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Thread: Long technical question on a savage build

  1. #1
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    Long technical question on a savage build


    Background


    Bought a left handed 116 in 300 win mag, barreled it with a black hole 264 win mag.
    Don't like the rubber stock or classic style it was a center feed sold it.

    Bought a Herters new old stock on Ebay liked the Monte Carlo and checkering and liked the idea of the side button to release the mag. Didn't realize the problems with all the specialty parts that are needed just to get the stock back to a usable state.

    Inletted the action and it seemed fine. Floated the barrel not too much trouble.

    Installed the bottom metal and the trigger guard wouldn't fit over the accutrigger. Opened up the trigger guard and got that to fit.

    Put 2 rounds of 264 into the magazine but the magazine won't fit into the bottom metal seems that the action is deeper into the stock than the action that the stock that I purchased was designed for.

    I have just about exhausted my interest in this project and have the notion to just sell the older stock to someone that needs an older wooden stock with all the parts (that were quite a bit of trouble to find) and order a Boyds.

    My only option from what I see is to modify the magazine by removing metal to allow the magazine to move further into the bottom metal.

    Any ideas from someone with a whole lot more experience and knowledge

  2. #2
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    Quote Originally Posted by Deakin View Post
    Background


    Bought a left handed 116 in 300 win mag, barreled it with a black hole 264 win mag.
    Don't like the rubber stock or classic style it was a center feed sold it.

    Bought a Herters new old stock on Ebay liked the Monte Carlo and checkering and liked the idea of the side button to release the mag. Didn't realize the problems with all the specialty parts that are needed just to get the stock back to a usable state.

    Inletted the action and it seemed fine. Floated the barrel not too much trouble.

    Installed the bottom metal and the trigger guard wouldn't fit over the accutrigger. Opened up the trigger guard and got that to fit.

    Put 2 rounds of 264 into the magazine but the magazine won't fit into the bottom metal seems that the action is deeper into the stock than the action that the stock that I purchased was designed for.

    I have just about exhausted my interest in this project and have the notion to just sell the older stock to someone that needs an older wooden stock with all the parts (that were quite a bit of trouble to find) and order a Boyds.

    My only option from what I see is to modify the magazine by removing metal to allow the magazine to move further into the bottom metal.

    Any ideas from someone with a whole lot more experience and knowledge
    Sharpshooter or robinhood likely will have the info you need my friend.

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  3. #3
    Basic Member Robinhood's Avatar
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    Side button is for a stagger fed action. You did not tell us what action you have. This information is important as a center fed action will not work. I have no idea where to find all of the parts you need for that stock even if it is a stagger fed action. Look in the faq section and find out what we are working with and we can go from there.
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  4. #4
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    First off,Is your action a Center or Staggered feed?

    The side button mag release stock is for an older style Staggered feed action,and will not work with a Center feed style magazine. I think you're trying to mat and old style stock/magazine stock to a newer style action. I'm not saying that it can't be done,but it isn't worth the time/money/effort.
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  5. #5
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    As Robin says the action may not be compatible as is if an old staggered feed clip is trying to mate into the bottom of a centerfeed action.
    I once had a 110C with the side button detachable clip. These were staggered feed magazines. If your 116 came stock with an accutrigger most likely it is a centerfeed. If you found and are using a detachable magazine & bottom metal from the old side button release then that is staggered feed.
    5
    The machining on the bottom of the action is different and the likelihood is your magazine is not mating into the bottom of the action. You will need the dimensions from a staggered feed reciever and mill the centerfeed action to match in order for the old clip style to mate into the bottom of a centerfeed reciever. (If that is true in your case....i am only guessing that is the problem). Also you can check the original factory stock against the Herter's for depth.
    We will wait for your info as well as Sharpshooter will chime in and most likely steer you in the right direction.
    Good luck & keep us posted.

  6. #6
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    Well just as I figured, I've made another wrong turn. You guys are right. 2007 make center feed and I've spent enough on this stock to have a nice Boyds.

    Thanks for the help if I had ever tasted alcohol now would be a good time to tie one on.

  7. #7
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    I donít know what the others know, but canít it be spaced out with shims/washers? Obviously trigger guard too.

  8. #8
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    Don't think shims are an option although I'm no gunsmith the action or the bottom metal would not set well in the stock. I will need the internals as I sold the original stock and the center feed internals and was told by Savage that I could convert the center feed to a detachable magazine.

