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Thread: Savage entering the “Higher End” of Bench rifles?

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    Savage entering the “Higher End” of Bench rifles?

    https://www.americanrifleman.org/art...hassis-rifles/

    Pretty cool. But HOLY COW!! Those prices! I’ll stick with my DIY custom Savage. But I know some have more money than ability...so I’m sure they will have some homes.

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    Administrator J.Baker's Avatar
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    Apparently you need to check the articles on the homepage more often if you're just seeing that.

    http://www.savageshooters.com/conten...-Arms-Unveiled

    As for the prices, yeah - they're a little "out there" for what you're getting IMO. Savage needs to realize they continue to shot themselves in the foot on a lot of these premium models as their customers know they can build essentially the same thing for a LOT less by starting with one of the 12 FV's from Cabela's. They have essentially devalued their own product with special runs like that in recent years. Just look at how cheap actions are selling for in the classifieds these days as proof of that.
    "Life' is tough. It's even tougher if you're stupid." ~ John Wayne
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    Well I could have chimed in the conversation the thread there....oh wait a sec... there is NO discussion thread!


    I never said, nor do I think I somehow discovered this. Just looked and found no discussion by anyone. Thought it’d be a good convo. Not sure why you try to call me out like I did something wrong, like you have some kind of vendetta. But, great example to set.

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    This rifle is clearly designed for the production division class in PRS. However, for the $2k price there are a LOT of options I would choose over a Savage. Honestly, the price isn't terrible for the sum of all components, but I would look towards the MPA BA CMR that has a list of top end components. Maybe the Tikka TSR-1 as a second choice, also ahead of the Savage.

    “Production Division combined rifle and scope MSRP as listed on the company’s website shall not exceed $3,000 USD, the rifle shall not exceed $2,000 USD and the optic not exceed $2,000 USD.Production Division rifles are not permitted to be altered or improved in any way from the original factory configuration.In an effort to prevent exorbitant costs for beginning shooters, Production Division round count will not exceed 80 rounds.”
    FTR in 223, 12FVSS in 308, 110 Flatback in CBI 6mmBR Norma, Others

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    Administrator J.Baker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dave Hoback View Post
    Well I could have chimed in the conversation the thread there....oh wait a sec... there is NO discussion thread!


    I never said, nor do I think I somehow discovered this. Just looked and found no discussion by anyone. Thought it’d be a good convo. Not sure why you try to call me out like I did something wrong, like you have some kind of vendetta. But, great example to set.
    Wasn't calling you out, just noting that the info is readily available here rather than sending folks somewhere else. As for a discussion thread, every article posted automatically has a thread started for it which also shows up as replies to the article so you can post in the thread or as a comment to the article and it will be seen both places.


    https://www.savageshooters.com/showt...-Arms-Unveiled
    "Life' is tough. It's even tougher if you're stupid." ~ John Wayne
    “Under certain circumstances, 
urgent circumstances, desperate circumstances, profanity provides a relief denied even to prayer.” —Mark Twain

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    If that is the case, than I offer my apologies. To the other part, I did a search of all forums, and found nothing. Thought it would make for an interesting topic to discuss. If not, feel free to delete this thread. I’ll just go back to answering questions. LOL

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    Administrator J.Baker's Avatar
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    Those posts for new articles are automatically created in the Article Discussions board.
    "Life' is tough. It's even tougher if you're stupid." ~ John Wayne
    “Under certain circumstances, 
urgent circumstances, desperate circumstances, profanity provides a relief denied even to prayer.” —Mark Twain

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    Mind if I ask a really stupid question?
    What is it about the 12FV series that makes them such good starts for builds, I mean over the other Savage models? I have a 10T-SR, and want one day to build a rifle without spending $5K (I know, I know...LOL).

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    Because they are cheap and you can frequently get them even cheaper with rebates and sales?

    If I were starting a build I'd go for the least expensive one just for the action. Or...look in the classifieds here and see if an action pops up.


    Quote Originally Posted by J.Baker View Post
    Wasn't calling you out, just noting that the info is readily available here rather than sending folks somewhere else. As for a discussion thread, every article posted automatically has a thread started for it which also shows up as replies to the article so you can post in the thread or as a comment to the article and it will be seen both places.


    https://www.savageshooters.com/showt...-Arms-Unveiled

    Am glad you posted that because I have never scrolled down that far on the forum page and I don't think I've ever looked at the forum home page except to register. I set up bookmarks for forum sections I am interested in and only go there.

