Anything 1/2 moa or less is good enough for all types of shooting. And about centering the group in the bullseye, when shooting for groups size I prefer not to zero the scope in the middle of the bull so my aim point doesn't get all shredded with bullet holes.Originally Posted by rckendall
I am am still in the load testing phase, so my group isn't centered, but my first group of 5 at 100 yards was about 1/2", which I had done a couple other times, but I was still pleased with it. Then, I shot this group! I couldn't see the holes well because of the light, so I wasn't sure of what I was seeing. Boy was I pleased!
The rifle is a 12FV in 223 from Cabelas shooting 69 grain SMK over 23.8 gn of IMR 8208, loaded at mag length. It has a Harris bipod and I shoot from the prone position.
5 shot group
Once a load averages 1/2moa or better I'm done with the development. I do emphasize on the "Average". I'll shoot several five shot groups and average them.
5 shots at 300 yards
140 Gr ELD-M, 42.3 gr IMR-4451, Lapua small primer brass (reformed from .308 Palma), 2.825" COAL (-.020")
Savage Model 10T in MDT Tac-21, Atlas PSR bipod, Red-Tac Rear Bag, (new Benchmark 6.5 Creed., 24", 1:8, 3-groove barrel)
Vertical dispersion was only .187 MOA but the wind was a little "Problematic". It spread the group out to the .315 MOA horizontal.
That's what's fun about this sport. Wanting to come back the next day and improve on what you did yesterday.
+1
It's no big deal to just make a correction after shooting the group with a click or two here and there. Groups are easy to adjust, once you can shoot nice small groups.
Very nice! I've just started work on one that will be 6.5 Creedmoor. I hope mine does as well.5 shots at 300 yards
140 Gr ELD-M, 42.3 gr IMR-4451, Lapua small primer brass (reformed from .308 Palma), 2.825" COAL (-.020")
Savage Model 10T in MDT Tac-21, Atlas PSR bipod, Red-Tac Rear Bag, (new Benchmark 6.5 Creed., 24", 1:8, 3-groove barrel)
Vertical dispersion was only .187 MOA but the wind was a little "Problematic". It spread the group out to the .315 MOA horizontal.
That's what's fun about this sport. Wanting to come back the next day and improve on what you did yesterday.
Richard
Load testing with my new Criterion SS 28" 308 Win 1-10 that I bought from Jim at NSS. 175 SMK, 43.8gr Varget, CCI LR Primers, .018 off lands in Lapua brass. [IMG][/IMG]
Posted this in another thread, but I cannot expect much more from my 66 year old eyes and nerves, and the fact I am at best a novice. May not be able to duplicate, but have been close to this a number of times. Just recently settled on this combo. The ADI brass was tried to make sure the FC brass was my best choice.
12FV, .223, Vortex Crossfire ll 6-18x44, 69 SMK .030 otl, FC brass, 24.5 IMR4895, 100 yds.
Bottom left.
Attachment 3819
New bullet, new powder, load workup at 200 yards. This should work.
Rifle is same as in my earlier post of a 300 Y target. Only 200 yards this time (got lazy and didn't want to walk as far).
The top shot was a called miss (using the universal signal "$h!t") as just plain shot before ready.
The four shot group measured .107 MOA before the flier ruined it.
Load was a 147 gr Hornady ELD-M with 40.2 gr of RL-17 in some Petersen Cartridge Co brass I was trying out. Speed just over 2700 fps which seems to be the sweet spot for my 24" barrel when shooting 140-147 gr bullets. I suppose I could go faster but 2700 fps gets me well past 1K and that's good enough for me.
One thing I noticed about the 147 gr ELD-M's is they don't seem to know any wind is blowing at 300 yards or less.
Since this was a load workup I didn't want to shoot out my aim point. A couple clicks here and a few there should put that group right smack in the "money zone".
260 Rem Match 25" CBI Varmint contour
First 5 shot group @ 100 yards... shot during break in process.
42 Gr. H4350 143 ELD-X @ 2.89 COAL... Zeroed @ 50 yards, then just shot @ 100
did not change dope at all. Orange dot is .5" in size.
I always throw the 5th shot out....( I thinks it's because I'm not thinking about the one hole group until I see the first 4 in one hole).... Then I go... "Wow" this 5th shot really needs some extra focus, and I'll have A "One Hole Group"... BANG!! NOPE!!
This is only 3rds, but I through my magneto speed on and shot the other 2 from this load over it on a separate target. I didn't take a picture of it, but they both went through the same hole as well about .5" higher POI with the Chrono attached! I'm going to try and get it back out 1 evening this week to zero it up and shoot it at 200 yards. before I take it to a match this weekend.
