Bob - Congratulations on finding a CZ 527! Those are some good shooters (from reading) and you will not have to work on the ejection issues. Since I already committed to the 221 Rem FB on a Savage action I will be staying with plan A. I will be using a single feed adapter and leave the ejector and spring out so I can pick the spent cartridge. This is fun!
I'm still wanting a SAVAGE .221 Rem FB, so I'm going to save up a few bucks and take n4ue's advice in post #14 and build it on an Axis .223. I don't have the skill or tools he does, but I'm sure I can find a good gunsmith to follow the instructions n4ue has been kind enough to lay out. Then there is still the T/C Encore MGM barrel route! A little is good, a lot is better, and too much is just enough!
I put together a 221 FB a couple of years ago. Ordered a Douglas barrel and used a model 12 action from a .223. I really like the little fireball but it got taken away from me. See, I proceeded to try some cast bullets and managed to flub it up with a S.E.E. The thread is on here somewhere but I'm too lazy to do a search for it. Anyhow, it got taken away. The action was toast but I sent the barrel back to Douglas for them to check it out along w/pics and the story. I talked to them and the chamber and barrel was A O Kay so I screwed the barrel onto another action and away we went. She won't let me touch it now. She call's it "Billy"..as in Billy Bad A...
I was jealous so I purchased another .221 barrel from ER Shaw, purchased from a sponsor here, Gun Shack. Used a Stevens action from a .223 center feed for the donor build. I have 2ea .223 Stevens and 2ea .221 FB's now, all w/SSS triggers & Vortex Diamond Back scopes. Both FB's shoot good using 15gr of Lil Gun, Rem. 7-1/2 primers & 40gr zmax's. Couldn't be more happier w/the little FB's, easy on powder, easy to load for, fairly quiet compared to the 16" barrel .223 AR's we shoot. I use Remington brass, bought new about 2 years ago. On the 6th trip through the sizer and seems to be chugging right along.
Old topic, I know....
There is a great article on the .221 FB as used in a rifle, in this months American Rifleman. I have owned a .221 XP-100 for years and loved it except for the muzzle blast from the 10" bbl.
The reloading info for this sweet little ctg is almost always about the handgun loads.
Years ago, the Engineers at Rem said it was one of the most efficient ctg they had ever worked with.
90% of the velocity of a .223 with way less powder.
I converted an Axis .223 (I have 5) into the FB. Initally, I made a .223 'short', because some folks said it couldn't be done. It worked OK, but then I had to resize .221 brass. So, I caved and bought a .221 reamer and that was that.
NO recoil and 3500+ fps, what's not to love?
ron
Ron,Originally Posted by n4ue
I just got my new Armerican Rifleman magazine today, I'll check out the info on the .221 FB. Thanks!
Bob
Bob, great. One thing that was VERY unusual.... I just happened to have all 4 of the recommended powders.....
ron
Ron,
Good for you! I'm still looking for Li'l Gun and Red Dot, but I do have others to use in the mean time. I've been haunting the powder companies lately and they swear that the supply will match the demand by Fall 2014, just as the primer situation. They all claim that hoarders will be overstocked by then and the rest of us should be able to get what we need when we need it. We'll see.
Bob
Bob, my lgs (out in the boonies) had 3 jars of Li'l Gun (I bought 2) and recently has a ton of primers. Hopefully, the hoarders will get stuck with a ton of stuff they can't flip.....
Still near riot conditions at the local Wally Worlds when the ammo comes out.... ha ha
ron
n4ue,
I went shooting yesterday and one of the guys I shoot with thinks he may be able to get me some Lil Gun and Red Dot. He shoots leagues in a few states and always gets powder, so it's looking good!
Bob
the 221 is a fun round, it's reaped pdogs out to 400yds, I built it off a stevens 200 it is a single shot with a shilen barrel
texasgunclass,
Nice build!
Bob
It has been a while since I ordered a 221 FB from ERShaw. Update - 6 months plus later, still waiting. I called today and it is still not in the production line. I had hoped to have it for a 4th of July break from work. Missed that one. . . looking to cooler weather in the fall now.
I knew they were backed up but I didn't think it was that long! But when you get it, and you will, I'm sure you can count on it being a good shooter :-)) ...... Jim
I guess if you REALLLLY wanted one bad 'nuf, do what I did...... Faced off a 223 bbl, and re-chambered with a PTG 221 FB reamer.
EZ enuf..... As I said a while back, I did it because my XP-100 (.221) is not too much 'fun' to shoot, but in a rifle, it's great.
I have a few new 223 bbls from here, ePay and my own rifles I've re-barreled....
ron
Ron:
I even considered making a "long necked" .221 fireball out of a .223 barrel but got sidetracked. Forgot what made me change directions. My XP 100 in .221 Fireball was a literal "blast" to shoot. It's called a "Fireball" for a reason.
Hitting steel out past 400+ yards would put a smile on anyones face. My pistol action got changed into a BR rifle. Still deadly accurate and much easier to shoot but, another BR pistol is in the works.
This time a 17 VHA. Should be a bughole maker with NO RECOIL to speak of. Mikie likes it!!
Oz never gave nothing to the Tin Man, that he didn't already have.
