Bolt lift kit for new bolts with cocking idicators as well as older style bolts

[Quickshot]

Have two mod.12s. One pre accu.trig and one with. Awaiting your test conclusions and anxious to try it. Especially since it requires no modifications to bolt innards. As with others, willing to contribute to the cause. Quick

[Moosetracker]

Great deed Dolomite.

I have 3 savages and 9 barrels. I`d love to try one of these as well. Please put me on your list. I`m certainly willing to pay for it when you feel it`s ready.

Moose.

[firemachine69]

Thanks for all the work to the Savage community, dolomite.


Maybe I'm not very safety-orientated or what-not, but what possible issues could arise with this (or the .38) lift-kit?

[dolomite_supafly]

Thanks for all the work to the Savage community, dolomite.


Maybe I'm not very safety-orientated or what-not, but what possible issues could arise with this (or the .38) lift-kit?

Some people report a slightly higher bolt lift effort because of the added .075" the kit. This is the reason some say to reduce the length of the BAS or the cocking sleeve by the thickness of the bolt lift kit. Other than that nothing really, this is a well established mod here with penty of positive feedback on it.

Dolomite

[Blue Avenger]

initial nut shell

1 putting in the 38 style kit with no other change increases firing pin spring pressure, reduces rotating frictional surface area.
2 putting the 38 kit in with appropriate screw length reduction reduces friction. firing pin spring stays the same.
3 putting in the washer kit reduces firing pin spring pressure.

[LeeH]

Correct me if I am wrong, but wouldn't the pressure on the firing pin spring
be determined by the round pin on the side of the bolt and it's position
when it is engaged by the sear?.
And if that's the case, the spring pressure when cocked would not change.

[PEI Rob]

LeeH, if you don't change the sear position, then you are not changing the cocking piece pin location when cocked.
The bolt assembly screw pushes on the cocking piece sleeve and this compresses the firing pin spring. If you change the effective length of the bolt assembly screw you change the firing pin spring preload.
If you adjust the cocking piece, you adjust firing pin travel.
Adjusting firing pin travel changes the amount of firing pin spring compression.



If anyone wants my two cents on this thread, here goes.
Fred gave us his idea of using the 38 case bolt lift kit. It simply works. There is basically zero friction there with this kit.
Fred has warned us many times that consistent ignition is important. Leave the firing pin spring alone, this rifle needs 25lbs of spring pressure.
To lower the lifting effort more than a 38 case kit, you would need a roller cocking piece pin.
If, for some reason, you want the bolt to lower better, break the edge and polish the notch that holds the rear baffle in place.

[dolomite_supafly]

This setup is not a 38 special case or even remotely based on it. Totally different design that so far seems to work on some rifles. It is still too early to tell but initial reports seem positive.

My version of the 38 special case bolt lift kit uses a pointed setscrew rather than a ball bearing, is one better than the other?, hard to say.

Dolomite

[LeeH]

Thanks PEI Rob...
That would be true for the .38 case setup.
BUT I was referring to Dolomites new setup that Blue Avenger referred to.
There are no changes to the spring or cocking piece.
I would leave it to Dolomite disclose any more information as to what it looks like
and how it works.
Kinda like a barrel of worms stuck on a hot plate.

[LeeH]

Thanks PEI Rob...
That would be true for the .38 case setup.
BUT I was referring to Dolomites new setup that Blue Avenger referred to.
There are no changes to the spring or cocking piece.
I would leave it to Dolomite disclose any more information as to what it looks like
and how it works.
Kinda like a barrel of worms stuck on a hot plate.

Reflecting further, if anything it would reduce the pre load and to my way of thinking
you would still have full spring compression when cocked so possibly something
gained and nothing lost.

[sliderule]

Are any of you "testers" checking rotation torque using a gauge off of the center of the bolt or only a
fish scale from the bolt handle?

[LeeH]

I am using scale....but checking the torque would be the way to go.
but i'm afraid not too many are able to do that.
On second thought, I have a "FAT" wrench, i'll see if I can cook
something up.

[dolomite_supafly]

Are any of you "testers" checking rotation torque using a gauge off of the center of the bolt or only a
fish scale from the bolt handle?

If someone has the ability to test this way let me know. I might be able to crap another kit for someone to test.

Personally I am able to "feel" a difference. A few other testers are seeing the same thing and are pleased with the results. Now this doesn't replace expensive testing equipment but it does prove that people are seeing an improvement which is all I was looking for from the begining, an improvement.

Dolomite.

BTW, I appreciate all the effort you are putting into this LeeH. Whenever I get another batch in I'll make sure you get a few more for you and your friends.

