Bolt Head Interchange

[Gunracr]

I apologize if this is a repeat question but I could not find any threads about it. I want to make some very accurate measurements of bullet ogive to the lands. The best way to do this is by removing the firing pin, ejector, and extractor from the bolt to allow for the best “feel” of when the bullet touches the lands. I am a bit leery of knocking out that tiny pin holding the ejector on a regular basis so I have an alternate plan. Just use a stripped bolt head in place of my normal one. My question (you knew I’d get to it eventually) is this: are Savage bolt heads dimensionally consistent enough for this to work? I realize that the spring tension of the floating bolt head my make the whole thing moot but I want to see if it will work.

[Robinhood]

The critical dimensions of the two bol theads would need to be identical. The one being used in the firearm and the one you use to test with.

You could remove the BAS and use the firing pin to old the cross-pin in place and then use the bolt close method. Works for me every time. There are several ways to skin this cat.

[mnbogboy2]

I learned this method watching a u-tube video. Of coarse it was on a Rem or clone style action. The PE cam caused a small audible "click" as the bullet pulled free of the lands. They kept shortening the dummy round until no "click" was present. These actions had nothing interfering with the bolt so it could actually free fall.
In order to accomplish this on a Savage you must remove the ejector, remove the cocking pin and cocking sleeve from the bolt. Also the wave washer. Reinstall the firing pin to hold the crosspin. But the real "pita" is the removal of the detent balls & spring in the rear baffle.
The bolt will then be in "free fall". The rear baffle will be flopping around, secure it lightly to the action with a small piece of tape. (I have a spare "stripped" rear baffle for this use).
You do need the extractor in place for this method. I believe it is called the "Wheeler" method. It works well and you will feel the slightest "click" when the PE removes the bullet from the lands.
Also I agree with Robin the bolt heads would have to be perfect. After you remove the ejector a few times it will become second nature and is no big deal.
Search for the u-tube video you will be amazed.

[Fuj']

Using my split case method for many years, and found it was a waste of
time to remove anything.....On extraction, I hold my hand over the port.
Once the case head has released, I just tilt the rifle and let the dummy
roll onto my hand. I don't over think it. My plus or minus tolerance is +.001
-.001

[Nor Cal Mikie]

"Using my split case method for many years, and found it was a waste of time to remove anything"

Think about it. All the extractor does is snap over the case rim and hold it against the bolt head.
When you slide the bolt into the action body, it's COCKED and the firing pin doesn't stick out beyond the bolt head surface. Wasted efforts. What it comes down to is "what ever makes you feel good".
Out of maybe 10/12+ barrel swaps, never removed anything from the bolt head. And if the ejector has enough strength to push the case sideways in the chamber, you've got more problems than a too strong ejector spring.
I always a Hornady tool with a modified case to set the OAL and find the lands on my ammo. Got cases for each caliber I shoot.
Did run into a situation a while back that gave me pause. Sent a couple cases off to Hornady to have modified. Got them back and the bullet wouldn't slide in the neck??? We always do them that way??? Except for ALL the cases they had previously modified for me.
Had a go round with the folks about that so just maybe a "split neck" case may be the better way to go, depending on availability. YMMV.

[Robinhood]

For those of you that use the Hornady set up, Have you ever checked the case headspace and compared it to your sized case? When I found one at .010 shorter I started making my own.

[GaCop]

Using my split case method for many years, and found it was a waste of
time to remove anything.....On extraction, I hold my hand over the port.
Once the case head has released, I just tilt the rifle and let the dummy
roll onto my hand. I don't over think it. My plus or minus tolerance is +.001
-.001

Been doing it that way for years when I don't happen to have the modified case.

[GaCop]

I learned this method watching a u-tube video. Of coarse it was on a Rem or clone style action. The PE cam caused a small audible "click" as the bullet pulled free of the lands. They kept shortening the dummy round until no "click" was present. These actions had nothing interfering with the bolt so it could actually free fall.
In order to accomplish this on a Savage you must remove the ejector, remove the cocking pin and cocking sleeve from the bolt. Also the wave washer. Reinstall the firing pin to hold the crosspin. But the real "pita" is the removal of the detent balls & spring in the rear baffle.
The bolt will then be in "free fall". The rear baffle will be flopping around, secure it lightly to the action with a small piece of tape. (I have a spare "stripped" rear baffle for this use).
You do need the extractor in place for this method. I believe it is called the "Wheeler" method. It works well and you will feel the slightest "click" when the PE removes the bullet from the lands.
Also I agree with Robin the bolt heads would have to be perfect. After you remove the ejector a few times it will become second nature and is no big deal.
Search for the u-tube video you will be amazed.

[Ted_Feasel]

If I understand your objective correctly, why not just use one of these and the comparator set?

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[Ted_Feasel]

Something else I've consistently found, even in bergers, smk, eld, every pill I've bought, when you measure the base of the pill to the ogive, i have had as much as .003 variation in the same lot of pills so I started measuring and sorting the pills themselves to get my loads as close as possible. I only do this on ammo I'm loading for competition

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[Ted_Feasel]

I watched that video and I remember my dad and uncle doing something real similar to that when I was a kid just learning

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[Ted_Feasel]

Just throw this out there.. sometime when you have a box of pills.. measure from the base of the pill to the ogive..sierra, hornady and bergers I have always found as much as .003 variation .. belive it or not the best I've found is the new hornady Atips.. i guess my point is the inconsistency in where the ogive is can add to the difference in readings... not saying it is the only factor but definitely plays a part.

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[Fuj']

Just throw this out there.. sometime when you have a box of pills.. measure from the base of the pill to the ogive..sierra, hornady and bergers I have always found as much as .003 variation .. belive it or not the best I've found is the new hornady Atips.. i guess my point is the inconsistency in where the ogive is can add to the difference in readings... not saying it is the only factor but definitely plays a part.

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Right you are, and why I use a Holland comparator for my anal stuff. I've also
read that the A-tips have been consistent and probably from the fact that the
lot batches are directly packaged as they come off the press. Buddy tells me
that they ship a cloth to wipe the oil off as you receive them !!

Holland comparator.....Not real cheap, but a good tool.

[Ted_Feasel]

Right you are, and why I use a Holland comparator for my anal stuff. I've also
read that the A-tips have been consistent and probably from the fact that the
lot batches are directly packaged as they come off the press. Buddy tells me
that they ship a cloth to wipe the oil off as you receive them !!

Holland comparator.....Not real cheap, but a good tool.

Yes sir, I dont have the Holland, ive found what the chambers are on my rifles, at least within the variation you may get but because I start with the deepest or default and work my way out until I find what I'm looking for.. i guess it would be neat to know the precise distance.
I have 2 boxes of the atips but have not had the time to do load dev with them. They are very nice, you can tell a great deal of pride and craftsmanship went into the atip.. i love that they are sequinchely packaged into their own slot. I picked out 10 just to see how consistent they are and the 10 i measured were all identical as far as my 49 year old eyes could see on dial cals.. they are mitutoyo my daddy passed down. Very accurate.

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