Chasing Bugholes

[1Shot]

...You do a follow up on those loads yet... :-\

[MikeCTX]

Funny you should ask...

From last weekend the 69gr SMK with 24.7 Varget (did not get to print the same target) 4 of the 5 shots look good, there is just that one..0.856
[img width=397 height=450]http://lh6.ggpht.com/_5mQjiruUDT0/Sodsz8xzjyI/AAAAAAAAAkw/gMGBgZXAeEE/s512/69SMK8809V247.jpg[/img]

Found some CCI BR4 primers and picked some up, decided to try them (yeah I know added another variable)
but seem the grouping was not bad with them and the 69SMK.

Today 69gr SMK, with 24.4 Varget (again) but with CCI BR4 Primers(0.534):
[img width=370 height=450]http://lh5.ggpht.com/_5mQjiruUDT0/Sods0SOUI1I/AAAAAAAAAk0/YqWYXjlIoSE/s512/69SMK81509BR4.jpg[/img]

And the 77gr SMK, 22.5 Varget, CCI BR4 primers(1.110):
[img width=341 height=450]http://lh4.ggpht.com/_5mQjiruUDT0/Sods1CTogvI/AAAAAAAAAk4/MwBPfO0zzKU/s512/77SMK8809BR4.jpg[/img]

[MikeCTX]

Additional data from today's range visit!!

Loaded some 69gr SMK, 23.9gr H4895, Lapua brass, CCI BR4 primer - 1.012

69gr SMK, 24.7 Varget, Rem 71/2 primer, Rem brass - not bad .315 group of 4, the 5th one pushed the 5 shot group to .848

Wanted to try the accurate load from the Sierra manual for the 53gr SMK, using 26.9gr H335, Lapua brass and CCI BR4 primer. First shot fired - nothing not on paper, hmmmmm used one of the 69gr MK loads, right where it was supposed to be, another 53gr - still nothing. Aim high then low, nothing. Went ahead with the other loads, and after I finished tried the 53's again - this time with set the rifle up and then look over the scope to see if I could find impact....about 30 yd down range a nice cloud of gray smoke - guy next to me (we had already discussed) ask after the next round if I had tried the 53's again because he saw the gray smoke too. Guess the near 3300fps and the 7 twist are just to much for the 53's. Have read about this before, never seen it. So, no more 53gr SMK and H335 in the 7 twist rifle.

[stevec]

Mike, I lost some 105gr 6mm bergers @ about 30yds. I was using to slow of powder and the bullets just turned to a puff of smoke. went to a faster powder and actually shot them @ 300fps faster and didnt lose any. In your case I would say that twist is way to fast for 53s.

Still kind of a neat thing to see though :D

Steve

[MikeCTX]

Still kind of a neat thing to see though :D

Steve

Yeah Steve, it was fun to watch :D as much as I hate to admit it, I fired a couple of em just to watch them.

[BrentWin]

To me, shooting bugholes is like playing golf. At first your improvement is by leaps and bounds, until you get to the point where you are pretty descent.

From there the improvement is agonizingly slow. Lots of $ for new equipment. You read everything that you can find, take the advise of others that are better than you and most of it only serves to screw you up. But, you keep trying and hang onto the things that work.

Despite this, you will have days where it seems that you have never shot a rifle/ swung a club before.

Then comes the glorious day when the stars all aline and you have an epithany, "This is probalbly as good as I am going to get."

Because no one has ever shot a .000 group or an 18 in golf. From that point forward, you can just relax and enjoy the game.

[stevec]

Still kind of a neat thing to see though :D

Steve

Yeah Steve, it was fun to watch :D as much as I hate to admit it, I fired a couple of em just to watch them.

I actually had a buddy shoot mine so I could stand off to the side (and behind) and watch them blow. Morbid curiosity I guess. ;D
Steve

[MikeCTX]

BrentWin, good post...and yet it all comes down to practice as much as anything.

Good thing I enjoy shooting, it may take a while :D

[MikeCTX]

...You do a follow up on those loads yet... :-\

Thanks to everyone for their input and special Thanks to 1shot...

Guessing at this point more range time and some tweaking of the 69's is in order. After I can get to where I shoot a consistent group, then try to tighten them up.

As always any additional thoughts/ideas are welcome.

[pbcaster45]

Well, here's today attempt. No bugholes but this is my favorite load in my Lothar Walther Model 12 (.223 Remington). Five shots at 100 yards.

[img width=600 height=377]http://i218.photobucket.com/albums/cc265/pbcaster45/06FiveShots100yardsSavageModel12.jpg?[/img]

Bullet: Hornady 40 gr. V-Max with Moly Coat
Powder: Accurate 2230-C 26.0 grs.
Primer: CCI-450
Case: Lapua
LOAL: 2.272 (1.881 with Stoney Point, for 0.015 bullet jump)

Wasn't shooting too bad with the Tikka Lite 30-06 either! Three shots at 100 yards.

[img width=600 height=398]http://i218.photobucket.com/albums/cc265/pbcaster45/08ThreeShots100yardsTikkaLite30-06.jpg?t=1250651728[/img]

Bullet: Nosler 168 gr. Ballistic Tip
Powder: IMR-4064 49.0 grs.
Primer: Federal 210
Case: Federal
LOAL: 3.350 (2.720 base to ogive with Stoney Point gage)
Comments: Neck sized with Forster Bump Die and .332 insert. Bullets seated so that ogive about .018 short of rifling. Magazine is long enough to allow LOAL of 3.370.

