New 6.5 ocw results

[doctnj]

Ok Im only going to be showing one group because I tested 5 rounds at .1 gr increments and 4 of them looked about the same except this one.

Chrony numbers are

Series, 4, Shots:, 5
Min,2840, Max,2866
Avg,2851 ,S-D, 9.8
ES , 26


Series,Shot,Speed
4, 1, 2866, ft/s
4, 2, 2852, ft/s
4, 3, 2845, ft/s
4, 4, 2840, ft/s
4, 5, 2854, ft/s

Not real thrilled with the SD and ES but really that first round was out of character with the rest of them and really threw off the numbers.
They would be a whole lot better if that one was in line with the rest of them.

Load stats. 140 gr Berger Hyb Target. 42.7 gr of H4350 with cci200 primer

The lowest load was 42.4 up to 42.8 because this bracketed three shots that were pretty accurate on an earlier test. Problem is every round from start to finish was a little sticky to very sticky at the 42.8 level. It was strange. One round seemed sticky and I would have to pop it loose then the very next round seemed like it came out a little easier and I thought maybe Im over reacting. But they were all sticky really.

This is the series 4. It measured .402 MOA

[doctnj]

The next to pictures are of the cases. I thought, at least out at the range that the primers looked a bit flat. They dont look too flat in this picture but Ill put it up for debate. Also a side view to look for pressure signs. The necks are pretty dirty and as ive said on my 338 I havent cleaned the chamber in a while and that could contribute. Ill clean just the chamber later and recheck the fit and see if they are still ultra tight.

[doctnj]

You can really see the dull finish on the side of the case where it imprinted from the chamber.

Ok tell me what you think.

[LongRange]

How far off the lands are you?

[doctnj]

Do the primers look flat to you?

[doctnj]

.19 off by average measurement. I was pulling it back to be magazine fed but still too tight to feed. Had to single feed today. One thing that I did different this time through is trimmed the case necks to 1.920 instead of 1.910 after measuring that the chamber was 1.942. I suppose that might be a contributing factor. Annealing and not trimming back to "trim to length" were the only things that were different from last run. I will need to pull back off the lands even more to be mag fed.

[LongRange]

No tbe primers look fine to me...id shoot the 42.7g load and start at .025 off the lands and then .035 off...and a 26fps ES is not bad.

[LongRange]

Are you measuring off the ogive or the case over all length?

[doctnj]

The ES would be in the teens if that first round wasn't so high. Also I just finished cleaning the chamber and the cartridges did not feel near as tight. The 338 was not that way. After I cleaned it the tight cartridges remained tight. So it's possible it could have been build up as well. I will back the bullets out and run it again.

[LongRange]

My 260 likes them .035 off the lands.

[doctnj]

I am measuring to the ogive. I use the 5-26 comparator. That one looks like it fits the hybrids the best so i stick to it so i get the same measurement from start to finish.

[LongRange]

Thats the right one...i think backing off a little will tighten it up and may also reduce the ES.

[doctnj]

One more question. I use walnut media in my cleaner. It has rouge in it. I see people adding all kinds of stuff to their media. Do you put in additives? If so what?

[doctnj]

Well then that will be my goal. Ill load up a few more and check at 100 then run it out to 300 and see how it holds up.

Going to a fairly large gun show tomorrow. Hope to accomplish two things. 1. Dont buy a gun lol. and 2. FIND POWDER!! If I can walk away with 20 or so pounds of some various powder I will consider it a success.

[LongRange]

I stainless steel tumble ive never used a dry tumbler.

[doctnj]

Well I ran through the gun show and grabbed up all the h4350. There was 4 lbs. Should be glad there was any at all. Did pick up some imr3031 for my gas guns but again only two lbs. Then went by one of the biggest reloading supply places in town and they had neither. They did have primers. No h1000 anywhere. I could have walked away with all the imr4350 I could carry. Anyone ever use that?

[doctnj]

Upslide, thank you very much for your input. I appreciate everything I can get. I initially ran a .5 ladder and identified two nodes below max load. Then I went searching for another one above max. Same thing, course ladder done and found a load that shot quite well. Weather it was a "node" or not is kind of semantics. I knew two things going into this test. It was a smoken fast load and seemed pretty accurate. So now to verify. I went with .1 for a few below and a few above. Seems like all the numbers held in there. It just so happen that the very last group on the edge was tightest. So is this a load that I will continue to shoot? Not if I don't get the pressure to back off.

It's been expressed that finding a "node" center insures that if a load error happens, i.e. +- .5 gr, that it's still going to be good. And more than likely, when the new rifles are employed, that is where I will end up. Maybe I should call this testing something else so it doesn't cause quite the stir. I don't see an issue with finding a load that is dead on, has good numbers, and loading it. Except, I won't have the safety net of a little powder wiggle room. I am pushing you for knowledge.

[doctnj]

UPSLIDE; Here is the course test. I also think 41.8 was quite acceptable as they are on a good horizontal with a bit of wind shift. I know wind isn't supposed to effect 100yrds but it was blowing fairly good that day. 42.5 looked pretty promising. So from about 41.8 up to 42.5 were all pretty close. So that is my "node" I just chose to explore the upper end of it. I hope this picture makes more sense to you now. The squares are 1/2". The low shot on 42 was a shank.

