Reply With QuoteThat brass is really soft. My uneducated theory is that is the key to the stuff. If those or the 168 FGMM doesn’t shoot in a .308, nothing else is going to either.
Im posting this for new reloaders looking for a load that can put them around .5 MOA without much trouble. This is not a load worked up through a ladder test or OCW. It is an exact copy of the old FGMM 175 SMK.
The 308 175 SMK FGMM Ammo was sleuthed several years ago by a well known man in the reloading industry. According to a YT video(posted below) the powder is 4064. The brass is Federal Gold Medal Match and a Federal 210M Primer.
The group I am posting was after 2 shots zeroing. Cooled down for two hours. (For all of you CSI guys it was not intentional to wait two hours) Posting results for 8 shots. Top left is cold bore. Shot 6 bottom right, was after cease fire, the rifle was in a bit of a bind and the shot was made without reestablishing rifle position or grip. Not making excuses but pointing out the potential of reloaded FC FGMM brass weighed within .5 grains before prep, FGMM 210M primers, and 41.75 + .02 grains of IMR 4064 seated to 2.820. There was no load workup ladder test or other method. Federals Match recipe was copied to the letter. This was not a serious shooting session and I was surprised by the outcome.
If you take out the cold bore and the pulled shot there are 6 shots in the neighborhood of 5/16". If you are looking for a load that will shoot in your 308 without having to do a load workup this maybe what you are looking for. It requires you to get close and stay consistent with your charge weights.
If you have been reloading for competition for 80 years this may not apply to you.
Much of this post was modified to better demonstrate the intention of the post
Sleuth video
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iDIu6Mivi-Y
The Dunning-Kruger effect is alive and well.
That brass is really soft. My uneducated theory is that is the key to the stuff. If those or the 168 FGMM doesn’t shoot in a .308, nothing else is going to either.
That is why the FGMM factory ammos are often referred to as the 'gold standard' of .308 factory ammo.
If you reload, you ought to try Sierra's Tipped Match King bullets in your .308.
If you load them out to the same jump, the tips make the O.A.L. a bit too long for some magazines.
Maybe that is why you don't see them used in factory ammo, but the TMKs shoot even more accurately than the SMKs.
In my two .308 Savages, the powder-bullet combinations with 155, 168, 175 and 195 TMKs hold the top 12 places on my powder-bullet combination list.
The order is different with each rifle but the TMKs outshoot any other combination in both rifles.
And the .224 calibers, the 69 and 77 grain TMKs also dominate the .223 powder-bullet list as well, but my ARs need to shoot them with single round followers because the mags can't handle the overall length needed to get their real accuracy. My Savage bolt actions don't have that limitation and shoot the lights out with the 69s because they are limited by their 1:9 twists. My Les Baer Super Varmint with a 1:8 twists shoots both the 69 gr and 77 gr TMKs better than any other bullets if they are seated out about 0.050 to 0.070 further than the SMKs.
Try some 4320, and don't bother weighing them. lolOriginally Posted by Robinhood
Dan Newberry sleuthed the 308 175 SMK FGMM Ammo several years ago. I have no idea what the powder is today but according to his YT video(posted below) it is 4064. Posting results for 8 shots.
Top left is cold bore. Shot 6 bottom right, the rifle was in a bit of a bind and the shot was made without reestablishing rifle position or grip. Not making excuses but pointing out the potential of reloaded FC FGMM brass weighed within .5 grains before prep, FGMM 210M primers, and 41.75 + .02 grains of IMR 4064 seated to 2.820. There was no load workup. Shot in a 28" Criterion 10 TW heavy barrel with at least 2500 rounds, Choate stock and tuned Accutrigger with a F/class sinclair bipod. Just load and shoot.
If you take out the cold bore and the pulled shot there are 6 shots in the neighborhood of 5/16". If you are looking for a load that will shoot in your 308 without having to do a load workup this maybe what you are looking for. It requires you to get close and stay consistent with your charge weights.
