Reply With QuoteThat chambering will defiantly be my next 6mm barrel.
Dean
Jim at Apache will soon be building a barrel for my next build, a 6x55 Improved 30 degree. It uses the same 6.5x55 Swede Lapua brass Dean is using in his .22 Eroder. At $70 per hundred, this brass is hard to beat in strength, tolerance, and price. I started a trial run of necking the brass down to 6mm by using a gutted 243 Winchester sizing die, but the body was a bit too large so I stopped after the first trial round. I was about .100 short of completely sizing the neck, leaving a donut that would have made chambering impossible. I had a set of 6mm dies I had no use for, so I took the sizing die to work and turned it down to the body/shoulder junction. The first 100 rounds are now neck sized to 6mm with no issues and no donut at the junction. This round should easily top the 6mmAI, pushing a 105 AMax somewhere in the neighborhood of 3400-3500fps, and should run the 75's around 4000. I'll start building fireforming loads once I get the barrel from Apache and the headspace gauges from the big "M". The 6br sizing die will neck size, and bump the shoulder if needed, but with it being an improved round, I may have to have dies made for resizing the larger body, we'll see once things start coming together.
Last edited by Hotolds442; 02-26-2014 at 09:56 PM.
Originally Posted by keeki
Guess it doesn't really matter. If ya cant afford $15, you won't be buying much anyways
That chambering will defiantly be my next 6mm barrel.
Dean
RUMs are like woman in Stiletto heals, you know they are going to put you in the poor house, but that has never stopped anyone from pursuing them.
223-64gr Berger HP, 6x55-105 Hornady HPBT, 6.5x284-123 Hornady SST
The 6x55 is not the improved 30 degree version and still needs to be fireformed. It is also .005 shorter than a Savage 308 length magazine box.
Originally Posted by keeki
Guess it doesn't really matter. If ya cant afford $15, you won't be buying much anyways
Neat project, wildcats are fun.Originally Posted by Hotolds442
What's the case capacity of the cartridge?
I don't know what length barrel you have nor do I know your tolerance of high pressure but I don't think you'll get close to 3500 with a 105 in a 24-26" tube at anything below the mid to high 70's in pressure. A thirty inch barrel would get you there at sane pressure levels but who wants to tote a heavy 30"+ tube around?
I'm thinking the high 33's or the very low 34's with a 24" tube operated at <66,000psi.
Even the Lazzeroni 6.17 Spitfire with it's ~74gr capacity won't usually break 35 in a 24" tube until pressures are 71K plus. Even then only one or two powders get it to 35.
I'm an inveterate speed freak but I do try to stay under a measured (Pressure Trace) 70k.
A 105 Amax whistling along at 3400fps is definitely nothing to sneeze at!
The case capacity is 58gr, and with 105gr Amax's I get 3300fps out of my 243AI and 3600fps with my 6-06AI so that should fall right in between, both of mine are 12 twists so that helps but still, that's the beauty of the Lapua brass it is good for pressures in the mid 70s before it starts showing signs of pressure.
Dean
RUMs are like woman in Stiletto heals, you know they are going to put you in the poor house, but that has never stopped anyone from pursuing them.
What is the tube length?
What's the capacity of your 6mm-06AI?
I have never felt uncomfortable pushing 70k in any, well maintained, quality bolt action.
That said, when you're working with compressed loads strange things happen now and then.
Shooting a string of twenty which all measure close to 65k as measured with the Pressure Trace it surprises you when the next cartridge using the exact same load suddenly registers 77k!
This is inexplicable but it happen often enough that I'm wary of routinely loading to much over 70k.
I will add that although the brass is considered the weak link which warns you of too high pressure the rifle itself is also subject to the added strain. Many rifles will handle 75k every day for generations but some otherwise stout rifles will fail due to the added strain. Could be a metallurgical problem, a manufacturing problem, or a maintenance problem but shrapnel at the range or in the woods is something I always try to avoid.
Last edited by Savage6x284; 02-27-2014 at 07:06 PM.
Barrel length is 26" I don't know what the case capacity for they 6mm06AI as far as water is, but I can fit 75gr of CFE223 into a case.
Dean
RUMs are like woman in Stiletto heals, you know they are going to put you in the poor house, but that has never stopped anyone from pursuing them.
I'll be happy to nudge 35 with the 105 in my 24" 8 twist 5R Rock in 6mm-284.
Mid 34's would be fine too but I have a problem with liking to see bigger numbers on my chronograph.
I'll likely stop when my PT records a fairly consistent 70k.
I do believe I said it should push the 105 AMax somewhere in the neighborhood of 3400-3500 in the first post. I have no idea yet where it'll end up. So what if it only turns 3400. It's not like I'm trying to build the biggest, fastest 6mm since the invention of black powder. All it needs to to for me is puff coyotes with a resounding thud. They won't care if it's 3400 or 3500 either.
My local Sportsmans had 8 1lb cans of H1000 on the shelf today, I grabbed two so I'll get to work up some loads with that, also. 100 rounds of Lapua brass is neck sized to 6mm, another 100 on the big brown truck. Hopefully the barrel will be here next week so I can start working up loads for it. I'm getting antsy!