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    Quote Originally Posted by charlie b View Post
    Because they are cheap and you can frequently get them even cheaper with rebates and sales?

    If I were starting a build I'd go for the least expensive one just for the action. Or...look in the classifieds here and see if an action pops up.

    Am glad you posted that because I have never scrolled down that far on the forum page and I don't think I've ever looked at the forum home page except to register. I set up bookmarks for forum sections I am interested in and only go there.
    Charlie hit the nail on the head. This time last year with the Savage rebate and Cabela's gift card you could essentially buy a brand new 12 FV for well under $300. That gets you an action with varmint trigger and a 26" heavy barrel. Even if you go with MDT's most pricey AAC chassis at $1,000 and spend $200 on an aftermarket trigger you're still going to be $200-300 under the street price of that new Elite Precision 110.
    "Life' is tough. It's even tougher if you're stupid." ~ John Wayne
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    I do agree with that! I went even more affordable...picked up a used Model 10 for $170! I knew I was doing a complete build, but only so much money at first. Otherwise I would have gone with a 12 Action. Having a build you absolutely love everything about is a wonderful thing.

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    Thanks for the info guys!

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    I think the 12 FVs are favorite because they are low cost and regularly on sale.
    I have two of them (a .223 and a 6.5mm Creedmoor) that cost $320 each on sale and they are very accurate.
    My 10T-SR cost $500 in 6.5mm Creedmoor and also shoots accurately with an Accu-Stock and bottom mount bolt release.
    The lower bolt release does somewhat limit choices for replacement stocks.

    Most of us who have 12 FVs have found them to be really accurate out of the box.
    However, for a build base, they have one issue IMO - they have hidden magazines.
    I replaced stocks on both the 12 FVs with Oryx stocks that cost $450 and $489 respectively including the AICS detachable magazines.

    That makes the 10T-SR a good choice if you want a detachable mag with an Accu-Stock and bottom bolt release to start your build.
    But if you are buying a new barrel, a new stock with detachable AICS magazines, the cost difference favors the 12 FV.

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    Administrator J.Baker's Avatar
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    One thing we have to remember here in this discussion is that not everyone has the skills/tools to build their own guns, or has the desire to for that matter. In fact, it's fair to say that those of us on this site are a very small minority of Savage owners who get our kicks tearing them apart and building them into whatever our hearts desire. New models like these, and many of the MSR's are geared specifically toward those who just want to buy something off-the-shelf that's ready to roll and they're willing to pay the premium price for them.
    "Life' is tough. It's even tougher if you're stupid." ~ John Wayne
    “Under certain circumstances, 
urgent circumstances, desperate circumstances, profanity provides a relief denied even to prayer.” —Mark Twain

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    Thanks again, and sorry for the hijack, Dave.

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    "...5-4 lb user-adjustable AccuTrigger ...."

    I hope that was a misprint because if this is a benchrest rifle at $2000 grand or so, I can't see even one sale for this.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Fotheringill View Post
    "...5-4 lb user-adjustable AccuTrigger ...."

    I hope that was a misprint because if this is a benchrest rifle at $2000 grand or so, I can't see even one sale for this.
    Caught that one too, Think they meant 1.5-4 ??

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    The Savage release said 1.5-4lb (varmint) trigger. I wonder why it is not the target accutrigger?

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    Quote Originally Posted by charlie b View Post
    The Savage release said 1.5-4lb (varmint) trigger. I wonder why it is not the target accutrigger?
    Likely due to the nature of the game the rifle is designed for (PRS). These guys are going for time and accuracy, so they aren't going to be babying the bolt while they work it and it's common knowledge that if you have the Target AccuTrigger set low and work the bolt hard and fast it will more often than not trip the safety feature of the AccuTrigger forcing you to have to lift the bolt to reset the trigger.
    "Life' is tough. It's even tougher if you're stupid." ~ John Wayne
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    I figured the PRS guys would be smart enough to not set the trigger that light and then the bench guys would not have to replace the trigger. :)

    So, I wonder if Savage will do some 'work' on the bolt so it cycles fast enough?

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    Would be nice if Savage actually defined what "factory blueprinted action" is on their website...
    Means nothing without a description of exactly what work is performed.

    Savage is dreaming if they think they can sell this rifle for two grand in an already crowded, and getting more so (PRS) market.

