Hey all,
I'm loosing my dang mind trying to figure out what the heck is going on with my 260 Rem Match...
I built my 260 about a year ago and have been shooting it the last 6 months or so with great results... I did load development and settled on a 43 grain H4350 pushing the 143 ELD-X at 2745 fps... When I first built it, my load was consistently shooting 5 shot groups which I could cover with a quarter @ 100 yards.
I have about 400 rounds down the barrel now... Went to the range this last weekend and couldn't even shoot 2 MOA!!! WTF?? It was about 41 degrees and foggy and not much wind... I started at 100 yards and groups were "ok" but not great... I moved out to 200 yards and could barely shoot a 6 inch group... I don't understand what is going on? Action screws are all torqued to 60-65 in lbs. as I got my wheeler wrench for Christmas, scope is solid as is the base. Barrel wasn't fouled very much as I gave it a cleaning when I got home, thinking that it may have been the cause. Barely had any copper come out of the barrel.
My dad just chalks it up to "conditions".... But I'm not completely buying that.... I'm a decent shot (not sniper level by any means) but better than my results showed for sure.... Any of ya'll have any idea why my rifle shot .5 MOA for 200-300 rounds and then just lost it? (I'm talking like a 6" spread @ 200 yards) I spent a pretty penny putting it together and used high quality parts... and a Sightron SIII 6-24x50 scope on top. This thing should be a 1 MOA shooter on a BAD day...
Anybody got any idea? This has me Extremely frustrated.
Any changes to reloading components or lots ? Temperature ? When was the last time you shot it ? Are the action screws at the same torque that they were previously ? Too tight can be as bad as not tight enough. Anything wedged between barrel and stock ?
First thing I do in this situation is check velocity. Next thing I do is check the ammo. See if maybe die settings changed etc. Next thing going back to conditions if you started shooting it 6 months ago it was quite a bit warmer, but not only did the conditions change, but I'm sure you probably went from wearing a light shirt to a jacket possibly. This can change your Length of Pull requirements due to having on thicker garments on etc.
Regardless of what you saw, something changed! You just have to pinpoint it!
How do you know the scope is not broke? Got another one you can play with?
Thanks guys!!
Nothing has changed as far as powder, bullet, loading and seating dies... Action screws were actually torqued more before, as I didn't have the torque screwdriver. The only other thing that I can think of is: I mistakenly loaded Mag primers last time I reloaded, and had to pull the bullets. I thought that they would really come out chewed up, but they came out real easy and didn't look any different than the did when I originally loaded them. I reloaded them 2 weeks ago and shot about 12 of them to make sure everything was still working well. They were shooting fine. Maybe I need to revisit my seating depths? Has my Lands possibly changed enough after 400 rounds?
My only other thought at this point is I have to bed it... Maybe the Boyds PV Coyote Laminate has broken in enough that I might have some movement in the stock. Water line seems to stay pretty consistent, but it's moving left and right. My MV was 2745 @ 59 degrees (6 months ago) and 2737 @ 41 degrees (this weekend).
With horizontal stringing...you may have to play with seating depth. Not sure if the temperature caused enough “shrinkage” to be noticeable...just a theory. I doubt your lands have eroded that much in 400 rounds. If you had a real barrel burner and running it hot...maybe. Just my thoughts. I could be way off though.
LoneStarDiver,
I don't think it's anymore of a barrel burner than the 6.5 Creedmoor, but I am shooting it at Max pretty much. With what you guys have said, I'll go back and check my seating depth again to make sure I'm within the .02-.04 off. If that doesn't work, then I'll try bedding it (I had planned on needing to do that anyway) but I was hoping that I wouldn't have too.
Thanks as always for the suggestions and guidance all,
When you reloaded that brass after swapping primers did you resize the necks? If not I bet you changed your neck tension and quite possibly concentricity was all over the place after pulling bullets.
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Id be first doing a good barrel cleaning, maybe even change what you've been using and doing.
LoneWolf, I did not resize my necks... I extended the pin so it would just knock the primer out, but not do any working of the neck. I'm betting you are correct.... That makes sense to me.... Will look at that issue when I recheck seating depth from Lands. Thanks MAN!!Originally Posted by LoneWolf
Yobuck, The barrel is clean enough I could do surgery on it... I don't think that is my issue.
Savage actions should be around 40 inch pounds. 35 to 45 in-lbs for the front action screw and 20 to 45 in-lbs for the rear screw.
I do 40 to 42 in-lbs.
In researching the breed (Savage B/A) I came across a mention that the front scope base screw must be checked to make sure it is not bottoming out on the barrel threads.
"They couldn't hit an elephant at this distance." Last words of Gen. Sedgwik
Zero333,
Mine is pillar bedded... 60-65 is what I've seen or heard in the past. 40-45 is what I heard without pillars.
I would try a different scope. If it appears nothing has changed the scope is the first place i look. Check the rings and mounts as well.
I doubt bedding is your problem. If it shot good before there shouldn't be enough change to see what you are seeing.
You may also be on to something with pulling the bulluts. You could have very inconsistent neck tension.
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+1 on swapping scopes to see if that fixes it.
I've pulled bullets before and reloaded the brass without resizing the neck; still shot great. I've done this with 6.5 grendel, 6.5x55, 6.5 creedmoor, and 284 win. So not really sure if that's enough to mess things up that much.
Were your powder charge weights the same?
Yes, powder charge was double checked, as I run a max load, so didn't want to risk being too hot.
I have a hard time believing that my Sightron SIII 6-24 has already given up the ghost. Especially when it's been ridiculously pampered from storage to transportation, or use. I suppose it's possible, but I'll try fixing the neck tensions and seating depth first... Would be really disappointing if the Scope is the problem, as they are so highly recommended for tracking and durability. I don't have another scope that I can just swap, as all of my scopes are assigned to a firearm already.
If you went from .5" groups to 6" groups at 100yards it's not a minor change by any means. put a cheap scope on it and you will see. If you checked mounts and rings and barrel is still tight and action is torqued it's the scope.
My line of thinking as well...
How's the crown on the barrel?
Did you check to see if the barrel is still free floated. I had this same issue with a 6.5x47 on a Boyd's stock. The forend of the stock contacts the barrel when it gets cold.
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Thanks for the other ideas gents... I will look at the crown to double check, but I have a recessed target crown which should reduce that chance of it getting messed up. I did also double check that I was free floated all the way down to the barrel nut.
and I went from .5" at 100 yards to 6" at 200 yards... At 100 yards it's still like 1.5 MOA. I'm heading back down this weekend to start over on my reloads after resizing my necks. I'll probably tear it down to the mounts and start over there as well.
At least ya'll have given me a couple more ideas to look at in regards to what went wrong. God I hope it's NOT my Sightron!!
Thanks LoneWolf... You were right, I resized all my brass and double checked my seating depth. Found a new OG measurement of 2.320 which is .005 of my lands. Back to shooting bug holes!! Blows my mind that it could make that much difference.
Pretty surprising to me as well! Glad it came back together though! Your situation does reconfirm to me though that neck tension is a very important factor. I would put it right at the top of the list followed by Accurate powder charge in what I believe is most important!
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