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Thread: Highest quality aftermarket Savage replacement barrels

  1. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shooter0302 View Post
    Are you saying you think Shilen gets it's barrels from L.W ??
    EXPLAIN WHAT YOU MEANT BY WHAT YOU SAID.
    I'm not sure of their source name but I know they source the steel exclusively from on source

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  2. #27
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    i think criterion in prefit,
    but i doubt i would go for a prefit on any rifle i want to be top notch. close but not top.
    spend the bucks get a none nut fitted bbl.
    6mm what is your plan ? 6br/6bra/6dasher are all excellent choices.
    some of the names listed are not top IMHO
    try krieger lilja bartlien
    for a list of top bbl makers go to the top of accuracy..bench rest, look at bbl in the top 10/20 from big matches.

  3. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by mikeinco View Post
    i think criterion in prefit,
    but i doubt i would go for a prefit on any rifle i want to be top notch. close but not top.
    spend the bucks get a none nut fitted bbl.
    6mm what is your plan ? 6br/6bra/6dasher are all excellent choices.
    some of the names listed are not top IMHO
    try krieger lilja bartlien
    for a list of top bbl makers go to the top of accuracy..bench rest, look at bbl in the top 10/20 from big matches.
    This is a list of most popular barrels, and some other specs, used in the Precision Rifle Series (PRS) for reference -

    https://precisionrifleblog.com/2019/...ifle-barrel-2/

  4. #29
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    the question was 'HIGHEST QUALITY", not most popular. so look at highest accuracy shooting.

    but that data is skewed based on that series,not on accuracy.
    you have to carry the rifle, shoot at large targets(compared to br) and some of those are prefit bbl i think( maybe not).
    like i said look at benchrest results for the most accurate bbls.

    )QUOTE=jkv45;479138]This is a list of most popular barrels, and some other specs, used in the Precision Rifle Series (PRS) for reference -

    https://precisionrifleblog.com/2019/...ifle-barrel-2/[/QUOTE]

  5. #30
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    Thanks guys, great info.

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    Quote Originally Posted by mikeinco View Post
    the question was 'HIGHEST QUALITY", not most popular. so look at highest accuracy shooting.

    but that data is skewed based on that series,not on accuracy.
    you have to carry the rifle, shoot at large targets(compared to br) and some of those are prefit bbl i think( maybe not).
    like i said look at benchrest results for the most accurate bbls.

    )QUOTE=jkv45;479138]This is a list of most popular barrels, and some other specs, used in the Precision Rifle Series (PRS) for reference -

    https://precisionrifleblog.com/2019/...ifle-barrel-2/
    Jeez...sorry. I though there may be some useful info in there.

    Guess not...

  7. #32
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    so i went to the equipment list to a state br match from last year of the top 13 shooters
    1 bartlien ( number 1)
    10 kriegers
    1 shilien
    1 wiliams

    is that a clue ?

  8. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by jkv45 View Post
    Jeez...sorry. I though there may be some useful info in there.

    Guess not...
    I know right. That's what you get for trying to help.

  9. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by mikeinco View Post
    the question was 'HIGHEST QUALITY", not most popular. so look at highest accuracy shooting.

    but that data is skewed based on that series,not on accuracy.
    you have to carry the rifle, shoot at large targets(compared to br) and some of those are prefit bbl i think( maybe not).
    like i said look at benchrest results for the most accurate bbls.

    )QUOTE=jkv45;479138]This is a list of most popular barrels, and some other specs, used in the Precision Rifle Series (PRS) for reference -

    https://precisionrifleblog.com/2019/...ifle-barrel-2/
    [/QUOTE]Look at top 2 with most awards and trophies

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    again..that discipline is NOT ABOUT TOP ACCURACY.
    it is a shooting GAME where only better than average shooting is required because of other parts of the game.

    if middle of the road is fine with you then pick anything .
    the question is "highest quality" not middle of the road.
    proof has never shot bench rest small groups ...and bench rest guys have tried


    Look at top 2 with most awards and trophies

    Sent from my SM-N975U using Tapatalk[/QUOTE]

  11. #36
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    I know without hesitation I go with shilen or criterion every time. Never had anything less than flawless products from either.. only caveat I'd give about shilen is make sure you look at the grade you are getting, they have match and select match, select is the top notch of their line ,.lapped till they gleam, no tooling marks,

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    Quote Originally Posted by mikeinco View Post
    again..that discipline is NOT ABOUT TOP ACCURACY.
    it is a shooting GAME where only better than average shooting is required because of other parts of the game.

    if middle of the road is fine with you then pick anything .
    the question is "highest quality" not middle of the road.
    proof has never shot bench rest small groups ...and bench rest guys have tried

    Look at top 2 with most awards and trophies
    It sounds like you know the right answer to the question.

    Why don't you just tell us so we all know?

  13. #38
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    I think Mike is taking the highest quality discussion to a higher level. The Bench Rest and the F/Class(Belly Benchrest) community have very high expectations from their barrels. Nothing like the vast majority of us. In that competitive realm there are a few barrel makers and a small group of gunsmiths that continuously produce winners in high level competition.