[MikeCTX]

Nice shooting with both rifles pbcaster45, on the 223 what twist is the Lothar Walther barrel?

[pbcaster45]

It's a 1:12. I love Lothar Walther Barrels, tough steel and no fouling. ;D

[MikeCTX]

Thanks pbcaster45 :)

Wanted to give an update from today's visit to the range. Had some 69 gr SMK, plus some Berger 70 gr VLD's (with different seating depth). All loaded with 24.9 gr Varget, shot OK, a few 3 hole groups that were nice, but became less than that with the 4 or 5th shot.

But I did get my "Bughole" group ;D - Sort of....

There was a guy I have been talking with at the range, and he had his TAC 20 there - he had shown me photos of it - really nice looking rifle. One of Fred's benchrest stocks, Savage target action - RB/LP, Pac-Nor barrel, with a Burris Black Diamond 8-32x50. He offered to let me shoot a 5 shot group so I took him up on the offer. Dang, that is one fine shootin rifle, the TAC 20 is a real joy to shot (I understand now Sinman). Pretty much shot the center out of a benchrest target, would guess the group was around .2 inch or less - did not want to take his target since he was still going to use the other side of it.

Of course he was shooting it even better, but these were his fire-forming loads, not even match loads. Fred's stock was perfect - and the Pac-Nor, well nice barrel.

[hershey]

chasing bugholes is fun for sure, but admittedly a tough learning curve. getting inside of 1moa is was fairly easy, but from that point forward it is a new discipline, one of the things i have learned is a rifle set up for 1000yd shooting is a different animal than one for 100yd shooting, if your using a 1000yd rig to chase bugholes and 1000yd loads, then 100yds is a compromise of sorts. a dedicated 100yd load should do bugholes no doubt, but i have never gotten a bug hole group out of my rifle at 100yds but shot a 4x 5 shot group at 300yds w/ it yesterday that measured 1.4", i'll take that anyday over a 100yd bughole group, so kinda look at the big picture and see what your goal is. i may someday build a slower flat based bullet load to try to bughole my rifle, but i set my goal at 1000yds and built a load around that goal. my worst 5 shot group was at just over 4" so i had a fun day of shooting.

[1Shot]

chasing bugholes is fun for sure, but admittedly a tough learning curve... it is a new discipline..

...I get a kick out of it...lol...Now if I had the open range to shoot a 1000yds. I'ld just build me a cannon...AKA..338 EDGE.. ...

[MikeCTX]

chasing bugholes is fun for sure, but admittedly a tough learning curve. getting inside of 1moa is was fairly easy, but from that point forward it is a new discipline, one of the things i have learned is a rifle set up for 1000yd shooting is a different animal than one for 100yd shooting, if your using a 1000yd rig to chase bugholes and 1000yd loads, then 100yds is a compromise of sorts. a dedicated 100yd load should do bugholes no doubt, but i have never gotten a bug hole group out of my rifle at 100yds but shot a 4x 5 shot group at 300yds w/ it yesterday that measured 1.4", i'll take that anyday over a 100yd bughole group, so kinda look at the big picture and see what your goal is. i may someday build a slower flat based bullet load to try to bughole my rifle, but i set my goal at 1000yds and built a load around that goal. my worst 5 shot group was at just over 4" so i had a fun day of shooting.

Think you have a very good point hershey...and the 12VLP with a 7 twist may not be the right 'tool' for what I am wanting to do. One of the reasons looking at a 12 or 14 twist barrel to swap out and see how thing go with a slower twist, and lighter weight bullet than the 69-80 gr.

After shooting the small .20s it got me to thinking completely different than I had been. Of course also found the action screws had come lose as well. Had not checked them after the first few visits and they had become quite lose...note to self, check more often. :)

[lal357]

when I'm working up loads i load in .5 gr. increments and take various powders using the same case,primer and head so the only difference is the powder and charge .I'm still chasing myself best group so far is .365 center to center
[img width=600 height=450]http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b104/lal357/savagetiger.jpg[/img]

guns is a 308 savage tigershark w\Bushnell 8x32x44mm scope .
I'm getting the most consisty with rl-15,varget and benchmark (all around .500 or under ) but as said before nothing can replace range time

[stevec]

Shot this one the other day. Tried some 68gr bergers. I hope to get to try them again before sunday, I'd like to take this load to Denton.

Best five shot group I have ever shot. .103 center to center!


[img width=600 height=450]http://i243.photobucket.com/albums/ff108/stevecphoto/100_0651.jpg[/img]

Steve

[MikeCTX]

Now that is smokin Steve, really nice shootin.... .103, very nice.

Thanks for posting, was this using the new rest as well?

Shot this one the other day. Tried some 68gr bergers. I hope to get to try them again before sunday, I'd like to take this load to Denton.

Best five shot group I have ever shot. .103 center to center!


[img width=600 height=450]http://i243.photobucket.com/albums/ff108/stevecphoto/100_0651.jpg[/img]

Steve

[stevec]

Yes, I was using my new rest. Need to try this load again and make sure its not a fluke!
Rained all night and the range I use is out in the middle of a friends pasture so it may be a few days. :'(

Steve