Help choosing optics. yes again.

pwdnt · 07-06-2014, 12:56 AM

Hello, I know that this subject has been covered to hell and back but have never found the answer that fits for my self so heres the deal.

Max budget 600 usd.
Calliber: .308 that will eventually turn into a 7mm-08
Max range 1000 meters
primary uses, long range target shooting, predator hunting, prong horn hunting and maybe an elk hunt or two.
shooting area phoenix arizona some woods mostly in plains and desert area.
options I've looked at and am strongly considering.

Vortex Viper HS 4-16x50 versatility of a multipower scope decent glass for the price good tracking
SWFA sss 10x42 good tracking decent glass simplicity.

Pros cons other suggestions all are what i'm looking for.

**LoneWolf** · 07-06-2014, 04:37 AM

You'll get a better more useful reticle from the SWFA and the open target style turrets that make it much easier to make quick adjustments. I'd go with the 3-9 if stuck on $600, but if you can do just a little more the 3-15 power would be all your rifle ever needs.

The Vortex HS-T 4-16 would be better than the HS model, but another big difference between the line of vortex scopes your looking at compared to the SWFA is the the Vortex is Second Focal Plane (SFP) meaning the reticle markings will vary depending on magnification level. Vortex sets their SFP scopes up for the markings to be exact only at the highest magnification. This is important to understand for holds off on wind or elevation.

Example 1mil = 1mil at 16x on the reticle, but 1mil at 4x = 4mil on the reticle. This is for the hashmarks on the reticle.

On the SWFA the markings on the reticle are the same at all levels of magnification. Mean 1mil marking at 3x is still 1mil when zoomed to 15x and everything in between.

Hope this provided good info and did not confuse you. I started with a SWFA 10x42 SS. I originally got the MOA adjustments with the Mil Dot reticle. This confused me and I couldn't easily determine my hold offs and always had to dial the adjustment. I traded it in for a SWFA SS 12x42 mil/mil with the Mil-Quad reticle and having the same markings on the Reticle as the turrets made a huge difference in the level of accuracy at range I could accomplish. You'll want the variable power scope if using for hunting as well because you'll need that low magnification. It is also my recommendation to get a FFP scope to remove that one extra item you have to think about while learning the skills of long range shooting.

If you keep up with it you'll end up like me building a new rifle and topping it with the high glass like the Razor HD. The game is addicting!

SteelerNation · 07-06-2014, 01:14 PM

I'm very interested in this post as well. Sounds similar to what I was going through before I made my choice...errrrr...rather, narrowed them down to just a few.

**mattri** · 07-06-2014, 01:18 PM

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/178...ProductFinding

I have this scope on a 7mm-08 rifle that I use for targets out to 1k and hunting deer, coyotes etc. Couldn't be happier with it. Bright and clear, love the reticle, much better than a mil-dot in my opinion.

SteelerNation · 07-06-2014, 01:21 PM

Originally Posted by LoneWolf

You'll get a better more useful reticle from the SWFA and the open target style turrets that make it much easier to make quick adjustments. I'd go with the 3-9 if stuck on $600, but if you can do just a little more the 3-15 power would be all your rifle ever needs.

The Vortex HS-T 4-16 would be better than the HS model, but another big difference between the line of vortex scopes your looking at compared to the SWFA is the the Vortex is Second Focal Plane (SFP) meaning the reticle markings will vary depending on magnification level. Vortex sets their SFP scopes up for the markings to be exact only at the highest magnification. This is important to understand for holds off on wind or elevation.

Example 1mil = 1mil at 16x on the reticle, but 1mil at 4x = 4mil on the reticle. This is for the hashmarks on the reticle.

On the SWFA the markings on the reticle are the same at all levels of magnification. Mean 1mil marking at 3x is still 1mil when zoomed to 15x and everything in between.

Hope this provided good info and did not confuse you. I started with a SWFA 10x42 SS. I originally got the MOA adjustments with the Mil Dot reticle. This confused me and I couldn't easily determine my hold offs and always had to dial the adjustment. I traded it in for a SWFA SS 12x42 mil/mil with the Mil-Quad reticle and having the same markings on the Reticle as the turrets made a huge difference in the level of accuracy at range I could accomplish. You'll want the variable power scope if using for hunting as well because you'll need that low magnification. It is also my recommendation to get a FFP scope to remove that one extra item you have to think about while learning the skills of long range shooting.

If you keep up with it you'll end up like me building a new rifle and topping it with the high glass like the Razor HD. The game is addicting!

I also have been looking at SWFA scopes. I have a question, if you don't mind me chiming in....

