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Thread: bolt questions

  1. #1
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    bolt questions

    so ive been doing some reading about ways to decrease the slop in the bolt and came acrossed the ptg bolt bodies and also the bolt bodies from sharp shooter supply. my questions are do either of these help decrease the movement. is one recommeded over the other and is this really worth it to do this upgrade. the rifle i would be doing this to is the 110 tactical left handed in 6.5 creedmoor. any advice would be greatly appreciated as im driving myself crazy trying to find info about this.

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    Is the "slop" and "movement" you're referring to, the clearance between the bolt body and the receiver raceway?

    Assuming that's the case, you'd need to measure front/rear ID of the raceway with gauge pins to determine your smallest ID, then select a bolt with the desired clearance.
    Clearance desired should depend on the use of the rifle. A hunting rifle needs adequate clearances so that a speck of dirt or grit in the action isn't going to cause a malfunction.

    To do this the "right" way, you would ream the bolt raceway to a consistent, oversize dimension and then use the appropriate bolt body.
    So, short answer to your question is "yes"- but you need to be able to take the necessary precision measurements, know the clearances needed- and be realistic about what you might gain.


    The floating bolthead on Savages compensates for minor misalignment. Things like bolt tilt are a consideration on precision rifles, absent other work being done it's not likely to show you a return at the target.

    JMO. YMMV.

  3. #3
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    I have used multiple from ptg, they do help some, not as much as you probably want. Also, every action I have measured the rear of the bolt race is a larger diameter than the front. Unless you open the bolt race there will always be considerable slop because of this.

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    I’ve switched out the factory bolt body and bolt head to PTG on a couple of PDog rifles. They took out the slop. I did notice some slight binding with one action that smoothed out with time/bolt cycles. But these were actions fitted with a single-load ramp/magazine for bench shooting and not exposed to a lot of dust and grit. Not sure I’d recommend on a hunting rifle.

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    Basic Member Robinhood's Avatar
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    If you do want to order one do yourself a favor and don't get one of the fluted ones. You can also use telescoping gauges to check the size. Trying to remember if our gauge pin set goes to .700 or not.
    The way SSS flutes his there is no drag. Best to just keep a smooth bolt.
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    Don't fix it if it ain't broke!!
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    Reducing the slop also reduces the float.....the thing that makes Savages shoot so well. With factory production tolerances being what they are, the "slop" is there for a reason. I've installed several oversize bolt bodies only to find that accuracy suffers. This is a case of applying Remington technology to a Savage.......it doesn't work. But you can apply Savage technology to a Remington and it will.
    "As long as there's lead in the air....there's still hope.."

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    Team Savage Fuj''s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sharpshooter View Post
    This is a case of applying Remington technology to a Savage.......it doesn't work. But you can apply Savage technology to a Remington and it will.
    Beat me to it !! Quite a few action makers have stepped up to
    the float method over the years.
    Keeping my bad Karma intact since 1952

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    Thanks for all the replies and advice. I think I’ve decided to just stick with what I got and spend the money on something more useful.

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    I agree with the above. While having a “tight” action that seemingly rides on bearings gives a wonderful feeling in hand to the user, it serves no purpose in he realm of overall accuracy. As once the bolt is locked with round in chamber, the play between the bolt & action becomes mute. Now for those situations of extreme bolt body play I see no harm in replacing with a PTG, as long as it’s correctly measured & “some” play is accounted for. This being for the aforementioned quality of “feel” for enjoyment to the user. And of course the great quality of machining inherent in PTG parts. And as Robin mentioned... skip on the fluting! Keep a solid bolt.

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    Basic Member Robinhood's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fuj' View Post
    Beat me to it !! Quite a few action makers have stepped up to
    the float method over the years.
    Really? Who?
    One Cannot Be PC And Be Intellectually Honest!

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    Basic Member greyling's Avatar
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    I want to piggyback on this thread rather than starting a new one. I need to replace a left hand long action bolt from an original savage to to a modern bolt for a rebarrel. I can pick up a ptg bolt head and body for $90, or savage factory parts for 60. Are ptg parts worth the extra $30?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dave Hoback View Post
    I agree with the above. While having a “tight” action that seemingly rides on bearings gives a wonderful feeling in hand to the user, it serves no purpose in he realm of overall accuracy.
    Bolt tilt is real, and is a consideration for competition grade rifles that have one-piece bolts. Anything that results in the cartridge being forced off of perfect concentricity to the chamber will degrade accuracy.
    Again, I can't shoot this difference- but for those that have the skills (both driving the rifle and handloading) it can make a difference.

