***New design bolt lift kit reviews***

[dolomite_supafly]

I am starting this thread so those that have received my new design can post reviews.

I want everyone to hear everything the testers have to say, the good, the bad and of course the ugly.

Thanks to all the testers out there.

Dolomite

Edited to add:

This is not for the 38 special bolt lift kits. This is the new design that went out with instructions (except GaCop and savageboy which didn't get instructions).

I will not respond or try to make excuses for what is posted by the testers. If you have a legitimate question for the testers please ask as I am not trying to hide anything.

[LeeH]

WELL!!!! Here's a little update.
I received the new version today and had it installed in 15 minutes flat in
a 10FLCP-K in .223 with a SSS tactical bolt handle that a had really nasty pause in closing the bolt.
Using a cheap fish scale the lift was appox 4.5 to 5.5 lb's and like I mentioned
a bad "Catch" starting to close.
After installation the lift was around 3 lb. +or- and the "Catch" was GONE!!.
Absolutely no draggy feeling and felt like I filled it with butter.

Updates to follow....

[LeeH]

Another Tidbit....

I found out just now, that with the "New" style bolts that with the kit installed
it possible to insert the wrench and breakdown the bolt while it is Cocked.
No more gouging the side of my work bench re-cocking.

[wbm]

Put the kit on today. I couldn't tell a lot of difference on my rifle....however, it has always had a light bolt lift anyway. On the other hand I have a neighbor who brought down his new Savage 30-06 yesterday...the bolt lift was abysmal! It felt like it had been fired with a way over-max round in it. I will try out the lift-kit on his and let you know. Thanks for the parts!

[cwop]

i would like to know how you get a 3lb bolt lift?

thanks

bob

[LeeH]

A SWAG using a cheap fish scale and a very long SSS tactical bolt handle.
AND of course Dolomites lift kit.......

[kkeene]

After installation ..... the "Catch" was GONE!!.

My 243 model 16 has a definite "catch" when closing. I sure would like to try one of these kits!

Keith

[Bark]

Yep,I sure would appreciate one of your kits for my first Savage build.Your efforts to add to our shooting community are much respected here as I've said in other posts.Shoot me an email if there's anything I can do to assist in any of your projects.Life is good in Savageland. Mark

[Blue Avenger]

just put it in. the screw is not making contact with anything when the gun is in the un cocked position. there is now free space between the screw and spring.
cocking effort was lower due to no spring preload with the free space. low spring pressure would also lead to slower lock time.

[dmack]

just put it in. the screw is not making contact with anything when the gun is in the un cocked position. there is now free space between the screw and spring.
cocking effort was lower due to no spring preload with the free space. low spring pressure would also lead to slower lock time.

I’m new to Savage and have not seen this new design bolt lift kit so please excuse my ignorance.

If the device is limiting spring movement only in the uncocked pos, wouldn’t the spring PSI be the same when fully cocked/fired?

I’ve purchased a Mod 10PC (308) and it seems to take around 6lb to lift the bolt on an empty chamber when dry fried.

[LeeH]

On my New Style bolt (cocking indicator) I cannot discern any free space at all.
It "Might" slow down the lock time, But the few milliseconds if any, might bug
a bench rest shooter, but for the average shooter, I don't see a problem.
As I see it, the spring pressure when cocked would be the same.
Might be wrong, but that's how we learn.

[pklin]

dolomite, I don't have a Savage yet, but looking to get one soon, so when I do have one, how do I go about ordering one of your lift kits? Please excuse my ignorance of the purpose of your kit, but does it duplicate the result of a "timing job" on the action? I have often read people refer to their bolt lift being lighter after one of SSS' timing jobs...

Thanks!

[dolomite_supafly]

dolomite, I don't have a Savage yet, but looking to get one soon, so when I do have one, how do I go about ordering one of your lift kits? Please excuse my ignorance of the purpose of your kit, but does it duplicate the result of a "timing job" on the action? I have often read people refer to their bolt lift being lighter after one of SSS' timing jobs...

Thanks!

This absolutely does not replace a quality T&T job.

I am still waiting on all the reviews before I will consider having more made. After that I am still working out a fair way to get them out to people. I honestly have no plans to sell them but I will not go broke supplying everyone on here with one either. It will be a slow process but as it stands right now it is way to early to even consider handing them out.

Thanks
Dolomite

[mgs44mag]

What??

There's only 14756 members registered on here. You sure you can't make one for everybody?

[tacticalj]

Lol i'm sure that wouldn't cost to much. I'd be more then happy to donate or purchase from what i've heard so far! Appreciate all the information that everybody has supplied to me. I wonder though could a fella just take some length off the cocking sleeve? My bolt is very difficult to get back together, last time i tore my hand open with the screwdriver!

[Blue Avenger]

just put it in. the screw is not making contact with anything when the gun is in the un cocked position. there is now free space between the screw and spring.
cocking effort was lower due to no spring preload with the free space. low spring pressure would also lead to slower lock time.

did some measuring and found I have .0505 free travel of the firing pin. ( 2 different bolts)
the lock that the sleeve catches is .0620 thick so it barley keeps the pin locked while twisting on it to cock the gun.
I also have .o53 rotation of the sleeve inside the body, before things come into contact and the spring starts to compress.

when the firing pin is able to move back into the bolt head what keeps the primer from blowing back and rupturing?
I really do not think this would be safe to shoot!

