Reply With QuoteIt's copper fouling.
I just recently traded for a new Savage axis, it had never been shot. I cleaned it before shooting it and took it out and fired 10 total rounds to get scope set where I want it. I am using Fiocchi shooting dynamics 165 grain soft point. I have a spot just down the side of one rifling from the muzzle to about an inch or so down in the barrel. It's not as wide as the rifling and a short strip of it that has a redish brown color. What could this be?, I put a brush through it about 10 strokes and it didn't change it. Thanks for any help
It's copper fouling.
"As long as there's lead in the air....there's still hope.."
Yup! Copper fouling indeed. No worries. No, a brush by itself isn’t going to remove the copper. It gets imbedded, almost soldered into the rifling. Need a caustic Copper solvent like Sweets 7.62, Hoppes, etc. take your pic. I use the Birchwood Casey “2 in 1”. Removes nitro & copper fouling. And....it’s cheap!
or some CLR
The Dunning-Kruger effect is alive and well.
Get some Kroil (penetrating oil) and wipe a soaked patch and let it sit overnight. Then a dry patch and then a patch with solvent/stove alcohol (91%) to clear the oil and a dry patch. Then use a copper fouling remover like Barnes CR-10 and a nylon brush (follow the directions). You may be surprised what comes out in the patches using the CR-10. If you have a wood stock be carefull of drips with the alcohol or the CR-10.
"They couldn't hit an elephant at this distance." Last words of Gen. Sedgwik
KG12 works really fast on copper. But, wear gloves and use in ventilated area. The other non-ammonia copper solvents work nicely as well.
If more on the cheap side, plain ammonia works. Just don't let it sit in the bore too long.
I went today and got some Hoppes bench rest copper solvent, put it on a swab and left it about 30 minutes, ran a patch and it was green. Several patches later they came out clean and the spot is gone. thanksOriginally Posted by Dave Hoback
Is the Birchwood Casey by itself good enough for copper? I have something specifically for copper but if one product is good enough it would be much simpler. Have to clean the gun twice the way I am doing it now.
Has worked fine for me. It’s pretty caustic stuff. I’m sure there are better, maybe do it a bit quicker. I’ve used Hoppes as well for years. I’m not brand specific. I just get the least expensive I know. This last time it was the Birchwood Casey. If I was getting today, it would be Hoppes. They all work.
The area where the copper collected is rough looking, any way to get it smoothed out? I believe thats why copper collected there in only 10 rounds fired. thanks
Just keep shooting & cleaning. The regular shooting will lap the lands soon enough.
Since I converted a bedroom to my gun room and do everything there, I use Boretech Carbon C4 and Copper Cu+2. They work great and have a "citrus like" aroma which keeps my better half happy. Although I haven't personally used it, Boretech Eliminator is a "one step" carbon and copper remover that gets great reviews.
I've unintentionally dripped Boretech on the carpet while wetting a patch and it didn't stain or leave a bleached spot.
Do you think it will smooth out the rifling and not collect copper as bad? I contacted Savage, they said I could send it in to be looked at and they may be able to get it smoothed out. Said as long as it shoots and grouped that they couldn't replace anything but might be able to get it looking better. Don't really know what to do, as it shoots good but that spot does bother me. thanks
If it shoots good keep shooting it until it doesn’t, then clean it. We as shooters often times get unnecessarily wrapped around the axle over a bright shiny bore. Probably as hard or harder on them scrubbing away with a cleaning rod as it is just to shoot it.
I sent Savage the pic, they said it looked like after rifling was done and the finish applied, that the finish didn't blue that area for some reason. Said if I sent it in that they would bench shoot it, if it groups then They can't do anything. I already know it shoots good. Gonna take it out in a few days and shoot a box and see how my shots are. If they still good then I will probably try and keep it but having that spot in there drives me nuts. If the groups open up then it will go back to Savage.
I think your making yourself crazy with this! This is why I and many others recommend people DON’T get Borescope! People take one look as usually convince themselves the barrel is TRASHED! All WITHOUTE EVER SHOOTING IT, LOL!
Yes, it shooting will naturally smooth it, but let me ask, how does it shoot?
Yes I know I get a little too picky over small stuff sometimes, i have mild ocd. I am on a fixed income and tight budget so I can't save for something too expensive. However I have had good luck over the last few years of getting good for the money. The gun shoots good, I am getting about 1 inch groups at 100 yards with Fiochi 165 grain soft points. Some 3 shots groups are less with the largest at around 1 1/2 inches. Thats with me resting it on a card table outside with a blanket for rest and sitting in a metal chair. I ain't too steady but I hold my breath, release it slowly then hold and fire. I am gonna keep shooting for now, and will be after coyote's next week. If I can shoot it good enough to stop a yote then a whitetail will be good. Thank again for all the help, a few kind word in the right direction really helps a lot.
I’m guessing it gets a diet of factory ammo? Which means it would be way, WAY SUB 1MOA with hand loads. Yeah... I really wouldn’t worry too much about it. I’ll tell ya a seek-it’.... I don’t even HAVE a borescope! NOPE! And I’ve been Gunsmithing/Repairing/building for quite a few years! I know what to look for when a firearm has poor accuracy. And unless the gun has a few thousand rounds through it, I DON’T start by looking at the barrel. Now if it’s old had SEVERAL thousand rounds, either the lands,grooves & throat will look quite worn with naked eye or I’m just gonna replace it any-hoo!
Honestly, shoot & clean as normal. Get a decent Copper Solvent (as we’ve been discussing), and if you want to continue using the borescope, by all means... have fun with it. But don’t worry about what the bore “looks” like. ESPECIALLY when is shooting consistently good. You Pick’n up what I’m Put’n down, my friend?
Thanks again and I will shoot it till there is a sign that something is wrong like groups opening up. I will continue to clean too and I don't own a bore scope, just a flashlight shining down through the other end. Thank you and everyone for your help.I’m guessing it gets a diet of factory ammo? Which means it would be way, WAY SUB 1MOA with hand loads. Yeah... I really wouldn’t worry too much about it. I’ll tell ya a seek-it’.... I don’t even HAVE a borescope! NOPE! And I’ve been Gunsmithing/Repairing/building for quite a few years! I know what to look for when a firearm has poor accuracy. And unless the gun has a few thousand rounds through it, I DON’T start by looking at the barrel. Now if it’s old had SEVERAL thousand rounds, either the lands,grooves & throat will look quite worn with naked eye or I’m just gonna replace it any-hoo!
Honestly, shoot & clean as normal. Get a decent Copper Solvent (as we’ve been discussing), and if you want to continue using the borescope, by all means... have fun with it. But don’t worry about what the bore “looks” like. ESPECIALLY when is shooting consistently good. You Pick’n up what I’m Put’n down, my friend?
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