    I think that I would like a detachable magazine but I'll see what happens

  9. #9
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    If you mock up the parts you have with a dummy round in the magazine and without the stock you will see that the magazine is not high enough in the receiver for the bolt head to pick up the round. The bullet end of the dummy round will also be too low. The magazine must enter the reciever at the bottom. Opening this area up on a mill to the measurements found on a stagger feed reciever should get you to where you want to be. Assuming that the Herter's stock was a semi-inlet for the 110C model. And assuming your bottom metal and magazine are for the 110C also.
    The reciever diameters & bolt pattern are the same on the old and the new, the only major differences is the machining on the bottom of the reciever.
    My bet is you can make it work with just a few more grey hairs!...lol
    Good luck

    Sidenote: I loved the old Herter's stock blanks & semi inlets.

  10. #10
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    What mnbogboy2 says sounds about right to me. As best Iím understanding from your text that is.

    But Iíll also ask, what metal does it seem need be removed from the magazine? I ask because Iím using an MDT TAC21 chassis and Magpul mag. When first assembled, the mag would not work....same situation you are referring to. The mag needed modified by removing material. But in the end it was only a very minor amount. It now fits perfectly.

  11. #11
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    I'm not comfortable modifying the magazine. Not sure if that is anything that I want to try. I've never tried to inlet a rifle to this extent and am not comfortable, especially when the parts are this hard to replace if I mess up. From what I can tell in my limited gunsmithing the front of the magazine is where the metal needs to be removed but again I'm not ready to attempt it.

  12. #12
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    The old side button release mags had the housing that attached to the reciever just like the stagger feed blind boxes.
    This housing contained the catch & release mechanism for the clip itself. That's why the action has to be machined to accept that housing. Once the housing is the correct height in relationship to the action then the clip should work. The original housings "snapped" in like a stagger box. Without machining exactly like the old recievers, an alternate method of holding it in place must be devised. Whether to the new reciever or the stock itself.
    I think at this point we need pictures of what you have so far. Maybe we are completely off the rails in or assessments.
    We barrelnut brothers will stick together and tackle all problems. This one has been done the other direction putting modern bottom metal on older actions.
    Your problem putting the older stuff on a newer action is kind of unique. I'm guessing it has been done though.
    You all ways have an option of installing modern bottom metal in your stock, plugging the release hole and selling your hard to find parts.

  13. #13
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    I'm leaning toward just selling it as a package with all the parts included. My stupid self even had a recoil pad installed.

    I think that I have two options

    New stock, Boyds or Microfit

    Buy another rifle keep the stock and sell the action.

  14. #14
    Basic Member Robinhood's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Deakin View Post
    Buy another rifle keep the stock and sell the action.
    I see stagger fed long actions pretty regular for 300 or less regularly.
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    If I were you, I'd stop dead in my tracks and cut your losses. The parts you need haven't been made in about 20 yrs and are rare as unicorn tears.
    "As long as there's lead in the air....there's still hope.."

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    Maybe I missed something? What parts are needed? As I’m reading, its a case of “fitting a Round peg in a Square hole”. I understand completely if you aren’t comfortable trying to modify it. I’m sure you can find a smith who can help.

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dave Hoback View Post
    Maybe I missed something? What parts are needed? As I’m reading, its a case of “fitting a Round peg in a Square hole”. I understand completely if you aren’t comfortable trying to modify it. I’m sure you can find a smith who can help.
    Click image for larger version. 

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    Dave this picture shows the old "clip" frame with a modified magazine inserted ( the floor of the mag has been removed).
    The frame attaches into the reciever the same way as a stagger feed box does. That is why the reciever needs the same slots milled just as the old stagger feeds.
    The bottom metal of these old 110Cs does nothing but guide the "clip".
    I hope I explained this ok.

  18. #18
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    I understand the process but not sure it is worth the expense and trouble. I being left handed have had issues on quite a few purchases of rifles over the years.

    Robinhood mentioned the $300 actions but not sure he meant left handed. I had quite a time finding the 116 I have now.

    My tastes are off the grid as it seems that Monte Carlo, wood, and left hand are becoming unicorns.

    If anyone knows of a unicorn in someones safe just gathering dust with the above options in LA please let me know.

    Thanks for all the great info and the help with my stupid decisions.

