New to Savage--tried an Axis, big mistake!

[vegas steve]

i've disassembled and worked on an axis and can tell you first hand that the lightened receiver,simplified bolt,rediculous recoil lug design, overly simplified trigger,and the flimsiest tupperware stock to date make for a super crappy rifle. imo the axis is a joke compared to the stevens 200. a definite wrong direction.i would take a stevens any day over an axis.

[thermaler]

Well, if there was a competition for rifle backwards somersaults it just might be a winner! Hah ha. To be fair, the bolt and receiver look pretty solid to me--but I'm new to the bolt-action world so don't know why it wouldn't be.

[Mach2]

You can't shoot a bolt rifle with a sporter barrel the same way you shoot a bull barrel. The Axis is a deer rifle and the barrel is designed to shoot only when cold. 30-06 will heat up any sporter barrel in three shots. Are you sure you aren't cooking that barrel till it's red hot? You did say it is your first bolt acton rifle.

It should take you all day to shoot a box of 20 rounds out of a 30-06 from a sporter barrel. If it were a bull barrel that is designed to be immune to extreme heat then yea, you could shoot a box of 30-06 in 3 1/2 minutes.. If you can put your hand on the barrel and keep it there then it's cold enough to shoot another round. Zeroing a sporter barrel in 30-06 requires patience. I usually bring 3 or four other guns to shoot at the range when I'n zeroing a large caliber sporter rifle because I know I am going to have to wait for the barrel to cool bwtween every shot..

[thermaler]

Good question--I wondered about the heat issue. I hand chambered each shot and cleaned the receiver and bore about every 5 shot grouping except for the last ten (even though I already did the break-in) plus walked out to the 100 yd target and back every 5 rounds. The barrel was probably hot while shooting the groupings--though I never saw any signs of any kind of smoking, and while very warm never got "red hot", I could touch the barrel after each grouping after a few mintes--though not immediately after each shot. I didn't see anything in the user's manual about avoiding using a hot barrel--only to be sure to use standard factory ammo which I did. But I still wonder if heat in the receiver may have somehow "locktited" the receiver screw?? I was going to keep using the rifle--but since it's condition is "abnormal" I think I better leave it alone until it's taken apart and checked out. Beyond the accuracy issue--can you damage the rifle by heating it up? I wasn't rapid-firing though I'd say there was only a few minutes between each shot in a 5 shot grouping.

[Mach2]

look at the barrels that preairie dog hunters use out West. They all use bull barrels. They can shoot hundreds of rounds using the BB. But if I took my most accurate rifle(Stevens mod 200 in .223 Rem with a sporter barrel) out West it would lose it's accuracy very very early in the hunt. Some hunting guides suggest bringing THREE rifles on a weekend hunt. However in SC I'm lucky if I get one shot in a day long hunt so my Stevens is quite at home here with our sparce game. I'd ruin that barrel permanently in one day on a PD hunt where I might shoot 500 rounds.

That .270 you have is a necked down 30-06 with a ton of powder in that long brass that can heat the sporter barrel like a blast furnace in three shots. I kid thee not; it should take 15 minutes between shots. I even stand the rifle up so the heat clears the barrel quicker. I wait and I wait and I wait......
The .270 can easily take 15 minutes and longer to cool once you've fire two or three rounds to start. While you're waiting, take that AR and plink with it for about 4 mags or so then go back to the Axis For your second shot. Don't even load two rounds in the .270 EVER. You're only going to intrude upon air flow while waiting for it to cool. If you can hold your hand down on the barrel end then you are ok to fire again.
You may have cooked that barrel already. 10 rounds x 15 minutes is 150 minutes. It takes over two hours to shoot a half box of 130gr .270 out of your Axis. Deer hunters are lucky to get two shots in a day. They don't need bull barrels.

[dacaur]

Hmmm..... when you say "cleaned the receiver and bore about every 5 shot grouping" are you saying you cleaned it every 5 shots? Becuase if thats the case, I can tell you why you are not getting good groups, and thats it. With every rifle I own, rimfire and centerfire, It shoots like crap out of a clean bore. My first and sometimes second 5 shot group from a freshly cleaned bore in my .308 edge is always pure crap, ranging from 2 1/2 to 5 inches. After that it settles back down to sub moa groups..... On my rimfire rifles it sometimes takes a full box of ammo to bring it back to shooting "right"...... Most people clean their guns way too much. Afer shooting my centerfire i will run a lightly oiled patch down the bore and put it in the safe, then before shooting it the next time run a dry patch to clean out the oil. So when should you clean it? I will always wait untill either accuracy starts to drop off or until the end of the fall season, because I know after cleaning my next 10 shots will be wasted.

[fgw_in_fla]

dacaur makes a real good point....

It takes 10 to 12 rounds fired from any Savage barreled rifle I have before it really settles down. Accuracy is weak & consistancy sucks rocks.

I hate clean, new barrels.... They're as predictable as an ex-wife.

Frank in Fla

[Mach2]

On my rimfire rifles it sometimes takes a full box of ammo to bring it back to shooting "right"...... Most people clean their guns way too much.

Dacur, you actually clean your rimfires?

LOL! Sorry but I couldn't resist. Some match shooters NEVER clean rimfires.

The first bigbore centerfire I zeroed I had to do it by myself with no experience. I fired about ten rounds and touched the barrel and burned the crap out of the skin. Live and learn. We all go through it.

[thermaler]

My break-in followed the factory manual and then I wiped the bolt and chamber after every 5 shot group and pulled a bore snake through the bore. I touched all the parts (though not immediately after each shot), and while very warm I never got burned.

I am a newbie to the bolt-action world and accept that heat up can affect shot placement (actual groupings weren't that bad--they just tended to move left to right and back) but metallurgically-speaking, how does one "cook" a barrel--sounds like I ruined it by too many rounds in one day?

