Which 6mm?

[scooterf79]

Started thinking about my next possible build. Going to convert a 700 to Rem-age. Its a SA 22-250, and want to go to something 6mm. It will be strictly a varmint rifle, as I have my bases covered for deer and up in other rifles. 6br entered my mind mostly for the accuracy factor but I like the idea of more pop when it hits, so the 6mm ackely entered my mind, 243 ackley but from what ive read the 6mm ackely is a bit faster, 6-284, something along those lines. Any suggestions or thoughts either way would be appreciated
Thanks!
Scooter

[scope eye]

Yes I say 6mm X 55 Swede 58gr case capacity Lapua Brass for $70.00 per 100ct all this in a short action package, and off the shelf dies to boot.

Yes they are all that.

http://www.savageshooters.com/showth...ew-wildcat-6mm

Dean

[taylorce1]

Use KISS, standard .243 Win. Nothing fancy, but it'll get the job done every time. Minimum 22" barrel and twist it for heavy bullets 1:8, throat it for 105 VLD'S .010 off the lands at 2.80".

I realize 105 grain bullets are probably heavier than you want to shoot, but they are slippery in the wind. They'll let you reach out to those varmints along ways off. Plus it's always better to have more twist than you need, than not enough.

.243 is hard enough on barrels, so no need to try and beat a larger capacity case in the fps race. I wouldn't mess with any case longer than the .243 out of a short action Remington. If you want something a little more exotic the 6XC or Creedmoor would be excellent choices as well.

[snowgetter1]

My vote....standard 243.

[bootsmcguire]

I am going to go 243AI for my vote. I have one, love it. Obviously with some of your suggested choices you are going to be handloading, so definitely go with an AI chamber. Not necessarily for the FPS gains (and there is not enough difference between the 243AI and the 6mm Rem-AI to justify the harder to find brass of the 6mm) but for the greatly added brass life. Loaded to max 243 levels, my 243AI is giving me top 243 performance, but due to these loads being mid range for the 243AI and the sharper shoulder, my trimming is totally eliminated and brass life went up 5x's.

[Hotolds442]

Yes I say 6mm X 55 Swede 58gr case capacity Lapua Brass for $70.00 per 100ct all this in a short action package, and off the shelf dies to boot.

Yes they are all that.

http://www.savageshooters.com/showth...ew-wildcat-6mm

Dean

What he said!

[scooterf79]

Thanks for the input guys.
I like a 243 but I kinda want something a little different. The 6mm Swede is on my radar for sure. I had thought about the brass availability for the 6mm too. I really like the idea of the improved chambers with regards to not needing to trim much. Im hoping to find out about that very soon (just put my new 280AI barrel on a couple days ago).
Boots, what kinda accuracy and velocity are you getting with your 243AI?
Thanks again!
Scooter

[bootsmcguire]

My 243AI barrel is rechambered barrel off of a 12BVSS that was a 243. It now has a fair number of rounds down her, without checking I would say she's nearing 3,000. With that said I am running the 58gr V-Max out of her at just over 4,000fps and that is a conservative load. I keep it there rather than turning it up just because its plenty fast, flat, and accurate. It also lends to even better brass life. I bought this barrel slightly used, and the previous owner was shooting 70gr Blitzkings over RL-17 at 3850fps and claimed that was a bit below what it was capable of for speed.

Accuracy is good, normally giving me .3-.6" range groups at 100yds. I am sure in her prime she did much better. I have a buddy with a 243AI McGowan that shoots .4" all day long and another buddy that has a CBI that does just as well.

[Hotolds442]

Think of the 6x55 Swede as a 6br on steroids, since it's built using a 6br reamer. I will choose the Swede over my 243AI any day of the week for accuracy purposes, and with a 250 yard zero, it's 18.1 mils to 1000 yards with a 105 conservatively pushed at 3400 at the muzzle.

[scooterf79]

Thanks for the info Boots. Sounds like theyre shooters.....and I like the speed, and youre running middle of the road velocities correct?

Hotolds, its been a while since you gave any updates on the post concerning the 6x55 swede. What kinda of speed and accuracy are you getting out of it? Just kinda tryin to get an idea in my head comparing it with the 243 and 6mm ackleys. And, if I went that route is neck turning a must? Ive not had anything that requires neck turning, thats why I ask.
Scooter

[ragsflh]

243ai will shoot the sweede.also case life is better

[scope eye]

As far as the swede goes, there is a turn and a no turn option, In my case I chose the latter, I would not own a chamber that the brass needs to be turned, I am not slamming turning brass, I just choose not to invest in the time or tooling, and in my case I want those necks as thick as possible, brass life is short enough, "in general terms" I don't need to be splitting necks on top of that, you can't ignore this round, it sends 105gr Amax's and 107gr Sierra HPBT at over 3500FPS without even breathing hard, it is only out done by my 6mm-06AI and my 6mm Mach IV, and do not forget all you need is a gutted 6.5 X 55 Swede FL die for the body, and a 6BR for the neck and shoulder, it is as simple as that. If I could only keep one 6mm that would be it.

Dean

[Hotolds442]

I'll update the thread later today, I just got off work and am headed in a horizontal direction.