    If you look at some forums you will see sellers with a good supply of barrel blanks. Those are often culls from a larger order to find the ones with the least flaws. It does not mean those barrels are bad it simply means that statistically those flaws could be a contributing factor to the loss of accuracy and precision. It might even come down to the mill certs(traceable quality) on a run of blanks being the best.
    The Dunning-Kruger effect is alive and well.

  14. #39
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    i do not know....
    define replacement bbl
    i thread and chamber bbls...that is a replacement bbl to me.
    it you mean prefit....that is a whole 'nother can of worms.
    i am thinking about a drop in on a 308 single shot, but most likely will buy a blank and thread and chamber it.
    o am not applying pure benchrest standards, but industry standards for top ot the line precision bbls.
    the SEAL MK 13 uses a lija custom profile bbl but not be standards as these guns are shot in the mud and dirt.
    function and quality are required. if i remember correctly these are required to be just under moa at 600 yards.

    but the question was still...the best, not almost or what can i afford.

    Quote Originally Posted by Robinhood View Post
    I think Mike is taking the highest quality discussion to a higher level. The Bench Rest and the F/Class(Belly Benchrest) community have very high expectations from their barrels. Nothing like the vast majority of us. In that competitive realm there are a few barrel makers and a small group of gunsmiths that continuously produce winners in high level competition.

    If you look at some forums you will see sellers with a good supply of barrel blanks. Those are often culls from a larger order to find the ones with the least flaws. It does not mean those barrels are bad it simply means that statistically those flaws could be a contributing factor to the loss of accuracy and precision. It might even come down to the mill certs(traceable quality) on a run of blanks being the best.

  15. #40
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    "Barrels don't set records.....shooters set records." -George Kelbly
    "As long as there's lead in the air....there's still hope.."

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    I still say it’s not a question of “The Top shooters use such & such a barrel because it’s the best”, but rather “Such & such a barrel is at the top BECAUSE the best shooters are using it!”


    Several manufacturers have had their name at the top...Shilen, Krieger, Bartlein... In the end people are quite brand loyal. And those of us in rank & file love to mimic our professional heros, LOL.


    I stated a bit, but I’ll go further. As I have a considerable knowledge of steels/alloys and such, and over the last many years have taken research & study with manufacturers techniques. Beyond the brochure/commercial “Gotchya” statements like 400ModBB Material, or Ratchet Rifling.... Our US barrel manufacturers do NOT make their own steel (or cone up with new kinds!). They buy it from the huge steel processors...Nucor, Carpenter, Hesteel, etc. And once again, barrel manufacturers use the SAME machines, which they also buy. And anymore, you can’t even give the nod to the machinist...as barrels are ALL made via CNC machines. When we come down to it, the top quality single point cut barrels are virtually the same.


    The Gunsmith doing the chambering is of much higher importance I would think.

  17. #42
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    Eric Cortina shoots Brux. He is the captain of the Team Lapua F-Class Open team. He is now dabbling in PRS. Very honest about sucking at it. Watch his videos and how he has been asked by top shooters about sharing information. The last video is an interview of the guy that the Redding S Die is named after.

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    kelbly makes actions and rifles...HE BUYS BBLS...
    THE QUOTE IS NOT A BIG DEAL.
    someone must pull the trigger.
    chose your shooting game, then pick your equipment.
    Quote Originally Posted by sharpshooter View Post
    "Barrels don't set records.....shooters set records." -George Kelbly

  19. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by Orezona View Post
    Eric Cortina shoots Brux. He is the captain of the Team Lapua F-Class Open team. He is now dabbling in PRS. Very honest about sucking at it. Watch his videos and how he has been asked by top shooters about sharing information. The last video is an interview of the guy that the Redding S Die is named after.

    Who was it? Speedy?
    The Dunning-Kruger effect is alive and well.

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    i disagree in that there are bbl makers and then there are artist, and the same of gunsmiths. all produce very good bbls and most are very good gunsmiths but only a hand full of each set records year in and year out.
    the big picture in shooting is it is a SHOOTING SYSTEM.
    the RIFLE must be capable of the task...purpose built for the game.
    the AMMO must be crafted to extract all from the rifle at the ranges shot and targets size of the game.
    the SHOOTER must have the basic skills to compete at the top level, typically called experience.
    and excellent gunsmith cannot make a silk purse out of a sows ear...and there are more sows ears than there are excellent bbls.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dave Hoback View Post
    I still say it’s not a question of “The Top shooters use such & such a barrel because it’s the best”, but rather “Such & such a barrel is at the top BECAUSE the best shooters are using it!”


    Several manufacturers have had their name at the top...Shilen, Krieger, Bartlein... In the end people are quite brand loyal. And those of us in rank & file love to mimic our professional heros, LOL.


    I stated a bit, but I’ll go further. As I have a considerable knowledge of steels/alloys and such, and over the last many years have taken research & study with manufacturers techniques. Beyond the brochure/commercial “Gotchya” statements like 400ModBB Material, or Ratchet Rifling.... Our US barrel manufacturers do NOT make their own steel (or cone up with new kinds!). They buy it from the huge steel processors...Nucor, Carpenter, Hesteel, etc. And once again, barrel manufacturers use the SAME machines, which they also buy. And anymore, you can’t even give the nod to the machinist...as barrels are ALL made via CNC machines. When we come down to it, the top quality single point cut barrels are virtually the same.