[allan1066]

just put it in. the screw is not making contact with anything when the gun is in the un cocked position. there is now free space between the screw and spring.
cocking effort was lower due to no spring preload with the free space. low spring pressure would also lead to slower lock time.

when the firing pin is able to move back into the bolt head what keeps the primer from blowing back and rupturing?
I really do not think this would be safe to shoot!

Well Blue Avenger. I didn't think it was the firing pins job to stop the primer blowing out - Plenty of designs have a free floating firing pin - My old winchester for one.

[GaCop]

Installed the lift kit and spacer on my .223 bolt. The spacer slid on my BAS w/o and sanding. I was amazed at the smoothness of bolt operation and the easy of lifting the uncocked bolt with one finger. Lock time seems to be normal. Now to try it on the range. If all my Savages are improved like this, I want to buy at least a dozen of Gordon's kits.

A friend who owns a Savage "Competition" .308 tried my bolt lift after installing the kit and was duly impressed and wants one for his rifle.

[dolomite_supafly]

just put it in. the screw is not making contact with anything when the gun is in the un cocked position. there is now free space between the screw and spring.
cocking effort was lower due to no spring preload with the free space. low spring pressure would also lead to slower lock time.

did some measuring and found I have .0505 free travel of the firing pin. ( 2 different bolts)
the lock that the sleeve catches is .0620 thick so it barley keeps the pin locked while twisting on it to cock the gun.
I also have .o53 rotation of the sleeve inside the body, before things come into contact and the spring starts to compress.

when the firing pin is able to move back into the bolt head what keeps the primer from blowing back and rupturing?
I really do not think this would be safe to shoot!

I get what you are saying and I did observe the free travel on my bolt. But I am not sure if it should be that big of a concern. AR/M16 type rifles have a firing pin that is still floating at the time of firing. The firing pin is able to move very far down in the firing pin hole on the bolt. There is not anything to keep the primers from flowing back into the bolt on those weapons when fired. Unless there is some other problem going on there will be no flow of the primer into the bolt. I know someone is going to mention "hard primers", but most people who shoot their AR's don't shoot military ammo with hard primers but commercial ammo with softer primers.

I may have some kits made that allow the firing pin sit flush with the bolt face to do some more testing with. The difference between how far the kit puts the firing pin in the hole and flush is .033" on one of my test guns. That is .033” of free travel after the gun has been fired. That amount is small enough that it shouldn't make that dramatic of a change in the performance of the kit so it is definitely doable.

This leads to another concern of mine though. My firing pin is set for .044" protrusion on one of my test guns and the other is .039”. Because there can be all kinds of variance in protrusion of the firing pins making a "universal" kit to allow the firing pin sit flush is going to be nearly impossible. Making one specifically for a particular firearm is going to make the cost go up substantially as well as people having to wait to have them fitted. This is not an option in my eyes because I am wanting an easy way for people to reduce their bolt lifts without having to wait.

Just my thoughts on this.
Dolomite

[Dirk]

The AR15/M16 firing pin is maintained in the extended position during firing by the hammer. Primer flow-back (cratering) occurs in these rifles if the hammer spring is weak. Firing pins are MEANT to remain in the extended firing position during the entire time there is pressure in the cartridge case. This feature is what keeps primer material from flowing into the firing pin hole in the bolt.

[steveinwv]

Is there any real way to figure out who is doing a review here and who is not? I am only interested in hearing if it works or not from the people who are using it.

[Dirk]

Yeah, read the posts!

[dolomite_supafly]

Is there any real way to figure out who is doing a review here and who is not? I am only interested in hearing if it works or not from the people who are using it.

These members are the ones to get my initial batch to test:
wbm
LeeH
Lefty Savage
Peter_Kirch
Blue Avenger
savageboy
GaCop
1shot

Dolomite

[dolomite_supafly]

I decided to do ALOT more shooting to see if there is in fact any primer flow. I shot Winchester, Blackhills and Ultramax.

Here are cases fired from unmodified gun:
[img width=600 height=450]http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v446/Adyth/Savage/nomods2.jpg[/img]

And cases from the same gun with the kit installed:
Winchester:
[img width=600 height=450]http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v446/Adyth/Savage/Winchester.jpg[/img]
Ultramax:
[img width=600 height=450]http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v446/Adyth/Savage/Ultramax.jpg[/img]
Blackhills (the ones that did fire):
[img width=600 height=450]http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v446/Adyth/Savage/Blackhills.jpg[/img]

I can say that the Blackhills wasn't as reliable as commercial ammo, probably because of the harder primers they generally use. I would not recommend this kit for anyone who plans on shooting any ammunition with the harder primers, surplus or reloads using harder primers. Commercial ammo with the softer primers were and continue to be 100% reliable. The ammo shows a slightly lighter strike compared to the rounds fired from the same gun without the kit but it was still 100% reliable. This gun has a clipped spring as well which would further cause light strikes. Most people should not have issues unless there springs have been clipped also.

Dolomite

[mgs44mag]

I would assume you are getting cold fires with any of the ammo you are shooting. Reliable ignition makes consistant groups.

Is this also the firepin assembly that has the clipped springs?