Is the quality of the glass the same on the fixed power models and variable power models? One thing I learned, and this may apply to your, OP, desire for target shooting, is that a fixed power scope will save you LOTS of money over a variable power. So long as the optical quality on both are the same (fixed vs. variable), this may be the way I go as well.

**LoneWolf** · 07-06-2014, 01:25 PM

they use the same glass in all their scopes accept for the HD versions. Reason I recommend Variable for the op is because he stated he'll use it for hunting as well. Wouldn't want to try to make a shot on a large moving target stuck at 10x or better at short range.

SteelerNation · 07-06-2014, 01:37 PM

Originally Posted by LoneWolf

they use the same glass in all their scopes accept for the HD versions. Reason I recommend Variable for the op is because he stated he'll use it for hunting as well. Wouldn't want to try to make a shot on a large moving target stuck at 10x or better at short range.

Good advice! He shouldn't listen to me....I'm still learning! Thanks!

so, how do you like that 12/42? Can you compare it to any other scopes? This is one I am thinking of buying....

pwdnt · 07-06-2014, 06:10 PM

Thanks for the advice and input. after some research and input from lonewolf ill be saving my pennies for an extra week or two to get the swfa ss 3-15. reasons: it will cover all of my needs even after i swap to 7mm-08 and am able to shoot at longer ranges the price is right.and from my reseach people are happy with them and few complaints can be found. another question though. what accesories would you guys recommend? i'm thinking either a flash kill or a sunshade so that predators are less likely to spot me from a distence. overkill or usefull? as for the mount and rings i'm thinking EGW 20moa base and buris zee rings yay or nay?

**foxx** · 07-06-2014, 06:24 PM

pwdnt, if you're not happy with it when it coms in, give me a shout. I'll give you a couple hundred for it. :)

I've been drooling over those since they first came out. I gotta think they are the ideal hunting/tactical short/long range scope within the reasonably affordable range (Not really sure what "reasonably affordable" means, notice I still don't have one).

**LoneWolf** · 07-06-2014, 11:50 PM

Originally Posted by SteelerNation

Good advice! He shouldn't listen to me....I'm still learning! Thanks!

so, how do you like that 12/42? Can you compare it to any other scopes? This is one I am thinking of buying....

The 12x42 is a stellar optic. It does everything one would want for what it is. I've used for F-class matches at 600 and 1000yds, as well as long range steel matches between 100-900yds. It has not been unusual for me to out score guys with Night Force Glass and the like. It's a really good tool t have in your box while learning to shoot long range.

While that being said I decided to step up to Vortex Razor HD 5-20x50 for my next build as I have also learned the value of having good clear glass that helps with reading the down range conditions. Plus where I shoot competition there are some small targets in the 600-800yds are of the range that I would like the be able to see a little better. I am debating changing out the 12x42 to the 3-15x42 though after getting my new rig up and running.

**kevwil** · 07-07-2014, 02:27 AM

Originally Posted by LoneWolf

I am debating changing out the 12x42 to the 3-15x42 though after getting my new rig up and running.

I find the extra thickness of the reticle (0.06 vs 0.05) to be a bit of a downside with the 3-15x42. Otherwise, it's a fantastic scope, just like the 12x42.

**LoneWolf** · 07-07-2014, 03:19 AM

Originally Posted by kevwil

I find the extra thickness of the reticle (0.06 vs 0.05) to be a bit of a downside with the 3-15x42. Otherwise, it's a fantastic scope, just like the 12x42.

That's why if the target is small you dial it so you can hold the target inside one of the hollow diamonds. That's what makes their reticle so nice for long range on small targets.

**mattri** · 07-07-2014, 07:11 PM

That's one of the big pluses to the Vortex reticle as well, much better for precision work.

pwdnt · 07-08-2014, 04:18 AM

apparently they have done away with the traditional mill dot and now use a milquad reticle http://swfa.com/SWFA-SS-3-15x42-Tact...pe-P62238.aspx <- new reticle on all the new ss scopes

**LoneWolf** · 07-08-2014, 04:26 AM

They only use the Mil-Dot reticle on their MOA Scopes. Kinda weird, but some people still like that traditional PITA kinda stuff.

kaiser552 · 07-26-2014, 07:32 PM

Look at the vortex hs long range. Its a little over 600.00 but the reticle is really worth it I love mine.

**Hotolds442** · 07-27-2014, 07:41 AM

Since you put a $600 limit on it, I'd consider this one: http://www.cameralandny.com/optics/zeiss.pl?page=521450

**taylorce1** · 07-27-2014, 10:25 AM

Make mine Mil/Mil or MOA/MOA that makes everything easier in the long run, Mil/MOA is just a PITA. My next scope on my new LR build will probably be a fixed 6X SS from SWFA.