XCaliber 8 Twist 6.5 Blank with Cryo treatment.
Apache Gun Works 25" Heavy Palma Contour Chambered in 6.5x47 Lapua
140 Berger Hybrid
36.4grs Varget
cci450
Jumped .020
2775FPS
Lot's of superb groups on this thread.
I am however very much impressed with m12lrs last post of his Five 5-shot groups. I wouldn't mess with that gun or load for the life of me.
Here is a pic of a recent group my brother shot with his 308win Shilen barreled lefty mod 11 in a boyds stock. At 109 Yards off Harris bi-pod, 5 shots.
168 SMK,
43.4 gr Varget
Win. Brass (On it's 27th reload !)
BR-2
2.750" ( 0.010" jump)
Pic of his rifle...
Worked on finalizing powder/bullet combination for remage-bartlein 6mmBR. Finally broke under the .2" mark by trying different seating depths. Looks like .020" off the lands is the ticket.
Savage FP10 .223. 69 grain Sierra HPBT, 24 grains H335, CCI primer Win case sized to specs. 12 rounds at 100 yards U.S. quarter used for size comparison.
Pvt. Joker
Nice shooting. What is your glass and what power are you using?
23.6gr of IMR 8208 with Hornady 68gr OTM gave me almost the same results. Pulled the bullet on Australian Outback 69gr Sierra and they were using 23.6gr of what looks very similar to 8208.
What do you mean? Mag length. What is your OAL?
It is a Leupold VX2 6-18 X40mm with high turrets. Ken Farrell base and rings, Harris 6-9" bipod. 18 power used IIRC
Model 111, in 3006, stock with a hand loaded Nosler Balistic Tip 150gn at 2950fps.
CCI 200 primer, Remington brass, OAL 3.325”. IMR 4350, 58.6gn, Shot with a 20mph head wind at 45 degree angle.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
New 260 barrel load development
4461 and Berger hybrid 140’s
3@100
Old 260 barrel
both shilen prefits.
4461 with eldm 140’s
3@200 yards.
Ill probably never beat this.
Old barrel again.
5@100
Latest art work....100yards zero, after setting CRS/Custom Stop Zero on turret....
First shot right, adjusted left, then 3shot zero at bull...12FV is proven tack driver...Hornady, 40gr V-Max Varmints Express @100yds.
Perpetual Optimism is a force Multiplier....
I did a little load testing the other day at 100 yards with both my Savage .223 and my Savage 6.5mm Creedmoor. I was pleased with the results.
The first photo is a five-shot group with a 28" X-Caliber barrel using 25.14gr IMR 8208 XBR (the charge weight printed data on the target is a typo) behind Berger VLD 80gr bullets, CCI 450 primers, Lapua brass, and a .020" jump. MV was 2918 fps. The group size is .249 MOA and the Mean Radius is .099, which is not bad for an inexpensive gun.
The second photo is a five shot group from my Savage 6.5mm Creedmoor with a 28" Bartlein barrel using 39.99gr Reloder RL-16 and Berger 140gr hybrids seated at a .030" jump with CCI 450 primers and Lapua brass. The MV was 2701 fps. I'm quite happy with the MOA of 0.194 and a Mean Radius of only 0.062.
In spite of the small group size which were the best of the day for each rifle, I didn't use either of these loads in the subsiquent F-Class match because there were results for heavier charge weights producing lower ES and SD figures along with significantly higher MVs coupled with group sizes which were nearly as good as these.
By the way, my Creedmoor was made from a Cabelas 12FV on sale for $319 with a $100 rebate. I recovered $100 by selling the unfired barrel, so I started with a $119 action and trigger. I did some trigger work to make it more like my Savage Target Actions and fitted a Bartlein barrel. I bedded the action in an inexpensive Boyd's laminated stock, filled the mag well and forearm void with lead to increase the weight and had a competition rifle suitable for F-Open matches for less than $800 not counting the scope. I tied for high score last weekend but got nicked for first place by one X by a guy shooting a rifle worth four times what mine cost.
Factory ammo, Black Hills 308 - 168 HPBT
Savage 10 TR LEO
Cadex competition chassis
All groups are 5 rounds, no rear bag, on bipod.
0.26 MOA
0.33 MOA
I was also trying out different ammo and the Berger 185 sent at least one flyer with each group (most likely me).
The rifle seems to shoot 1/2" MOA all day, I have data out to 400 with the original stock. I will be interested to see how it shoots beyond 200 m with the Cadex installed and a rear bag. The Cadex made a huge difference with the chassis and muzzle break. If anyone is interested I can post the numbers.
Spotter isn't any help...
That's a helluva shooter for a factory barrel !
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