?? Boyds pro varm. - no pillar/bedding (thoughts) ??

[ice tea]

Thinking about a Boyds PV. Anyone here mounted/used theres for a while, before they did any work to it (pillared/Bedded etc.) ? If so, did any the wood get deformed, or anything compromised in a neg. way by mounting/ use, that effected your extra work put into it. In other words, any think of any drawbacks in using it raw , before doing the support work. Any thoughts would be appreciated.
This is for a 12FV, correct me if wrong, selections for this would be: 12 bolt release, center feed, blind mag, bull barrel. Thanks

[charlie b]

I used mine 'raw' for about 1000 rounds. Keep in mind this is a .223 Axis so it isn't stressing the stock at all. I later bedded it with JB Weld. Did not see a difference in accuracy before and after. But, it was shooting 0.5MOA raw, and that is about as good as I can shoot. So, if it 'improved' I'll never know since I am the limiting factor.

PS if you have plastic bottom hardware then I'd suggest upgrading to metal trigger guard and such. The plastic did not give repeatable torque values for me.

[CFJunkie]

I know that some people just prefer wood stocks, but all I am interested in is accuracy so a synthetic stock doesn't bother me, as long as they have an aluminum stabilizer in the stock.

I chose an Oryx chassis for both of my 12 FVs, one in .223 and one in 6.5mm CM.
I decided on the Oryx because the synthetic factory stock on the 12 FV 6.5mm CM twisted on every shot (no aluminum stabilizer like in the Accu-Stocks).
I liked the Oryx so much that I bought another one for the .223.

The Orxy also is set up for AICS detachable mags, so the hidden magazine issues disappear.
The .223 hidden mag on the 12 FV is good, but the 1/2 inch spacer in the bolt made it difficult for me to load bullets that are loaded to be close to the lands. Geezers like me have fingers that aren't as nimble as you younger shooters. That was another reason I went with the Oryx for the .223 even though its factory stock didn't flex.
I found a slight improvement in accuracy with both rifles.
I actually saw more improvement with the .223 12 FV in the Oryx stock than with the 6.5mm CM, but both showed accuracy improvement.
I can't explain why the .223 showed more improvement, but, for me, the Oryx just allows me to set up more consistently with both rifles.

[Dave Hoback]

Many find wood stocks very beautiful, but they offer no performance gain over a synthetic stock or Aluminum Chassis. Raw wood will always present the opportunity for creep. I am not one who believes in “tuning” Action screws. I believe they should be tight enough to not allow creep, yet not so tight as to introduce fatiguing torque. The problem with wood, it can & WILL creep. As Charlie pointed out, not too much a concern with lighter cartridges. But will continue getting worse with the more powerful the caliber/cartridge. Not to mention the warping/bending/twisting game that moister, heat & humidity can play on wood. Even pillared & bedded, wood offers no performance enhancement over its synthetic/metallic brethren.

I know many love their wood stocks & knife handles, as they do leather sheaths & holsters. But for over two decades I have been a fan of synthetics & billet aluminum for the proven performance increase. Although, I’m even more of a fan of going with your choice. Look at the shooting you will be doing, and get what makes you happy. The point of all this is enjoyment after all.

[ice tea]

CHARLIE, I'm not familar w/ way axis mounts, or if you meant it was low stress because its only a .223. I'm intending to put this on a .223 also, byt the nxt one will be 308. I've had these different FV's for two yrs, and had to wait for swfa scopes etc., and just been busy, and want to use/enjoy them for a while, before putting to much time/effort in them. So what your saying sounds like i can mount it and shoot. The metal guards are steel. thanks

CF JUNKIE I remeber you well, and have read your detailed findings/results. Two yrs ago, I was less than a day away from ordering a $1200 savage, and what you were saying, changed my mind in to getting three 12FV's instead, so your the reason I'm faced w/ this issue LOL, :) . Nathan also shares your thoughts. I dont think I can enjoy a chasis though. I held one similar to the oryx in a store, and it just dont feel right. I also dont like the feel or a AR. I dont think anyone can argue the reasons you gave for accuracy/practicality.

DAVE I understand what your saying, and agree. It took me yrs to accept plastic, instead of wood. Part reason, I accepted plastic, was the laminated wood these days , isnt what i think as wood. So, I been through 4 choate tacticals this summer. Everyone of them had a problem, and have sent them back. I dont want to see a fifth one, and I dont think Choate or its distributors want to see me either. I'm not talking cosmetic problems either. What I will say, is the people at Choate are good people, as there distrbutors, and covered shipping costs, and didnt try to deny the problems.. So I think the next step in plastic that has similar form, would be the HS Precision, and then we need a bottom metal/mag, so $700 is alot to add to the once cheap priced 12fv. So I'm still open for other reccomendations/sugggestions of a similar shaped plastic stock, but a Boyds wood for under 200 dollars, it sounds up my alley. Ii live in a relatively dry climate, Also, I think it will be a good learning experiance for me to screw around w/ bedding/pillars etc. Maybe this winter I can find the spare time for that. Thanks for the replies.

