Reply With QuoteNeed loading data to use the Lee 230 gr bullet in the 300 Blackout and the 30-233. Would like to use WW231, Unique, AA5477 or Imr 4198
Anyone have some loads for the 230 gr Lee bullet in the 300 blackout or 30-223 pushing it as fast as possible. Have ww680, AA5477, imr4198, h322 and unique to work with.
Need loading data to use the Lee 230 gr bullet in the 300 Blackout and the 30-233. Would like to use WW231, Unique, AA5477 or Imr 4198
I'm a dedicated cast bullet shooter, so I consider myself qualified to comment. (I never buy Lee moulds, BTW.) I assume you are talking about the TL309-230-5R mold.
Looking at the picture on the Midway site, it looks to me like a marketing trap set to catch unwary shooters. I don't like that ogive at all. It would have to be cast very hard to avoid slumping, which means that it will act like a solid on game - won't expand at all. Is the nose size properly fitted to these modern barrels? It looks like it's intended to ride on the lands, but modern barrels often don't have enough land area to provide support. Can it be loaded into a .300 BK case without having any lead exposed below the neck? It looks like it will have lube grooves exposed. Not that it can't work that way, but it'll be a dirt magnet, and will lap your barrel into a smoothbore if the ammunition isn't kept scrupulously clean.
Just playing about in Quickload, it seems that you might get it to 1600 fps from an 18" barrel with 18 grains of 4198. But to do it, you'd be up in the 48,000 psi range, which is very likely to cause slumping of the ogive, no matter how hard you cast it, making accuracy a faint hope. Also that's way too much pressure for a tumble lubed bullet. Moving back to a more reasonable pressure of 30,000 psi. 1400 fps seems more likely. Whether the tumble lube will stand up at that pressure is open to doubt, IMHO. Thinking about it a little more, it seems to me that it's intended for subsonic MV from the git-go. Cast of 20:1 lead/tin it might actually expand on meat at 1100 fps
If that boat-tail works at all, it'll be the first one ever.
My cynical gene says that they've done one production run of these, Blackout shooters (who are unlikely to be expert casters or cast shooters) will buy them but will be unable to get the bullet to work, and they'll fade away. It'll never be run again. Buy one and put it away. 25 years from now it'll be a rare collector's item.
Can't answer to speed, I tore my BLK apart after just a bit of time with it. I will say that my father enjoyed success with that very mold but he powder coats then. He has sense stopped using it in favor of a mold he made himself. He used h110 and we would get approximately 1200fps from them.
Unless you cast soft and leave the tip exposed, they may as well be solids though. Good for plinking, fun as all outdoors to shoot, but wouldn't hunt with them.
Plan on powder coating them,was hoping something like 1000 fps with one of the powders I had listed?
I have that mold and a 17.5" 300blk barrel. You should be able to do a load with the imr4198. Should be able to find data for imr4198 and sierra hpbt on hodgdons website. Probably 9-10gr as a starting load. Quickload says 994 fps(17.5" barrel) at 13523psi at 9.5gr. Not sure on others. I use hihek2 coating with success. This bullet profile feeds nicely. Even with dead soft lead, I do not expect any expansion. Flies like a spear through water jugs. Checked my data, I have notes for 11gr of H4198 with poor accuracy. I am going to revisit this bullet at a lower charge or different powder when my form1 stamp shows up.
The sub load i like the best is a lee .311 100gr lrn sized to .309 and powder coated over 3.5gr of trail boss, 1009fps, 6.0fps sd. Still little to no expansion, but very quiet and low pressure. Feeding is finicky on any of the short lrn bullets, but playing with col(my notes say 1.693" col), it feeds about 75% of the time. Don't plan on putting more than 2 in the mag. When my form1 stamp gets approved, I expect this to be my go to rabbit load. Quickload shows 6699psi for this load. 639 psi at muzzle.
Tried the lee .309 120 & 113 rifle molds. Don't feed worth a hoot.
Thanks for the information. I will give the IMRr4198 a try. Being a bolt action I am using I hope everything feeds alright. Ihave the Lee 113 gr mold as well. Might give it a try as well. I do plan on powder coating both.Originally Posted by adammiddagh
Even with bolt action, expect poor feeding from the short bullets.
For those light bullets, give Red Dot, Bullseye, and Herco a try. I've never been able to get a consistent burn out of Trail Boss.
It's a bit ironic to be shooting such "cat-sneeze" loads through a silencer. They are already no louder than a hand-clap.
I do have some WW231 and Bullseye but having problems finding any loads.
About five grains of Bullseye for the 100 grainer will get you in the starting load ballpark for a plain base bullet. In an 18" barrel that should be around 1400 fps. Six grains of W231. Be very vigilant about double charging ! A double charge won't blow up an AR, but you will have some serious leading.
Bullets must be sized at least .001" over groove diameter, or you will get leading. If the bullets are cast hard (say, 15 Brinnel), use .002" over groove diameter. Gas check bullets can be pushed harder, but that's not really what we're doing here.
With these cat-sneeze loads in bottleneck cases, we always use pistol primers. Reduces the tendency of the primer explosion set the shoulder back, thus increasing headspace. If you still get setback, drill the primer hole bigger. .090" or 3/32" should be about right. Do NOT use these cases for full-house loads ! Mark 'em with magic marker on the bases.
The loads I'm giving you are calculated in Quickload; (I never guess). The .300 Blackout's case capacity is 25 grains water, and the .32-20 WCF is 22 grains, so you can look at loads for the .32-20 and be on the safe side of pretty close.
This bullet seems to be intended for subsonic use only.
5744 will burn horribly dirty at subsonic pressures.
Unique burns dirty at any pressure, but you can try it at about 4.5 grains.
W231 would work at around 4.0 to 5.0 grains.
4198 is WAY too slow.
Frankly I have little hope for that bullet at all, and especially in an AR platform. To work through the magazine you have to shove a lot of the tail down into the powder space, which is always considered a major no-no with cast bullets. It MIGHT work if the bullets are powder-coated.
Thanks
What load of IMR4198 would get me in the 1400fps range?
There isn't one. You can't get enough 4198 in the case with that boattail hanging down in there. A load of 11 grains is 100% density, and Quickload says that'll only yield about 1200 fps from an 18" barrel.
I would be happy with 1200 fps.
Tried 10.5gr of the old W680 today with the LEE 230GR BULLET. Give average of 1150 FPS. I have not yet shot it for groups.
Form1 came through. So I took some loads out. I seemed to have the best luck seating these bullets to the forward most lube groove and using minimal crimp. See pic.
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