    For two grand, gimme this:

    https://forum.snipershide.com/thread...rifle.6924480/

  22. #22
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    That's just it. With PRS having a fixed MSRP price ceiling for their factory class every mainstream manufacturer and custom rifle builder wanting a piece of this action is going to be offering something that hits that price. That's a LOT of competition for a relatively small (in the grand scheme of things) market.

    If I were in the market myself I would probably go with the Patriot Valley Arms John Hancock rifle for the same money. No feeding/ejection issues with the ARC Nucleus action, a Rock Creek barrel, Timney trigger, and I would much prefer the more traditional KRG Bravo chassis. Plus I can get one of those in left-hand.
    "Life' is tough. It's even tougher if you're stupid." ~ John Wayne
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    Basic Member Robinhood's Avatar
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    Dont forget about the MPA BA PMR with the Curtis action
    One Cannot Be PC And Be Intellectually Honest!

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    Charlie-

    Benchrest folks won't even consider a 1.5 lb. trigger. The target accutrigger will go down to six oz. After market like the SAV2 will go down lower when replacing the target Accu Trigger. I don't know minimum pull on regular accutrigger replacements triggers, but I seem to have a dim memory it wasn't in ounces.

    Sav2 has its own issues with wobble after installation but sure as hell is crisp.

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    In regards to the trigger, for some reason I was thinking PRS had a 1.5 minimum limit for production class, but apparently not.


    2.3 Bolt Gun - Production Division
    The PRS Production Division was created to encourage growth to our shooting community from outside our ranks by allowing shooters the opportunity to compete in PRS events without being disadvantaged due to equipment. In order to accomplish this we have set limits on the original cost of your rifle and the optic. All other equipment that can be mounted to or added to your rifle that doesn’t significantly increase accuracy will be considered accessories and will not be regulated. We want shooters to be able to buy new equipment or pick up a new item off a prize table and be able to use it without the fear of being disqualified from the Production Division.

    2.3.1 Production Division combined rifle and optic MSRP as listed on the company’s website shall not exceed $4,000 USD, the rifle shall not exceed $2,000 USD and the optic shall not exceed $2,000 USD.

    2.3.2 Rifle: For the purpose of the Production Division, a rifle is defined as the original manufacturers configuration of a complete firearm which will be comprised of at least but not limited to the following: stock with bottom metal or chassis, a complete action, a barrel and a trigger mechanism.

    2.3.3 Optics: For the purpose of the Production Division, an optic is defined as a magnified optical system capable of safely engaging targets at various ranges through the use of an internal reticle and or adjustable turrets.

    2.3.4 Accessories: For the purpose of the Production Division, the following items are considered accessories and will not be regulated or prohibited from being used on or in conjunction with your production rifle: muzzle brakes, silencers, barricade stops/blocks,custom paint, rings, red dot sights, bags, pads, bipods, rails, zoom levers, data cardholders, bolt knobs, bubble level, etc.

    2.3.5 Ammunition: No Restrictions. Any and all types of factory ammunition or hand-loaded ammo is allowed.

    2.3.6 Production Division Rifles will not exceed a caliber of .30 or a velocity of 3,200fps. A match DQ will result any rounds over the speed limit of 3,200 fps (+/- 32 fps for environmental factors and equipment discrepancies).

    2.3.7 Match Officials may request at any point during a match that a competitor fire their rifle through chronograph. If the bullet exceeds the 3,200 fps speed limit, the shooter will receive an automatic match DQ.

    2.3.8 Enforcement: The PRS WILL NOT maintain a list of authorized rifles or optics due to the dynamics of the ever changing cycle of revised models, new products, and upgrades being released by manufactures. Match Directors are responsible for addressing and enforcing the Production Division regulation matters if and when they arise on a case by case basis.

    2.3.9 COF: Production Division shooters will shoot the same COF as Open Division.

    2.3.10 Production Division Exceptions:

    • If your production rifle came standard without a threaded barrel, you may have a qualified gunsmith remove the barrel and thread it so you can run a brake or a silencer, provided no additional work is done to the barrel or action to “Accurize it”.
    • If your barrel needs to be replaced, it must be sent back to the original manufacture for a replacement barrel of equal value. Aftermarket pre-fit barrels,or a new barrel from a custom shop are not allowable replacements.
    • You may safely tune your original trigger but replacement triggers are not allowed.
    • You may glass bed rifles.
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