[yobuck]

Excuse me for asking, but as they say inquiring minds need to know. Lots of things have changed over the many years
since i started reloading ammo. Some of which is terminoligy in the way we describe things. I think we can all agree that
the reason most of us reload ammo, is so that we can get the best performing ammo for our particular guns.
The term node for example comes to my mind. I cant recall that term being used except for very recently, meaning a few years at most.
Im not debating its merit, but simply a better understanding of it. In my looking at the target presented here by Docnj, my natural thought
process looks at each group. Being a velocity person, i want the best group with the best velocity i can get. So my eyes went immediatly to
the 43.3 group. I personaly would be loading 5 more and seeing if i could duplicate that performance. But obviously that isnt the same thought
process others here have, and im wondering why? Another reason for my curiosity is, that over the years ive noticed numerous times when
increasing powder charges in small increments, the groups remain in the same place on the target even with a grain or more difference in charge weight.
We can even see that on this target, which to some degree at least might explain the term node? But does it also say then that precisly weighing charges isnt necessary once a load is established?

[doctnj]

Well today, at least for now, is out for shooting a test. It 30 degrees, not so bad by itself. Its sprinkling, not so bad by itself. But also the wind is 15 to 20. That might not effect a 100 yrd shot much, although I think 20mph would in my opinion. But deep down in the valley I shoot, if there is any wind at all it screams through there. So a 20 mile an hour wind seems to get focused and blows everything. Not to mention if you are already wet and cold. Besides I guess all I have is my panties to keep me warm lol. Im planing on tomorrow. Not quite as much wind and no rain however colder.

Trust me, I have a brand spanking new custom rifle that I can not wait to shoot but those conditions suck.

Look, im going to hijack my own thread for a moment and try to keep it short. With all the deer talk on hajefd's thread I wanted to get some opinions. I hunt on 100 acres, well 99, one acre has a house that was sold and the new owners have mutts they let run. During bow season I was at full draw on an 8 point and they ran it off right in front of me. I drew on the dog but let off. Ive been hunting this valley for 7 years and pay 7k a year to lease it. Im actually renting a cabin and get hunting rights. Ive tried to have conversation with new guy and he seems to refuse to put his dogs up. Ive asked him if he would just put them up on weekends. I have sat out there and listened to them circle the woods barking chasing off all the deer.

We did get three doe early on but we gave them to a family that needs the meat. So we finished the season with out meat.

What would you do about this?

[doctnj]

well I put on extra panties and went out to shoot the new 260. I have some pics of the targets and a video of some semi rapid fire that corresponds to some of the groups on the target. I had loaded up two loads; the first being a middle of the pack charge weight just to foul up the barrel, get zeroed and just basically to fire form the brass. The second load was just over max load. It will be later tonight or even tomorrow before I can get the pics and such posted. But lets just say that dude shoots. Ill go into detail later and talk about the conditions which was interesting.

[yobuck]

Well today, at least for now, is out for shooting a test. It 30 degrees, not so bad by itself. Its sprinkling, not so bad by itself. But also the wind is 15 to 20. That might not effect a 100 yrd shot much, although I think 20mph would in my opinion. But deep down in the valley I shoot, if there is any wind at all it screams through there. So a 20 mile an hour wind seems to get focused and blows everything. Not to mention if you are already wet and cold. Besides I guess all I have is my panties to keep me warm lol. Im planing on tomorrow. Not quite as much wind and no rain however colder.

Trust me, I have a brand spanking new custom rifle that I can not wait to shoot but those conditions suck.

Look, im going to hijack my own thread for a moment and try to keep it short. With all the deer talk on hajefd's thread I wanted to get some opinions. I hunt on 100 acres, well 99, one acre has a house that was sold and the new owners have mutts they let run. During bow season I was at full draw on an 8 point and they ran it off right in front of me. I drew on the dog but let off. Ive been hunting this valley for 7 years and pay 7k a year to lease it. Im actually renting a cabin and get hunting rights. Ive tried to have conversation with new guy and he seems to refuse to put his dogs up. Ive asked him if he would just put them up on weekends. I have sat out there and listened to them circle the woods barking chasing off all the deer.

We did get three doe early on but we gave them to a family that needs the meat. So we finished the season with out meat.

What would you do about this?

What are the laws regarding the free roaming of dogs in that area? Chances are he's breaking the law by letting them run.
You have a legal right to be using the property since you pay for a lease. Id be paying him one more polite visit informing him
of your intentions regarding the dogs should they run loose again while your hunting on your part of the 100 acres.
If their chasing deer, i believe you could shoot them regardless. The only other option would be to find another spot.

[doctnj]

I took the loads back out. They were split centered around the previously found high node and low node. Im just going to show the center target from each test areas because I feel that the dang rifle was a laser at these two loads. It was very accurate before and after these two loads as well so I feel pretty confident that ive found the right combinations.

On the first picture, there is a shot marked shank. I was supposed to have been shooting at an entirely different target on that shot. If you count in the center there are 5 shots clustered together. Also on the second picture, the pressure got to me and I pulled the last shot. After the first 4 shots nearly made one hole I kept saying to myself "dont mess up". Negative thinking wins out every time as you will see.

Im goint to chrony these two loads and see what the numbers say as well as run them out to distance to check if they stay good. I would have to also make a decision here as the lower powder charge although it will be slower, is it worth the barrel and brass life to use it and gain a little more bullet drop?

[LongRange]

if your pulling last shots id say stick with one of those loads and get some trigger time...i think your loads are good but you need some work on mounting,holds and trigger pull.
i second guess my loads all the time but what it really comes down to is im not a good enough trigger man to consistently shoot 1 hole groups.

this was yesterday with the 260AI...4 rounds in the same hole and by not pulling or mounting or breathing or 10 other possibilities this group went from about a .290 group to about .413...



pick one of those loads and get some time behind your rifle and consecrate on the things your doing different every time you shoot....just like loading it has to be consistent EVERY TIME.

[yobuck]

Both good loads, why would you have to settle on either of them?
For paper punching why cant you use the lighter one, and for hunting
or longer target sessions the heavier one? Precise zero while nice, isnt
always a dial up and kill it anyway. A sighter shot is always a good idea.