  19. #19
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    Deakin,
    You should be able to recover some or all of your expense for the 110C stock & magazine parts. Or have you thought of buying bottom metal & magazine parts that fit your action and fit it to the Herters stock. Some clever woodworking may allow you to blend in the new parts and it will still look great with the unicorn style that you like.
    I looked at EBay to see where your NOS might have came from. Seeing lots of southpaws and some nice looking wood.
    The birdseye & curly maple especially caught my eye. If you were fortunate to get one of those I really envy you.
    As a teen the Herters catalog was my wish book. I did a couple of their semi inlets including a beautiful piece of walnut for a 7.62 Russian Mossine.
    Don't give up on your dream until it's intrigue leaves you. Get some bottom metal measurements of a newer Savage or even some of the aftermarket stuff. You may have to add a little material to the width at the bottom of your stock (or maybe not). Once the bottom metal is inletted to the correct height you should be golden with no more big hickups.
    Good luck.

  20. #20
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    I don't think you've ever seen bottom metal to one of those old models, because if you did, you'd know it's nothing more than trim. The metal "trim" (aluminum) was discontinued in 1978, and replaced with plastic. The plastic was discontinued in 1995 in favor of an all plastic stock with no separate trim. In 2005, the old stagger feed DBM's were discontinued all together.
    "As long as there's lead in the air....there's still hope.."

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    Sharpshooter, I have seen the trim and the magazine box with the spring, and the original Magazine with the rivet in the middle as I have all the parts just not the right action for this set up. It is the aluminum one. Wasn't easy to find but the old internet and quite a bit of patience I gathered all the parts (I thought) that would let me use this stock, but again I'm not the brightest bulb in the box.

    I'll ask this question instead of starting another thread.

    I have found a Storm 110 LH in 300 win mag with the accu-stock and interchangeable comb. Will the 2007 116 action fit in this stock? It's cheap enough that I can change the barrel on the 116 use the storm action and sell the rest and recoup most of my money.

  22. #22
    Basic Member Robinhood's Avatar
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    read mnbogboy2's post bellow.
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  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Deakin View Post
    Sharpshooter, I have seen the trim and the magazine box with the spring, and the original Magazine with the rivet in the middle as I have all the parts just not the right action for this set up. It is the aluminum one. Wasn't easy to find but the old internet and quite a bit of patience I gathered all the parts (I thought) that would let me use this stock, but again I'm not the brightest bulb in the box.

    I'll ask this question instead of starting another thread.

    I have found a Storm 110 LH in 300 win mag with the accu-stock and interchangeable comb. Will the 2007 116 action fit in this stock? It's cheap enough that I can change the barrel on the 116 use the storm action and sell the rest and recoup most of my money.
    Either action should fit in the accufit stock. The recoil lug is shorter in the accufit/accu-stock series because of the aluminum bedding block. That being said, you will have to pull them both apart at any rate to use the "accustock" recoil lug and your 264 mag barrel. Or find an "accu" style lug for your 116.
    Also if your 116 is a top bolt release and the 110 is bottom bolt release then the storm action may be better off staying in the stock with only the barrel swap.
    Otherwise the stock would need clearance cut for the top bolt release.
    It sounds like a good plan and hopefully you can recoup most or all of your investment.
    I certainly for one may be interested in that herters stock if the wood was exceptional. Thinking I could convert it to right hand. Can you post a picture or PM one?

    Again good luck with this project as it evolves.

  24. #24
    Basic Member Robinhood's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mnbogboy2 View Post
    Either action should fit in the accufit stock. The recoil lug is shorter in the accufit/accu-stock series because of the aluminum bedding block. That being said, you will have to pull them both apart at any rate to use the "accustock" recoil lug and your 264 mag barrel. Or find an "accu" style lug for your 116.
    Also if your 116 is a top bolt release and the 110 is bottom bolt release then the storm action may be better off staying in the stock with only the barrel swap.
    Otherwise the stock would need clearance cut for the top bolt release.
    It sounds like a good plan and hopefully you can recoup most or all of your investment.
    I certainly for one may be interested in that herters stock if the wood was exceptional. Thinking I could convert it to right hand. Can you post a picture or PM one?

    Again good luck with this project as it evolves.
    Im sorry, I think I missunderstood. MNbogboy is correct. It would be a direct bolt in except for the recoil lug issue.
    One Cannot Be PC And Be Intellectually Honest!

  25. #25
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    Robin, I must have been typing when you posted last night and never saw your post till now. It took me a bit to figure out what he was asking also.
    This has been a good learning post for all of us. Sure hope everything works out for Deakin.

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