[charlie b]

Yes, not much stress cause it is a .223. Also, the Axis has (until recently) a separate piece of steel that works as a recoil lug, not permanently attached to the stock or action. Kind of like a keyway on an motor shaft. I understand the newer Axis has the lug fixed in the stock. Neither of which, to me, is a great solution. One reason I won't buy another Axis.

And, yes, with the 110 action I'd just install and shoot. Then decide if you want to install pillars and/or bed the action. For the .308 I'd probably bed at least the recoil lug area.

FWIW, there have been some of the Boyd's laminate stocks delaminate with use. Pillars and/or bedding will probably reduce the likelyhood of that happening.

[hamiltonkiler]

It’s to easy not to bed. All you need is JB weld and a drill with a bit set.
Painters tape..
I’ve never see a need to do a full bed job. The front of the action and recoil lug will do the trick.
Cheers


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Dave Hoback]

I’ve known some to do that...just the front. But the fact remains doing BOTH from/rear Action screws takes away all doubt. It’s important that NO gap is present between receiver bed & Action. I even did a skim bedding on my MDT Chassis.

To the OP, I hear what you are saying about “playing” with action screw torque. I’ve already touched on this; we are battling the harmonics BECAUSE of creep, not in spite of it. As long as the mating between Action & Stock is solid & void of creep, it would not matter if you strapped a TUNING FORK to the Action, LOL!

[ice tea]

JW - thank you for the explanation. Looking at the area my top bolt release lever needs for clearance vs the amount Boyds milled out of my right rear support pad, the amount material removed, is excessive. Looking at google pics of bottom bolt release, it appears the stocks void or button for release, is centered at front of trigger guard. That makes me wonder, if, maybe, the stocks made for bottom bolt release, might have both complete rear support pads, and the void/hole, would be more centered in stock? I'm not trying to argue w/ you that what your saying about rear supports role level in this, but I'm now wondering if I'd rather have a unneccessary hole in middle if it dont cause other issues, rather than the right rear support mostly missing?

HAMILTON - i agree from what I gather from videos, and whats being said. i love JB Weld, I've used it for multiple diff things over the yrs. the stuff is great. What my plan was, mount/shoot this one as is, for the 223. If I liked it, immediatly order another for the 308, and pillar and bed newset one from the get go. And, if successful happy, with the 308 pillar/bed, then I could come back, and do the .223/current stock I just received.

DAVE - thanks, I want no gap b/t reeiver bed and action w/o creep also. I wish I could post the pics of how little suport area I'm dealing w/ on back right. Last time I tried hard to post pics, I couldn't make them appear/upload. I might try again tommorrow.

[Dave Hoback]

Did you see my comments on using ImgBB to host pictures? It's really easy man. You don't need to join or even send them your email! Are you using a PC or your smart phone? I'm always online on my IPhone. But either way, just go here download your pics from the memory on your pc or phone drive. https://imgbb.com/ Then click the picture and on the left side under the picture will be a drop down arrow with the word "About" in front of the arrows. Click that. There will be several links. You want to copy the "BBCode" link. And paste it here. It's super easy! And doesn't cost the site wasted memory as it's "3rd party hosted".

[ice tea]

https://ibb.co/QdDXtM2
https://ibb.co/0jXh63q
https://ibb.co/PMPdGwT
https://ibb.co/tXDvNZt

Dave, thank you, I'm not too computer literate, and I just have a cheap laptop. I decided to try to fit/mount the thing. The rear safety tang, is making contact w/o any screw torque to speak of, so I take it, sanding the stock is the thing to do there? Bolt handle wont quite drop/lock, cuz some wood removal will be needed in front of handle, as the stocks notch is too far back. There is some sort of washer in front action screw hole, which i think is a hard plastic, its got a funny concave contour to it, not sure if thats right for a cap screw to seat, or if plastic is the thing to use there ? My savage "L" shaped clip thats slotted for rear action screw, needs to be forced in to hold mag assembly down, as box is a tight fit lengthwise. I will also need to probably use a dremel w/ a barrel shaped abrasive, to widen trigger guard valley. So, I'll do all that as spoke, unless someone has cautions/suggests diff/better ideas. Everything else looks to fit well. Thanks again for the pic posting help, as, I think this will be helpful even more to me, when I get to pillaring/bedding