Guys, I'm having fits trying to get this 10SBA to work for me. I just bought it about three weeks ago.
It's grouping well, but I keep having issues with the bolt dragging on the magazine.
I've taken the rifle apart and understand how the centerfeed goes together. I believe the issue is that little silver-colored bracket that holds the magazine in place at the rear. Should this bracket be a 90° bend or more open? Mine is more like 110° or 120°. I think when I torque the action down, it's pushing on that bracket and pushing the magazine upwards into the bolt.
However, it seems that if I bend it closer to 90°, the magazine feels loose and still rides along the bottom of the bolt.
Overall, the whole action feels nasty and the magazine lips are getting sharp edges from the bolt grinding on it. So now it's even chewing up my casings and leaving brass shavings all in the stock and action.
Savage said I would have to pay to send it back to them, so I'm hoping I can fix it myself.
All of mine have been greater than 90 and I think it acts like a spring to apply pressure to the magazine case to hold it in place. It really does take some pressure to get the magazine bottomed out in the stock when installing it. With the L bracket and follower removed, will the mag get low enough to clear the bolt? Bend the bracket back to stock and push down firmly on both ends of the mag insuring it gets all the way seated.
What stock are you running?
"Life' is tough. It's even tougher if you're stupid." ~ John Wayne
“Under certain circumstances, urgent circumstances, desperate circumstances, profanity provides a relief denied even to prayer.” —Mark Twain
From your post, I am reading that the bolt binds up no matter how many rounds are in the mag.
If the bolt binds when the magazine has less than a full number of rounds loaded, I would agree that something is out of alignment.
Some mags have a hard time taking the rated number of rounds.
Some AICS mags are only rated for 8 rounds and some are rated for 10 rounds.
That creates a lot of confusion.
Sometimes how well the top round is positioned depends on whether all of the previously loaded rounds settled in correctly and, if not, the last round can be very hard to load.
I have found that my bolt sometimes hang up on the top round when that happens, perhaps because the top round sticks out too far or is too tight against the mag lips.
But it doesn't impact any of the lower rounds and my bolts always work smoothly on the rounds loaded below the top round in the mag.
Synthetic stock, blind magazine, centerfeed, bolt release is on the right side.Originally Posted by J.Baker
The Savage hidden mag, factory plastic stock is very sensitive to action screw torque.
The torque recommendation if only 30 to 35 in.-lbs.
That is really not very tight and if you don't have a torque wrench, you could easily tighten the screws to well over 50 in.-lbs. if you are used to aluminum bedded posts.
If the action screws, especially the front acton screw, are overtightened, it might compress the plastic bedding posts in the stock and bring the hidden magazine up closer to the bolt causing binding.
I mistakenly tightened my 12 FV to 45 in.-lbs. and it impacted the accuracy - increasing the group size by 0.1 inches. But the bolt didn't seem to be binding, at least not to the degree yours is.
If the action screws were tightened much more than 45 in.-lbs., it might be causing the stock to distort and bring the mag closer to the bolt.
30-35 INCH-lbs? That is less than 3 FOOT-lbs. That seems very loose.
I'll admit, the only thing I've found that fixes it is to leave the action hella loose in the stock. However...
Agreed. Don't know if I like the idea of this rifle only working if I leave all the screws loose.
It’s not leaving them loose. This is specification set forth by Savage! It’s not up to us to “decide” how tight we think the screws should be.
Enhance your calm, John Spartan.
I just thought maybe the units were wrong. Are they the same for the wood and accufit stocks?
Go down to the hardware store and buy at least 3 of the smallest diameter washers(Buy 6 if they are real thin) that fit a 1/4" screw. Place one each between all removable bottom parts and the stock. Add another if needed. Return to this post with "it fixed it" or a "Nope".
Inch Lbs is correct. If pillared and bedded up to 50 inch/lbs. Much higher and your pulling threads out of the receiver.
The Dunning-Kruger effect is alive and well.
Not being smart but I'm not sure how that could work. I understand what your idea is but it's hard enough to get the magazine and spring to not shoot out of the stock while placing the barrel and action into the stock, much less make sure some washers I've sat in the bottom stay put.
Also, if 50 or so is pulling threads then I'm no where near that tight. I've just got them snugged up by hand. As in, I turned until they stopped and left it at that.
Hence my post above worrying about leaving them loose. I already don't have them very tight and it sounds like I need to back them off even more.
If you lower the frame by putting shims between it and the stock you move the magazine away from the bolt by lowering it. Your bolt is rubbing the magazine isn't it?
The Dunning-Kruger effect is alive and well.
SAV10,
The only way you will know is to measure them with a torque wrench, but rifle torque wrenches are in inch-pounds, not foot pounds.
Foot-pound torque wrenches are for autos and usually for large diameter bolts.
On my all aluminum Oryx chassis, the action screw torque setting is 60 inch-pounds and that is about as tight as I've ever seen.
Scope rings are speced at 15 to 20 inch-pounds and scope mounts are normally no more that 40 in.-lbs. if they have steel screws.
what is making the magazine "shoot out is the force the magazine is applying to the bolt. To test this remove the bolt from the gun. Install the magazine and remove it. Does it still shoot out?
The Dunning-Kruger effect is alive and well.
Ah. You mean shim between the action and the stock?
Can't shim those because where the action sits in the stock is round or curved.
Otherwise, it sounds like you want me to shim underneath the magazine, spring and bracket, which would be hard to do and I would think that would move it closer to the action.
Right. It's just, I don't have one and other then buying one online, don't know anywhere that has one.
Never had to torque bolts on a rifle before...
Ah. I see where the confusion is coming from here. My rifle has a blind magazine.
With the factory plastic stock on my 12 FV 6.5mm Creedmoor, the action screws loosened up after every session and I retorqued them to 35 in.-lbs. every time I cleaned the rifle.
It just shot better that way.I tried 45 in.-lbs. to keep them tight but it added 0.1 inches to my average group size. Savages are a bit sensitive to action torque settings and the plastic stocks (non Accu-stocks) don't have the aluminum stiffener rail and the aluminum pillars that allow you to torque the action screws tighter.
Wheeler makes a relatively cheap adjustable torque fat screw driver that works OK if you aren't a tool nut.
The good ones are about 4 - 5 times the price.
Right now I'm just using a gunsmith screw driver set. You can't torque them too much because it tears up the bits.
The cheapest torque wrench I'm seeing is $38 on Amazon.
Sav10,
I'm sorry I didn't mention it before but it happened several years ago and I had forgotten all about it.
Your last post somehow revived my memory.
I had removed my stock on an old 10 FP with a hidden magazine and since the area around the hidden mag was really dirty after thousands of rounds, I pulled the hidden mag and cleaned up the entire area.
When I put the hidden mag back in, I apparently put it in wrong and I experienced bolt closing problems too. The mag was seated too high to allow the bolt to close but it looked like it was seated right when I placed it.
I tried a couple of times to get the mag back in the right position and most everything I tried didn't seem to fix the problem.
Eventually, after multiple tries, I finally got the mag to seat correctly and the problem never resurfaced.
I recently bought two 12 FVs with hidden mags and I made sure I didn't remove them.
I just replaced both 12 FV stocks with Oryx chassis with detachable AICS magazines so I don't worry about that any more.
I missed that. Sorry.
The Dunning-Kruger effect is alive and well.
No problem!
Guys, I just dropped it off to be sent back. Even with the bolts loose enough to move the action around in the stock, the bolt was dragging.
Thanks for all your help!
I'll try to remember to update this thread when I get it back.
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