    The Gunsmith doing the chambering is of much higher importance I would think.

  21. #46
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    ....and not all barrels are cut on the same machine. There are several names that do gun drilling and lapping machines as well as old P$W to newer CNC cut rifling and ones that do button rifling
    The Dunning-Kruger effect is alive and well.

  22. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by mikeinco View Post
    i disagree in that there are bbl makers and then there are artist, and the same of gunsmiths. all produce very good bbls and most are very good gunsmiths but only a hand full of each set records year in and year out.
    the big picture in shooting is it is a SHOOTING SYSTEM.
    the RIFLE must be capable of the task...purpose built for the game.
    the AMMO must be crafted to extract all from the rifle at the ranges shot and targets size of the game.
    the SHOOTER must have the basic skills to compete at the top level, typically called experience.
    and excellent gunsmith cannot make a silk purse out of a sows ear...and there are more sows ears than there are excellent bbls.

    Nope! Has nothing to do with experience. You can shoot 12 hours a day, 7 days a week for 50 years.... and you will STILL not be as good as the top shooters in the world. Shooting is a task like anything else. Looking at anything, shooting...sports... whatever. While constant & prolonged practice will make you VERY GOOD, you still will not be as good as someone who has the natural ability. Do you need the best equipment? Of course. I’m not one of these people who thinks a professional could take a 2nd hand Mosin Nagant and best an Amateur with a custom built rig... of course not. I’m talking level playing fields, no amount will of repetition will somehow give you that “natural” skill. As for disagreeing with the barrel making. What you say was true 100 years ago. Not anymore. I suggest you brush up on CNC.

    Makes me think about people (with an ignorance) believe that “Knifesmiths” make a BETTER knife. Well yeah...to a point. An exceptional Knifesmith vs an amateur and both Forging blades. I’m a professional custom knife Maker...not a knifesmith. I am not an artist. I make truly high performance knives with modern high alloy tool steels, via stock removal. (I take a piece of steel and grind away everything that isn’t a knife) My knives don’t use pattern welded steel with Ebony Burl hardwood & such. Yet my blades will outperform ANY forged knife...PERIOD! Sorry it’s off topic. Just your comment reminded me of this. These are characteristics I’ve found many Gunsmiths & Knifesmiths to share. And I’m the first one TALKING about the BS they share!

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    so explain to me
    a guy builds a long range benchrest rifle for 600/1000 yard benchrest.
    works up a load with a new unknown bullet
    has never shot in a 600 yard benchrest match
    and walks away from his FIRST 600 yard match
    as a NATIONAL CHAMP.
    BOTTOM LINE IS WE DISAGREE AND IN THE USA IT IS ALLOWED.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dave Hoback View Post
    Nope! Has nothing to do with experience. You can shoot 12 hours a day, 7 days a week for 50 years.... and you will STILL not be as good as the top shooters in the world. Shooting is a task like anything else. Looking at anything, shooting...sports... whatever. While constant & prolonged practice will make you VERY GOOD, you still will not be as good as someone who has the natural ability. Do you need the best equipment? Of course. I’m not one of these people who thinks a professional could take a 2nd hand Mosin Nagant and best an Amateur with a custom built rig... of course not. I’m talking level playing fields, no amount will of repetition will somehow give you that “natural” skill. As for disagreeing with the barrel making. What you say was true 100 years ago. Not anymore. I suggest you brush up on CNC.

    Makes me think about people (with an ignorance) believe that “Knifesmiths” make a BETTER knife. Well yeah...to a point. An exceptional Knifesmith vs an amateur and both Forging blades. I’m a professional custom knife Maker...not a knifesmith. I am not an artist. I make truly high performance knives with modern high alloy tool steels, via stock removal. (I take a piece of steel and grind away everything that isn’t a knife) My knives don’t use pattern welded steel with Ebony Burl hardwood & such. Yet my blades will outperform ANY forged knife...PERIOD! Sorry it’s off topic. Just your comment reminded me of this. These are characteristics I’ve found many Gunsmiths & Knifesmiths to share. And I’m the first one TALKING about the BS they share!

  24. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robinhood View Post
    Who was it? Speedy?
    Yes sir! Great interview.

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    Quote Originally Posted by mikeinco View Post
    so explain to me
    a guy builds a long range benchrest rifle for 600/1000 yard benchrest.
    works up a load with a new unknown bullet
    has never shot in a 600 yard benchrest match
    and walks away from his FIRST 600 yard match
    as a NATIONAL CHAMP.
    BOTTOM LINE IS WE DISAGREE AND IN THE USA IT IS ALLOWED.

    You just agreed with me there Mike. You said guy NEVER shot that competition... So he has Natural Ability.

    I agree with you either way. About it being OK to disagree. That’s typically my line.... usually said when the person debating me loses their ISH and resorts to insults. Not usually after a single back & forth. But anyway.

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