Last edited by Hotolds442; 03-13-2015 at 10:23 PM.
Originally Posted by keeki
Guess it doesn't really matter. If ya cant afford $15, you won't be buying much anyways
"It's not like I'm trying to build the biggest, fastest 6mm since the invention of black powder"
No that's my job,LOL
Dean
PS: I am sure it will make for an awesome round.
RUMs are like woman in Stiletto heals, you know they are going to put you in the poor house, but that has never stopped anyone from pursuing them.
So I've noticed!
Until you neck that 20mm round down to 6mm, you've got nothing but pop guns.
From left to right: .223, .338 lapua, 50BMG, 20MM Vulcan
Originally Posted by keeki
Guess it doesn't really matter. If ya cant afford $15, you won't be buying much anyways
As I said in my initial post.
A 105 Amax whistling along at 3400fps is definitely nothing to sneeze at!
Try some Magpro if you can find it. It consistently gives me the highest speeds in cartridges of this approximate case capacity. Being a ball powder it also meters superbly.
A bit sensitive to very high ambient temps as are most ball powders but nothing dangerous or potentially catastrophic about it. One of my favorite powders.
Hotolds442, just curious, why did you go for the 30 degree shoulder angle ?
Thanks.........Jim
The 30 degree shoulder comes from the 6BR reamer used to cut the chamber, run in an additional .580 or so. So basically this is a 6br x 55mm.
Originally Posted by keeki
Guess it doesn't really matter. If ya cant afford $15, you won't be buying much anyways
You guys are amateurs!
"As long as there's lead in the air....there's still hope.."
Now we're cooking!
Dean will be here shortly to droll all over them.....
ETA: the cartridge on the right has a case diameter larger than the threads on a small shank Savage action. I'm guessing 20mm Vulcan necked down to .224
Last edited by Hotolds442; 02-28-2014 at 01:32 PM.
Originally Posted by keeki
Guess it doesn't really matter. If ya cant afford $15, you won't be buying much anyways
[QUOTE=Hotolds442;246907]Now we're cooking!
Dean will be here shortly to droll all over them.....
I'm not Worthy I'm not Worthy.
Signed
By a Mere Peasant
RUMs are like woman in Stiletto heals, you know they are going to put you in the poor house, but that has never stopped anyone from pursuing them.
Thanks Hotolds442. I figured the 30 degree shoulder came from something like that.
"Not that there's anything wrong with a 30 degree shoulder"! ;-)).........Jim
The barrel is in transit!
I hope to have a range report on Thursday if everything goes as planned.
Originally Posted by keeki
Guess it doesn't really matter. If ya cant afford $15, you won't be buying much anyways
I expect a full report on my desk in the morning.
Dean
RUMs are like woman in Stiletto heals, you know they are going to put you in the poor house, but that has never stopped anyone from pursuing them.
No joke about the 20mm case. There are guys fooling around with those necked down to 50.
You got it, Chief!I expect a full report on my desk in the morning.
Dean
Originally Posted by keeki
Guess it doesn't really matter. If ya cant afford $15, you won't be buying much anyways
Barrel is out for delivery, I should have it in a couple of hours. I'll set the headspace on some new Lapua brass necked to 6mm with a slight crush fit on the shoulder and touch off a few rounds hopefully later this afternoon for fireforming and see what happens.
ETA: Hit a slight snag. Looks like the necks of my formed cases need to be turned. The barrel came shipped with a 6.5x55 empty in the chamber that was necked down to 22. Protrusion is a measured .125". Protrusion of the 6x55 empties I have measure .190", neck diameter is .273 empty, .275 with a bullet seated. I'm in a hold pattern until I talk to Jim and get the reamer specs.
Last edited by Hotolds442; 03-12-2014 at 07:13 PM.
Originally Posted by keeki
Guess it doesn't really matter. If ya cant afford $15, you won't be buying much anyways
ruh roh....I've been patiently following this thread waiting on a range report!
Jim at Apache, being the stand-up guy that he is, turned 20 rounds on his lathe and mailed them out to me on Friday. They arrived this afternoon right after I left for work. rickiesrevenge over on specialtypistols will have 100 rounds of my brass tomorrow and will turn them and ship them back to me in the next week or so. I have a K&M that I ordered from Bruno's on Friday, but I have heard nothing but crickets from them since placing the order last week. I'm off Thursday and Friday, so I'll do some fireforming, and then do some max charge work ups after a run to Costco to order a new safe. Once I find my max powder charge with H4350, I'll load up some more using H1000 and find max again. I'll only be using Hornady 105 HPBT's in this rifle for the time being, I've got 1000 of them on hand, so my bullet selection is already made. I'm on the hunt for some MagPro, and will do max charge work ups with it too when I find it. Then I'll drop 4 grains from all three max loads and start working back up in 1/2 grain increments, shooting 5 round groups for accuracy at each step. Once I find the sweet spot I'll start playing with seating depth and see what happens. A big thanks again goes to Jim at Apache, here's proof that he'll take care of you after the sale, too!
Originally Posted by keeki
Guess it doesn't really matter. If ya cant afford $15, you won't be buying much anyways
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