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    Quote Originally Posted by greyling View Post
    I want to piggyback on this thread rather than starting a new one. I need to replace a left hand long action bolt from an original savage to to a modern bolt for a rebarrel. I can pick up a ptg bolt head and body for $90, or savage factory parts for 60. Are ptg parts worth the extra $30?
    Not in my opinion.
    "Life' is tough. It's even tougher if you're stupid." ~ John Wayne
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urgent circumstances, desperate circumstances, profanity provides a relief denied even to prayer.” —Mark Twain

  15. #15
    Basic Member Robinhood's Avatar
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    I am not married to the idea that applying truths about every other bolt action to Savage is detrimental. If someone has empirical evidence, my ears and eyes are wide open. For 95% of shooters a good barrel, a debured action face, a flat recoil lug and 90 ft/lbs of torque and they are happy with their excellent shooter. If you pay attention on this forum and you have a little skill, you can learn to make the most out of your Savage without spending a mint. You too can be a Savagesmith. Great discussions and little tips here and there and you will understand all of the nuances that can be addressed that can make your life with a savage fit your needs regardless of how discerning they are.
    One Cannot Be PC And Be Intellectually Honest!

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    Quote Originally Posted by greyling View Post
    I want to piggyback on this thread rather than starting a new one. I need to replace a left hand long action bolt from an original savage to to a modern bolt for a rebarrel. I can pick up a ptg bolt head and body for $90, or savage factory parts for 60. Are ptg parts worth the extra $30?
    Absolutely, in my own opinion. There are a few here who dislike Dave Kiff because of some bad business dealings/envy & I’m sure some things I don’t know of. I use and like many PTG parts. (And I have no axe to grind!) I also have no dealings with Kiff aside from purchasing his products. “Purchasing” being the word. I haven’t been given anything.

  17. #17
    Team Savage Fuj''s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robinhood View Post
    Really? Who?
    LOL.....Well, Stiller and Shilen were doing one. I believe PTG
    was doing the bolts for Stiller. Big Horn offers one. Ultimatum
    Precision offers a 3 lug floater.
    Keeping my bad Karma intact since 1952

  18. #18
    Basic Member Robinhood's Avatar
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    You missed ARC. There is a big difference in interchangeable bolt heads and floating bolt heads. Those custom actions have much closer tolerances and zero alignment issues. Therefore there is no need for a "float". The bolt head has over .010" clearance over rim diameter.

    The manufacturers of those actions will be the first to tell you floating bolt head for accuracy is a myth. When the cartridge is fired the bolt lugs will find their mating faces on the abutments. Any static effect of a floating bolt head is negated. Bot head/barrel misalignment is compensated for by having the id of the bolt head oversized for the rim diameter. Bolt looseness in the raceway will allow for lack of concentricity between barrel and the bolt raceway(loose bolt body to bolt raceway clearance).


    If there was ever significant angular misalignment between the the axis of the bore and the axis of the bolt raceway and action, staying on target with small changes in distance would be difficult. Therefore there is no need for angular correction via floating bolt head. They are loose because it is easier to ship items mass produced with a open tolerances than it is ones with tight tolerances. It works ... because Savages keep barrel machining concentric the bores relatively straight.
    One Cannot Be PC And Be Intellectually Honest!

  19. #19
    Team Savage Fuj''s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robinhood View Post
    You missed ARC.
    I did not miss ARC at all. The ARC has an interchangeable head
    not floating head. The design of the toroidal is not meant to
    articulate. If it does, you broke the pin !!.....Done here
    Keeping my bad Karma intact since 1952

  20. #20
    Basic Member Robinhood's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fuj' View Post
    I did not miss ARC at all. The ARC has an interchangeable head
    not floating head.
    The design of the toroidal is not meant to
    articulate. If it does, you broke the pin !!.....Done here
    Like I said, none of the others are designed to "float" or "articulate" either. They are all designed to be interchangeable. No reason to get upset. If you have an argument state it. Otherwise we are passing on myths as truths.

    Like These.

    Beat me to it !! Quite a few action makers have stepped up to
    the float method over the years.
    Well, Stiller and Shilen were doing one. I believe PTG
    was doing the bolts for Stiller. Big Horn offers one. Ultimatum
    Precision offers a 3 lug floater.
    All of these are interchangeable, not floaters.
    One Cannot Be PC And Be Intellectually Honest!

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