FW: Another update - I ended up NOT getting the ER Shaw barrel in 221FB. The factory is expanding and I was looking at another extension to the already long wait. I got a refund and bought a 22 Hornet in a Handi. Just got it from the gunsmith - reamed to 221 Fireball. Now to get out and try it out.
I also won a 223 Rem Marlin barrel and will setback and ream for 221 Fireball. I will get one on a Savage action some time (persistent) . . Thanks for encouragement here!!
Shag, great. I just 'found out' the other day that the Savage and Marlin bbls are interchangeable. Never would have quessed that!
I believed I mentioned that my first attempts at the 221 rifle was to simply shorten a 223 bbl. I was told it wouldn't work. Those that said that, were 1/2 right.
The ctg had to have a die made for it because of the lesser amount of body taper. Just modified a spare 223 die. I did some research and some old discussions called it the 223 Short. It shot just fine, but was a PITA.
So I just bought a PTG 221 FB reamer and easily fixed the issue. Yes, I remember a particular groundhog hunt in Ky with the XP-100. It was awesome, but my shooting buddy vowed never to go gh hunting with me again, unless I used a rifle!
ron
Ron,
The Marlin has a slightly smaller diameter, 1.055"? so I hope it is stable when tightened down. It also has a larger diameter in front of the threads which might interfere with the barrel nut. I may have to trim the barrel nut and maybe turn the shoulder down. It is not plug and play with a Savage barrel nut.
OK, I remember seeing a Marlin bbl for sale on eBay where it was stated they were interchangable. That was the first I had heard about that.
When I made my '223 Short', I had to trim the bbl nut also, but that was the easy part. In anticipation of all these rebarrelling jobs, I purchased several SS and black Axis nuts. Have fun and be safe....
ron
Ron- If recent Marlin 223, yes, I won that one.
Update on H&R 221fb - tested it today and it worked as planned. Iron sights at 50yds were as good as I do with 22LR. Took 20 rounds before the barrel got warm. Broke it in cleaning every 5 rounds for 25 rounds, no copper fouling. Glad to see that. It was a good day!
shagerott, glad you got it going. To be honest, I've only tried one 'rifle' load for the Axis, so far. There are load tables out 'there' for rifle loads, but I'm just trying to go through some of my 221 loads I worked up for the XP-100. My only load shot in the Axix so far is: Sierra 1410 / 16.0 gr IMR4198 These 52 gr bullets are HBN coated.
A load I worked up for the XP is Nosler 50 gr bt / 18 gr IMR4198. These particular bullets were plated with WS2. I have not shot either over my chrono, so no idea about velocity.....
As you can see, I'm a big fan of plated bullets! ha ha The1410 / 16.0 load shoots so good, I doubt if I'll even try to develop anything else. Have fun and enjoy the FB.....Kinda like a larger .22lr....
ron
Hi Ron, Thanks for the IMR4198 hint with 50gr Nosler (BT?). I tried starter loads of 844 with 50gr V-Max and 55gr SP. The V-Max shot higher at 50 yards. I also had some 40gr V-Max over 15.0gr Lil'Gun. No chrono, but those move right along in the 22-inch barrel.
shane
I have shot the 40 grain Vmax with up to 16 grains of Lil Gun (3600 FPS) and they shot one hole 5 shot groups at 100 yards. Pretty dang good in my book. After using this load for years I finally dropped it back to 15.5 grains and I think that I am going to stop there. Shoots fantastic and bolt lift is now a tad easier. I tried these out on prairie dogs in Wyoming a couple of months back and I don't think that there was a single complaint generated by any of the dogs as to how effective that load was. For sure, I will never leave my little Furball home again when I make my annual pasture pooch trip. Just too much fun!
Rustydust. Welcome to the club. I bought my XP-100 back in the 80s, but just recently decided to add a rifle in that caliber. Although I now own several 221s, I believe it was the Sierra Manual that said that the Remington Engineers developing the 221, said it was one of the most efficient ctgs they had worked with (at that time, of course. ha ha). I just found some Lil Gun for my 17s, thanks for the load data.
Also, there used to be a bunch of guys that had XP-100 competitions and shot some amazing groups. Of course, the XP's short action has no mag cutout....
Before I did the Axis, I actually thought about ditching the 10.5" bbl and putting on a longer tube. Glad I left it alone.
shagerott, the Noslers are PN 39522 Ballistic Tip Boat Tail
thanks for the chat, guys. Now, I 'almost' wish we had groundhogs, PDs, whatever, here in Florida! Just Yodel Dogs......
ron (just an old paper puncher)
Hey Ron
My hunting buddy drives from far eastern West Virginia to meet up with me in Wyoming every year. His wife has a sister in Casper so we hook up at a motel then use my truck to hunt out of while his wife and two girls stay at her sister's house. Works out well because the wife and kids get to enjoy a trip out west every year to visit kin and he gets to shoot prairie dogs with me. Oh, and this year in 5 days we killed over 1500 of them taking turns using my shooting bench while the other one spots. Killed them with every gun that I had with me on the trip including a 2" barreled Taurus .22 revolver and a .357 Magnum. Was quite a successful trip to say the least. I hope you can make it out someday. None of us getting any younger.
Last edited by Rustydust; 08-27-2014 at 09:30 PM.
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