[Mach2]

Thermaker if you could touch the steel barehanded between shots you definantly didn't cook it. By cook it I mean pitted the rifling or some other premature heat damage. I can't believe your gunsmith didn't tap and dye out that stock for you. If you can get that stock off you can find used ones for $35. Can you do the old 100 dollar bill trick under the supposedly free floated barrel? I think the hundred dollar bill is thicker than other bills.

I wish you'd call Savage again. Try another customer service rep. Maybe you caught one on a bad day. Savage raves about accuracy and all three of mine meet the hype. You deserve what you expected.

[dacaur]

yea, i dont think you ruined the barrel, it takes a lot to do that. if you waited to you could hold your hand on it between shots or even 3 shot groups you are fine I have shot 30 rounds out of mine in 2 hours and it still shoots great.... I'm also interested to hear the results of the dollar bill test.... when free floating barrels I used a folded sheet of paper as my tester..... Like I said, my barrel was touching the stock on one side when I got it, and groups weren't good. Once I floated it, things improved, but didnt get really good till I tried different ammo from what I initially bought.

If you arent comfortable with removing the stuck bolt definitely call savage again, i agree you must have gotten someone on a bad day. If you dont want to wait for the gun to go in and back, any qualified gunsmith could take care of that in 10 min.....

[thermaler]

First guy who worked on the gun basically finished the job I started--he tried tapping in a larger hex head wrench but only got the head further stripped. He deferred any further work (it was a goner by then) until the "big shot" smith comes in this week. Do you have three Axis rifles and find the factory stock is really no problem? Even stone-cold sitting on a sled when I touch the stock or put anything up on the foreend the sight picture dances all over the place. Can't imagine actually using a bipod on that front stud.

[thermaler]

Being the impatient (60 shot) kind of guy that I am--and figuring I'm going to replace the stock anyway--I elected to perform home radical surgery.

I decided to start with the tap and die approach, but gave up pretty quickly after the bit that came with the kit broke. Being rather irritated by this time--I saw my jigsaw on the shop shelf and with a smile decided it was time to take revenge on the tupperware stock.

My plan was basically cut around the front receiver bolt and lift the stock away.

The one really good thing about being made of tupperware-grade plastic is that once the blade heated up a bit it cut through the stock like butter. The receiver bolt sits in a metal sleeve which is in turn embedded in a plastic honeycomb box aft of the "recoil lug" (which looks like it would be better off in a Las Vegas slot machine--but what do I know). Once the bolt sleeve was relieved from it's plastic surrounds, the bolt itself turned easily and after 1/4 turn to start with pliers I was able to completely remove it by hand. Neither the bolt nor the receiver threads appear to show any signs of being stripped, so I can only conclude that a lateral torque had somehow locked the bolt off since it came out very easily once the sleeve was cut away from the stock. Taking a really close look at the whole mess--you can see that the bolt seating in the receiver is shallow while the space between the receiver and the bolt head is nothing but space and plastic. I admit I don't know diddly about rifle design (well, a bit about AR's and shotguns, maybe) but this setup just doesn't strike me as something to be pounding big recoil rounds through.

Meanwhile, I haven't been able to find anyone anywhere that makes aftermarket composite or wood stocks for the Axis--anyone know of one? (I don't think spending 500 -- 1000 bucks on a match grade stock makes much sense).

[thermaler]

Logged into Savage arms website and tried to do a parts search based on the serial number of my gun--an error is returned saying it's not in their system. Hmmmm, that can't be a good sign.

[Clint KY]

Logged into Savage arms website and tried to do a parts search based on the serial number of my gun--an error is returned saying it's not in their system. Hmmmm, that can't be a good sign.
The same thing happened to me. I mis-read the first character as a 6 when upon closer inspection (magnifying glass) it is a G -

[thermaler]

I double-checked, even with a magnifying glass, and the Savage system does not have the serial of my gun in it's system. I wonder if that means they never made it? :rolleyes: hahhah.

[Admin]

The same thing happened to me. I mis-read the first character as a 6 when upon closer inspection (magnifying glass) it is a G -

All Savage serial numbers since 1968 start with a letter.

As for Savage's site not recognizing your serial number, my guess would be that it's because it was made in the last year and Savage hasn't updated their online database yet (they're rather slow when it comes to updating anything on their website).

[Mach2]

Call Savage tommorrow and order a factory replacement stock and stock screws.. Their new ones are around $90. You could check around for used stocks. They're out there somewhere. Remount the scpe mount and scope rings when you get everything shipped to you. If you have another scope swap it out just to test.

Don't overtighten the stock screws. That may bind the stock. Were there no escutchens to prevent that?

[Admin]

Meanwhile, I haven't been able to find anyone anywhere that makes aftermarket composite or wood stocks for the Axis--anyone know of one? (I don't think spending 500 -- 1000 bucks on a match grade stock makes much sense).

And you're not going to because no one does yet and aside from Bell and Carlson and/or maybe Choate, I really don't expect any of the premium stock makers to offer replacements as not many people are going to want to pay $300-500 for an aftermarket stock to put on a rifle that only cost $250-300. The way the detachable magazine is retained in the Axis further complicates matters and makes it a more difficult stock to manufacture.

[thermaler]

This guy in Canada makes reasonably priced stocks; http://extreme-precision.forum-2007.com/t24573-replacement-stocks-for-savage-axis but he refuses to ship to the US; says he doesn't want to deal with customs hassle, eh.

The only way I would consider another tupperware stock is if there was some way to pillar bed the stock to reduce flex and seat the action rigidly. I don't even care if I just use it as a single-shot in regards to the mag. Otherwise, I guess I could try to sell or trade up my barrel, bolt and adjustable timney trigger.