Reply With QuoteBuy the offset insert kit
Use the + and - 0.020 inserts on the rear
Use the + and - 0.005 inserts on the front
Viola! No more problems
Cheaper than shipping back to Savage
You can use it today
So my saga continues. Took my Model 10 Predator in 243 to the range to try and sight in my replacement scope. This is the gun/scope I posted about 3 weeks ago where it required 70+ clicks of windage to get near zero. Then I had some odd POI shifts from minor click adjustments so the scope was suspected and sent back.
I was shipped a new replacement scope so I mounted it and took it to the range today. I am using Burris Zee Signature Rings (recommended here) and a Mueller 4.5-14x40AO APT scope. The rings mounted securely to the Savage stock weaver bases.
Today the gun was consistently shooting 25.5" to the left of my POA (at 100 yards). I rotated my rings front to rear to ensure there was nothing wrong with them and it still shot way out there to the left. So not the rings, and I'm on my second scope. I did shoot a decent 1.25" group but it was 25" to the left. I know I can turn the windage turret (a lot) and adjust that but I just feel something else is wrong and I would only be temporarily masking the underlying problem.
What should I do? Return directly to Savage? Return my dealer (who is 50 miles away one way)? I don't see this being resolved this hunting season which is very demoralizing :-[. Will Savage take a serious look at it or will they replace something and send it back without a lot of checking? I had a lot of hopes built up to be enjoying this gun right now.
Buy the offset insert kit
Use the + and - 0.020 inserts on the rear
Use the + and - 0.005 inserts on the front
Viola! No more problems
Cheaper than shipping back to Savage
You can use it today
myself i would return to savage
do not spend no more money chasing a defect
Ship it back, call and request UPS pickup from Savage, I went through this same problem months ago once Savage replaced barrel problem was solved.
Send it back.
Went through this on a VLP in .223, They replaced the barrel, didn't work
They replaced the action, after "getting the engineers involved", and now it works. I'm feeling like maybe there were a batch of action that were machined wrong or something. they went from very helpful on the phone to pretty tight lipped when they called to say it was on it's way back.
Send it back. Guessing that the mounting holes were drilled and tapped off. No reason to buy something else unless you are comfortable with the gun.
If you have a machinist friend close by ask him to chuck the action up and check the scope hole alignment.
Neal
Is there anything you can advise I request of Savage when I contact them regarding the return? Such as asking for them to perform any special checks/testing? I know some places will do certain quality checks but only if you specifically request. I've never returned a long gun to any gunmaker.
Personally your story above pretty much tells it all. If you are shooting this far left or right at close range with two different scopes other than a burr on the crown that would or should have shot off on the first shot, there isn't much alse for them to look at.
The new scope pretty much puts things onto Savage.
Neal
Send the rifle back to Savage.....................
Politely email Savage describing your problem and link this posting and the one you wrote earlier.
You should get a reply at the speed of light with Savage wanting to fix anything wrong with your rifle.
No gun manufacture wants this type of problem to go unanswered especially in view of so many "Savage Shooters".
Wink, wink, hint, hint, the whole world is watching..................
Something that far off will have noticeably crooked scope base mounting holes. A quick kentucky measuring using some calipers or a ruler should reveal it. Hell, take a picture from the top down and post it here.
A gunsmith can fill and re-drill fairly quickly if you just have to have the rifle for hunt season.
I have looked at the bases and they appear fine to the naked eye. I mean I wish I could see something off so I would know 100% what the problem is. I was groundhog hunting all day yesterday with my lesser guns and just bummed out that I've had this rifle a month and still not ready to take it out. Part of me says to use the Burris inserts to pull the group over but I worry about moving forward with some inherent flaw that could continue to cause problems.Originally Posted by AZ-K9
Is there anything you can advise I request of Savage when I contact them regarding the return? Such as asking for them to perform any special checks/testing? I know some places will do certain quality checks but only if you specifically request. I've never returned a long gun to any gunmaker.
Call savage request a UPS pickup(mine came next day) give savage clerk problem and enclose a detailed letter with rifle to explain what I had checked. I had a cheap plastic case wrapped and packed rifle carefully with electric ties and duct tape rifle arrived within 3 days at savage they had it 6 weeks to replace barrel I now have a less then .500 rifle @100 yards and I can switch scopes as I wish.
Advice, ship it, serves Savage so they can correct problems in future at quality control and helps future customers like me. ;D
I know you said you reversed the rings and tried a different scope, but Did you try to reverse the scope bases? If you put front-to-back and back-to-front, without rotating them, you will use up all your windage in the other direction. You can probably tell this with just swapping them and bore-sighting it in.
Reason I mention this is that I had a set of Warne steel 2pc bases that were drilled slightly off-center and threw my scope off. I did what I mentioned above and proved it, then replaced the bases and the problem went away. If Warne steel bases can be off, the factory cheap ones can definately be.
It may be one more test to try before you ship the rifle back. If it isnt the bases then you have tried everything possible, in which case I would send the rifle back to Savage since it is brand new.
Like mentioned above, be sure to link this thread if/when you email Savage. But also be sure to post their findings and how their CS handled it. If it is handled correctly they deserve the credit. If not, they deserve the bad publicity. From what Ive read about their CS in the past, I would bet it will be handled correctly.