[scooterf79]

Ok good, I dont really want to get into turning necks myself either, at least not at this point. So, generally pretty easy to form cases, more velocity than the 243ai, and fits well in a SA? Am I correct in all this? And...hotolds seems to think have the accuracy edge correct? Looking more and more interesting.
Just trying to make sure I get all the info I can on my options before I decide.
Did Jim at Apache do both of your alls barrels?
Thanks Scooter

[scope eye]

Yes whether you go 243AI or 6mm X 55 you are going to have to form brass, the groupings are tighter than my 234AI but in all fairness the barrel has a lot less rounds, it is the most you can pack in a short action case, and yes he did both our chamber work.

Dean

[scooterf79]

Thanks! Just tryin to get the advantages of each, before I decide. I wanna get all the punch I can out of it.
Ive not heard anything but good about Jim from you, boots and everyone else for that matter
Thanks
Scooter

[bootsmcguire]

Yes my 4000fps on the 58gr V-Max is mid range at most. As to the 3850 on the 70gr BK, that is what the prior owner stated he was getting at mid range loads, but I haven't tried the 70BK myself.

[Hotolds442]

I have my Swede on a long action, only because I looked long and hard for a short action and then fell upon a good deal on a long action and Boyd's stock for a long action. My 105 grain loads fit just fine in a 308 length magazine box though, .010 off the lands leaves me .005 clearance. I haven't found max with H4350, I found some obscene accuracy on my way there and stopped.
Neck trimming really isn't that bad, I've only had to trim mine the first time. After that it's pretty much painless. I'm geared up for it now, so if you decide to go that route it wouldn't be much of an issue turning brass for you.
My Swede is more accurate than my 243AI, but to be fair, the AI has about 1000 rounds down the tube and I haven't done a lot of load work up with it. I do like the fact that the Lapua brass for the Swede is as tough as you'll find, able to contain a lot more pressure than anybody but Dean would throw at it. I built mine for accuracy with an added punch, that's why I went with the "long" 6BR. If I was going straight to the speedway I'd have built a 6x284 or a 6mm-06. If I had to do it over again, I'd do nothing different.

[Rooster 50]

I have a J series Savage with a Kreiger barrel in 6MM AI. It's a beast.

[Hotolds442]

I have a J series Savage with a Kreiger barrel in 6MM AI. It's a beast.

No doubt!

[scooterf79]

Thanks for the update and all the info. This cartridge seems to have the best of both worlds with accuracy and speed which I really like. I want to build something super accurate (for me anyway) but always love speed, especially for varmints. Your update on the other thread sounds like the accuracy is fantastic! .2s???? Thats awesome! Sounds as though this might be right with the 6-284 with speed isnt it?
Gotcha on it fitting a 308 box. The 700 I'll convert is just what I happen to have so thats why I wanted to make sure a short action cartridge.
I dont think ill go with the neck turn option, unless theres some advantage to it, but if I go that route Ill be in touch :)
As far as case length, did you need to trim any after sizing down?

Rooster, Ive read some good stuff on the 6mm ai and like it but...ya cant just say something like that without throwing some numbers out...lol so...whatcha getting?

Boots, thats pretty wicked fast....we are talking major red mist factor right? Something almost magical about 4000fps, even just seein it on the chrono.

[scope eye]

When I went down to 6mm I did not have to trim, only when i went down to 22 X 55 did I have to trim, are you going to go the barrel nut route with your 700, if you are looking for load data just use 6mm-284 and you will be fine, with some load work up you will end up sending 75gr bullets over 4000 fps, heck I have been sending 87gr Vmax's over 3800 fps, so there is your Red Mist effect, I have found that Lapua brass goes well into the 70,000 psi range, before starting to show any signs of pressure, gotta love it.

Dean

[scooterf79]

Good, gotcha on the trim length....
Yep, plan is to put a nut on the 700
So, is 4000fps mark for mere mortals or just you? Lol
The red mist affect will be awesome I'm sure
Load data was gonna be my next set of questions, are you getting tired of answering them yet lol
Ive heard Lapua is the best you can get so... whats not to like?
Thanks for the info!
Scooter

[Rooster 50]

Thanks for the update and all the info. This cartridge seems to have the best of both worlds with accuracy and speed which I really like. I want to build something super accurate (for me anyway) but always love speed, especially for varmints. Your update on the other thread sounds like the accuracy is fantastic! .2s???? Thats awesome! Sounds as though this might be right with the 6-284 with speed isnt it?
Gotcha on it fitting a 308 box. The 700 I'll convert is just what I happen to have so thats why I wanted to make sure a short action cartridge.
I dont think ill go with the neck turn option, unless theres some advantage to it, but if I go that route Ill be in touch :)
As far as case length, did you need to trim any after sizing down?

Rooster, Ive read some good stuff on the 6mm ai and like it but...ya cant just say something like that without throwing some numbers out...lol so...whatcha getting?

Boots, thats pretty wicked fast....we are talking major red mist factor right? Something almost magical about 4000fps, even just seein it on the chrono.

3350fps with a 95gr VLD. I achieved those speeds with several different powders. Accuracy was outstanding. 1/2 MOA @ 100 thru 600.

[bootsmcguire]

Yup, 4000fps is sure to give you the mist factor. Those 58's at that speed did a number on some pdogs a couple years back when I was out west.

I have been working on my 6-WSM trying to get the 105's up that fast, so far I have made it to 3750fps but I have some slower powders to try that I am pretty sure will get me close. The 6x55 wildcat has my attention as well, I may just have to add one to my stable before too long. You guys keep talking about it I may have to give Jim a call, but I better get some of these others settled in first.