Fixed power scopes

[grumpy]

Anyone out there run a fixed power scope. I'm somewhat green with the scope thing i've used them but up until recently i never gave much thought to the options that are out there. I've bought 4 scopes in my life all variable power, but know that i'm wanting to get more into hunting i've heard story's of guys forgetting to set their power correctly and missing the shot. This is something i had not thought about. Any input on the subject would be great.

[foxx]

Well, it depends so much on the terrain and foliage and distance you hunt. Most of my deer hunting is from a deep, thick, dark cedar swamp and shots are generally 30-60 yards. Occasionally 100 yards. In that situation I like a variable 1.5 x 6 or so and keep it on low until I need it higher for that rare long shot. I figure if he's close, I better have it on low. If he's out there I have plenty of time to adjust crank it up.

When hunting the open fields I have a 4.5 x 14 or something so I can see well out to 400 yards or so. Most will tell you a 3 x 9 is good enough out to 400 yds. I have a few nice fxed scopes at 10x, 16x, 20x and 32 or 36x. I like them a lot for target, but could never hunt with them where I hunt. The likelihood of having one bustig through the brush on the run 15 - 20 yards from me and me not able to find them in the scope is just too great.

If you hunt wide open country from a blind or something or maybe off a ridge or something where you will not likely encounter anything inside of 200 yards or so, I would say go with a good 10X. Something like SWFA SS 10x40. good glass, and construction. dependable $300.

[TexNAss]

A Major reasons for fixed power scopes in my opinion,
- "light gathering"- less lenses means they are superior at night/under spotlights
- less weight due to reduced lenses and mechanisms.
- less parts to screw up and malfunction.
- simple sight and shoot. No focussing, or messing around.


Most people I know shoot at less than 250yards where variable scopes aren't really needed.


At night under spotlight- it is almost impossible to zoom, focus, and take the shot in less than ten seconds.


Tex.

[foxx]

All else being the same, a fixed power scope will be less expensive. I don't see how it can possibly be better than a variable scope of equal quality, though.

Cheap fixed scope is a cheap scope, and a high end variable scope will be brighter, clearer and more dependable than a cheap fixed power scope. Any scope, fixed or variable will need to be adjusted for parallax / or focus at various ranges if it has a power greater than 12.

What I am basically saying is I don't see anything inherently better about a fixed power scope, no matter what the circumstances are.

[yobuck]

I own and use fixed power scopes on some of my hunting guns. But i also feel there are more advantages than disadvantages
for average joe hunter to use a varieable powered scope.

[BigDave]

All else being the same, a fixed power scope will be less expensive. I don't see how it can possibly be better than a variable scope of equal quality, though.

Cheap fixed scope is a cheap scope, and a high end variable scope will be brighter, clearer and more dependable than a cheap fixed power scope. Any scope, fixed or variable will need to be adjusted for parallax / or focus at various ranges if it has a power greater than 12.

What I am basically saying is I don't see anything inherently better about a fixed power scope, no matter what the circumstances are.

I agree with every other post in this thread. I do not agree with the part of yours that says: "a high end variable scope will be brighter, clearer and more dependable than a cheap fixed power scope.".
SWFA SS 10 power scope is Milspec quality and inherently more rugged than most any variable power scope. This is by nature. It has less moving parts and built like a tank. It is "cheap" at $299. Young eyes can use this scope out to 1000 yards. Using it for hunting at game less than 100 yards may be an issue as far as time to acquire the target.

For hunting people (not game) the fixed 10 power scope (various brands Leupold, Unertl, US Optics and others) was a Military standard for a long period of time. Yes even the "cheap" SS 10x fixed scope was issued in some cases to Naval Special Forces.

Brighter, clearer and more dependable are always issues.

But, the key issues to answer the OP have been well addressed by some very well worded posts in this thread. The answer is a balance of features vs terrain vs budget vs convenience. A fixed power scope is more likely to be more useful in tactical long range tactical situations 100 yards and over.

Unless you are hunting/shooting prairie dogs at 500 yards, then a variable scope is likely to suit most hunters better in the long run.
Try doing a quick snap shot of anything at 50 yards with a 10-20 power fixed scope. Most hunters in most (not all) situations benefit from a fixed power scope.

To the O.P.: Talk to more SUCCESSFUL hunters (not the screw ups) in the areas where you hunt and ask them what scope powers they prefer, then make your own decision. You can always sell the scope and get another one of it really turns out to be a dud for you personally.

[foxx]

Well, BigDave, I don't know how you could possibley disagree with that statement. My Crossman 760 has a cheap 3x scope on it. I think I paid $9 for it 40 years ago. I have a $50 Bushnell 3-9x that is far better than that one. Still, I don't think my SWFA SS 10x can even begin to compare with my high end Zeiss or a Nightforce or Vortex Razor HD variable. I also don't think SWFA 10X is a cheap scope and did not say that it was cheap. It is relatively inexpensive and certainly a quality fixed scope.