Dan Newberry's video.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iDIu6Mivi-Y
Thanks for the suggestions and input. I am a High Master shooter at 600 and a Master at 1000 with a 308. Not a champion or anything like that, but I do have a copious amount of experience with the 308. From 155 class to 190's and everything in between.
This post was more for some of our newer members searching for a load. The photo showing the potential of that load....almost a sure thing in many 308 rifles. Not a great group mind you but for someone throwing some test loads in a well put together tool in a cheap stock for a fun outing, not bad. There was even a guy shooting an ar10 with a muzzle break next to me blowing my hat off.
I'm sure if every bullet and every cartridge was inspected, most could shoot High Master scores at 300 and maybe 600. No bullet sorting just accurate charge weights. For those who shoot competitively, have the resources and understand how to do a load workup weather it be ladder test, Dan's process, or whatever, this post probably does not apply.
The Dunning-Kruger effect is alive and well.
Well could it also be that the only real difference between lets say you and the champ, might be the conditions at the time he became champ?
If he had shot on a different relay on the same day, might it be safe to say it could have affected his being the champ?
This is what troubles me the most about "accuracy" and long range.
Champ today, also ran there after at least until somebody else becomes champ for the day.
Weve all heard the expression that "sometimes they gits blown out, and sometimes they gits blown in".
Im afraid im of the "gits blown in camp" as for records and champs at long range. lol
actually the results show why to run from dans expensive wasteful method if shooting a known rifle with a known cartridge.
lots of known starting points for 308.
i am shooting 185's in a 10(FP ??) using FED cases and n140. no issues with the 3" x ring at 600 yards.
load development was short and sweet, a short ladder, a couple of 3/5 shot groups, confirmed at 600.
done
this is a used rifle with unknown history..great trade
What does any of that have to do with the FGMM 175 SMK copycat load? I shoot 185's too. I use a different powder than you but this is not a 185 Custom load post. It is not even a competition oriented post. This is not an experience national champion load post. I didn't post that because this was about the FGMM 175 SMK load.
There are a but load of guys that shoot 300 or less that are always looking for a load for their 308 that will hold .5" group plus or minus. This is it.
If you want to post your recipe with a picture of your results, go for it. Outside of that all the chest beating is meaningless. I don't think you too even read post before you start urinating all over you computers.
The Dunning-Kruger effect is alive and well.
Plus 1
Life is tuff.....its even tuffer when your stupid
{John Wayne}
What does your 1-9 .223 do with the 77gn smk?
Mine shoots it well to 600yds null wind.
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hamiltonkiler,So I haven't tried either of the 77 gr SMKs or TMKs with the 1:9 twist rifles when their accuracy started to fade with 73 and 75 grain bullets in both rifles.
All the data I have seen says the 77s won't stabilize with a 1:9 twist.
Based upon that experience and the stabilization predictions, I have kept my 77 gr SMKs and TMKs for my 1:8 twist that shoots them very accurately.But with your results with a 1:9 twist, I may try some 77 gr SMKs and TMKs with the 1:twists just to see if it was the bullet type not the bullet weight.
The shape of the smk or the ogive of the bullet makes it far more forgiving than other bullets in that weight range. I would start with a box of the black hills OTM 77gn smk.
It’s cooking.
I’m in NC at sea level and they shoot fine. Really nice to ring 8” plates at 600yds.
I want to try 700yds but haven’t had a low wind day to try.
Good luck
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I tried 168smk fgmm years ago and with confidence I can say they suprised me. Consistency and accuracy was the norm. I love to reload for all my rigs, either short or long distance. But if I had deep pockets, I'd buy 1k worth of the 168smk FGMM. I have no dought that the 175SMK FGMM will produce the same outcome on my 308 rig.
One thing that suprised me was after taking one of the 168smk FGMM apart was the amount of crimp they used. It was enuff to leave the bullet with deformed indentations.
Life is tuff.....its even tuffer when your stupid
{John Wayne}
Day 5 still scrubbing.... finally decided to shoot. No more pressure issues. Must’ve been the carbon ring.
Musta been.
The Dunning-Kruger effect is alive and well.
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