, back to topic.

[scythefwd]

thomae - in regards to the question that I saw in my email, but not in the thread (was this post edited? I see no indication of it), no your action would not be trued. You'd have all 3 with all mating surfaces in contact, but that may or may not be concentric to the centerline of the action.

[stangfish]

thomae - in regards to the question that I saw in my email, but not in the thread (was this post edited? I see no indication of it), no your action would not be trued. You'd have all 3 with all mating surfaces in contact, but that may or may not be concentric to the centerline of the action.

Yep,

Concentricity is not as important as axial alignment.

[scythefwd]

I'm gonna show my ignorance once again, how are those different?

[scope eye]

Hey Ryan just a heads up 264 brass is harder to find and expensive, 7mm rem mag is one neck size away just run threw your 264 full sizer die and done, I actually use Privi brass a bag of 100 is only 50 bucks, it's hit or miss with some of there other calibers they make but there belted stuff is great, it's harder than regular brass "I think they mix in old military hardware from the cold war into the brass" LOL anyway what I was getting at is that it can really take a lot of PSI or CUP before deforming, just take my word on that one and leave it at that.

Tanks Dean

[txbdyguard]

Go the SSS route and get it complete.