Oh, well.

To illustrate with ridiculous examples, the point I was trying to make is more obvious here:
In order:
$9 3x fixed = cheap (crappy scope)
$50 3-9x Bushnell (cheap, not so crappy)
$300 SWFA SS 10x ( inexpensive, good quality)
$900 Zeiss 3-15X (expensive, high quality)
$2,500 Nightforce 3.5-15 (insanely expensive, stupid for deer hunting high end quality)

Again, I stress that I said, ALL else being the SAME, a FIXED power scope will be less expensive than a variable. That is true. Even SWFA SS 10X is less expensive than the variable SS. I am saying I don't see an ADVANTAGE to not being able to change the power on a scope. Certainly the SWFA SS is a better QUALITY scope than my $50 variable, but I am not sure it is better tool for hunting in heavy cover and for close shots.

[yorketransport]

With a fixed power and variable power scope of equal quality and build, the fixed power will weigh less, be less expensive to manufacture and have greater optical clarity. Think of comparing a fixed power Mk 4 to a variable power Mk 4. The fixed power has fewer lenses meaning that it will weigh less and have fewer surfaces for the light to pass through. That will theoretically give a better image. It may not be noticeable though.

I happen to like fixed power scopes on my mid range hunting guns. My 358 Winchester wears a 6x and my Savage 99 in 300 Savage has a 4x. For a few years I elk hunted with a 21" barreled 458 Win Mag with a 4x scope and it was an absolute dream to sneak through the alders with! These guns are rarely used where shots will exceed 150 yards, but even with the limited magnification they are perfectly capable of 300 yard shots on deer or elk. I'm not so sure that the 358 is up to killing a deer at 300 yards though! LOL

Andrew

[thomae]

A few points to ponder:

... i've heard story's of guys forgetting to set their power correctly and missing the shot. This is something i had not thought about. Any input on the subject would be great.

This is an issue with lack of practice, or "forgetting to use the checklist" or whatever you want to call it. I've also heard stories of guys forgetting their ammo, binoculars, etc.... It can happen to anyone. It happened to me once. The fault was mine, not my scope. Most folks that I know (not an exhaustive list) will keep a variable power scope dialed in at a reasonably low magnification until they need something higher..

It also depends on where you hunt. Foxx said it well:

Well, it depends so much on the terrain and foliage and distance you hunt. ...keep it on low until I need it higher for that rare long shot. I figure if he's close, I better have it on low. If he's out there I have plenty of time to adjust crank it up.

Your don't have a location. Are you hunting in thick brush? Pennsylvania woods? Oregon high desert? It does make a difference in what equipment to bring to the table. Big game hunting, varmint hunting at night, deer hunting in the woods, for example are very different situations.

In "the old days" plenty of folks hunted (typically deer) with fixed scopes (think Weaver K-4) successfully. However bazillions of deer have also been successfully shot with a standard 3 x 9 power variable scope as well. (Here in PA, when I hunt with a 3x9, I usually keep it at 3 or 4 power 90% of the time.)

All else being the same, a fixed power scope will be less expensive.

A fixed power scope will usually be less expensive than a variable power that includes the same magnification and has the same light-gathering capability and resolution as the fixed power scope.

I don't see how it can possibly be better than a variable scope of equal quality, though.

To put my two cents, although I am not disagreeing with foxx, without defining "better" there is no way to back up this claim. Generally, however, if you have a fixed scope and a variable scope of "equal quality," (how does one define equal quality? I'll leave that to another thread ) the fixed scope will usually be less expensive than the variable scope.

With a fixed power and variable power scope of equal quality and build, the fixed power will weigh less, be less expensive to manufacture and have greater optical clarity.

To the O.P.: Talk to more SUCCESSFUL hunters (not the screw ups) in the areas where you hunt and ask them what scope powers they prefer, then make your own decision. You can always sell the scope and get another one of it really turns out to be a dud for you personally.

The only thing I would add to this is to ask them "why" they prefer one scope over another. I might also value the opinion of someone who had tried different scopes more than the hunter who tells me that he uses this scope because it's what came on his rifle.

Bottom line is that there are pros and cons to both sides in the fixed versus variable discussion and you will need to make the final decision. The folks who have responded have made most of the points that can be made. Now you will need to digest all the information and figure out what applies to you and your hunting situation. Good luck.

[Russmerle]

I thought you master debaters (gotta use it) might find this article on fix vs variable scopes very interesting. Its a long read but well worth it. And again, this is another master debater's opinion.
http://www.snipercountry.com/Articles/ChoosingScope.asp

Also Chuck Hawks opinion
http://www.chuckhawks.com/what_riflescope.htm

These are great opinions and hard to argue. I thought they were very interesting points of view. I still like having the long range, variable zoom because I like precise target shooting and big bulls eyes but still being able to zoom out for the hunt...