”I have a very strict gun control policy: if there’s a gun around, I want to be in control of it.”
~Clint Eastwood
SEND IT BACK, I have a 10FP in 223 was like that had a bad barrel they put new barrel on on 3 wks shoots 1 inch 200 yards
CAll Customer service.Ask for Effie Sullivan,explain the problem.Tell her you changed scopes without changing anything.Misaligned barrels are fairly common.All machineing on the actions,including drill and tap for scope bases are done before case hardening,causeing warping,which leads to barrel/action misalignment.
A friends shot low and so did mine 21" at 25yds.I sent it back for two other reasons,and forgot to mention the low shooter because I corrected it with the offset inserts in the Burris signature rings.Before calling,check to see if it ejects,every time,and look at the primers from factory ammo.If they are cratered,send them with the gun.Shouldn't cost you a dime.Now what enginerring does is something else
I know I can ship it to them, and I have already boxed it back up in the factory box and put that inside another gun shipping box so it is double boxed. Can they ship it directly back to me or does it have to come back to an FFL?
well mine was just wks old i took it to dealer he shipped and got it back cost me zip
Can be shipped directly back to you....because repairs are being made.
I had the same issue with my Savage 10-FP in .308. The scope base mounting holes were drilled off centerline. I simply used Burris Signature Zee Rings with the offset inserts. I was able to go from not having enough windage in the scope to get to zero, to having the scope perfectly centered with the scopes windage adjustments central. It took 5 minutes.
It doesn't matter if you send the rifle back, or have a gunsmith fix it. There is only one way to correct it short of chucking the action for a new one, and that is to re drill the holes to a larger size on center. This means you'll have bastardized, non standard screw holes in your action. Heli coils will not allow proper torque for this type of application. They are too small. You may or may not find bases, or else you'll have to drill those out as well. I didn't want a bastardized, patched up new rifle. The offset rings corrected the problem perfectly. It is the easiest and best fix for this type of situation. This is happening much too frequently with Savage rifles lately. They need to get a handle on it. It takes 2 minutes to check for this condition before they drill the receiver. Someone is getting lazy, and the Q.C. department is getting lazier. These guns should not be produced this way to begin with, let alone get out the door. Bill T.
We are lending money we don't have, to kids who can't pay it back, to train them for jobs that no longer exist.
I should also mention that in addition to having the holes drilled way off center, I had the pleasure of trying to remove the spray on coating Savage uses to coat their barrels and action with. This is because Savage does not use plug screws to keep this crap out of the threads. I could not get a single screw to start into the threads as the rifle came from the box. I wanted the rifle up and running so I took it to a local gunsmith who had a horrible of a time retapping the screws. All of this nonsense is totally inexcusable in a brand new factory rifle, and is not something you should have to be sending the gun back for. I did what I had to do to get my scope mounted, and the gun ready for the range. It turned out to be far more than I've had to go through with any other factory rifle I have ever purchased. I should also mention that I have 2 other Savage rifles, a Model 12 F-T/R, and a 110 FCP-K in .300 Win. Mag. I had no such issues with. Here are photographs of all 3 rifles. Bill T.
[img width=600 height=450]http://i812.photobucket.com/albums/zz50/billt460/Savage10-FP2-1.jpg[/img]
[img width=600 height=450]http://i812.photobucket.com/albums/zz50/billt460/Savage12-FTR-1.jpg[/img]
[img width=600 height=285]http://i812.photobucket.com/albums/zz50/billt460/Savage110FCP-K-1.jpg[/img]
We are lending money we don't have, to kids who can't pay it back, to train them for jobs that no longer exist.
I appreciate everybody's support. I'll discuss with Savage today and return the gun to them if they are willing. As annoying as it is to be sidelined, I'm going to give them a chance to check out the rifle before passing too much judgment. I'll report back here since there seems to be some interest in how they handle the issue for me.
Maybe I'm missing something here, but did you check to make sure that your windage turret is centered? Maybe someone got their hands on it at the store and turned it in a bunch? I'd also try a one-piece base and tactical rings myself before missing an entire hunting season.
Yep, I checked this on each of the 2 different scopes I tried. They were checked both optically and mechanically.
Savage emailed me a UPS shipping label and the gun is on its way.
Well gentlemen, I knew something screwy was going on. Here is where we are.
Gun was sent back to Savage. In the meantime I picked up another toy - a Remington Model Seven 17 Fireball. I decided to put the same scope/rings on it. Gun shot 28" to the left! Yes, this is the second scope and different gun. I rotated the rings 180 degrees and that put me on paper 4" to the right.
Somehow the Burris Signature Zee rings were pushing it to the extreme left when installed with the base screw entering from the left. It shot fine when I rotated and slid the base screw from the right. And yes, I was using the correct '0' inserts.
I called Savage to tell them. They had just shot my gun and said it was within spec. and was coming back to me.
TRASH the Junk 2 Piece bases, put a Real One Piece base on and see if it cures it. If Not, check base mounting holes, run a straight edge across them and see how it aligns with the bbl. If they are out of wack, you can send back to Savage, OR have a Smith redrill them on center and tap to 10/8 (larger, stronger)
More often that not it's Junk bases / Rings that cause issues. If it does end up being the rifle... send it back.
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