[PEI Rob]

Thanks PEI Rob...
That would be true for the .38 case setup.
BUT I was referring to Dolomites new setup that Blue Avenger referred to.
There are no changes to the spring or cocking piece.
I would leave it to Dolomite disclose any more information as to what it looks like
and how it works.
Kinda like a barrel of worms stuck on a hot plate.

Reflecting further, if anything it would reduce the pre load and to my way of thinking
you would still have full spring compression when cocked so possibly something
gained and nothing lost.

I don't have one of these so I cannot say.

Dolomite, if you want to send me a pic, I can advise on that alone. I could make my own parts and try the kit if you wish, totally up to you. However, I will not post my opinion or results in the open forum even if you wanted me to because they are still in testing. I do not feel that is fair to the designer. If they were already being sold, yes I would comment.

Rob

[LeeH]

I am using scale....but checking the torque would be the way to go.
but i'm afraid not too many are able to do that.
On second thought, I have a "FAT" wrench, i'll see if I can cook
something up.

Well I tried the FAT wrench but it only go's to 60 in/lb and it was not enough with
or without the kit.
Somewhere in all my junk I have a regular torque wrench.
I will try and find it tomorrow.

Cheers

[dolomite_supafly]

Thanks PEI Rob...
That would be true for the .38 case setup.
BUT I was referring to Dolomites new setup that Blue Avenger referred to.
There are no changes to the spring or cocking piece.
I would leave it to Dolomite disclose any more information as to what it looks like
and how it works.
Kinda like a barrel of worms stuck on a hot plate.

Reflecting further, if anything it would reduce the pre load and to my way of thinking
you would still have full spring compression when cocked so possibly something
gained and nothing lost.

I don't have one of these so I cannot say.

Dolomite, if you want to send me a pic, I can advise on that alone. I could make my own parts and try the kit if you wish, totally up to you. However, I will not post my opinion or results in the open forum even if you wanted me to because they are still in testing. I do not feel that is fair to the designer. If they were already being sold, yes I would comment.

Rob

I appreciate the offer but I only want people to test my kit and not test one they made themselves based on pictures or my specs. By allowing someone else to make them, at least for now, I loose control over how they are made and tested.

From the begining I asked all the testers to not post pictures. It isn't the fact I am going to be selling them or worried about patents. I am more worried that an unforeseen flaw might crop up. I do not want others to try to duplicate these, based on pictures, when there might be a problem and potentially injuring themselves or others. This is why I am waiting to hear everything there is to hear about my kits before I will have any more made and hand them out.

I suspect it is going to be a while before I have more made because I still need people to shoot their firearms in which these kits are installed. I just want to make absolutely sure that in addition to having a light bolt they fire and function as they should also.

Dolomite

[Blue Avenger]

Thanks PEI Rob...
That would be true for the .38 case setup.
BUT I was referring to Dolomites new setup that Blue Avenger referred to.
There are no changes to the spring or cocking piece.
I would leave it to Dolomite disclose any more information as to what it looks like
and how it works.
Kinda like a barrel of worms stuck on a hot plate.

Reflecting further, if anything it would reduce the pre load and to my way of thinking
you would still have full spring compression when cocked so possibly something
gained and nothing lost.

no you do not have full pressure when cocked. this is just a passive way of clipping a coil off.

[tacticalj]

i'd love to get my hands on one of these kits. I seem to have a pretty good catch in my bolt, to me anyways. I need some way to smooth it out. Be happy to buy one or whatever, donation perhaps would be a better way to say. Thanks for the help from everybody!

[LeeH]

Thanks PEI Rob...
That would be true for the .38 case setup.
BUT I was referring to Dolomites new setup that Blue Avenger referred to.
There are no changes to the spring or cocking piece.
I would leave it to Dolomite disclose any more information as to what it looks like
and how it works.
Kinda like a barrel of worms stuck on a hot plate.

Reflecting further, if anything it would reduce the pre load and to my way of thinking
you would still have full spring compression when cocked so possibly something
gained and nothing lost.

no you do not have full pressure when cocked. this is just a passive way of clipping a coil off.

Maybe I am having brain fade....But If the spring has NOT been shortened and is fully cocked,
how could it be lighter?.
I can see a reduced pre-load on the spring but no reduction in total spring pressure when cocked.
Please Educate me.

LeeH

[Blue Avenger]

spring pressure is also a reaction of pressure from the cocking sleeve. did you change the position of the sleeve?

[LeeH]

spring pressure is a reaction of pressure from the cocking sleeve. did you change the position of the sleeve?

Not at all...nothing was changed, adjusted or modified.
Just inserted the kit and was good to go.

[Blue Avenger]

guess you do not understand how it really works in there.

the spring is contained on the firing pin. and pushes against something to cause a reaction. now you think about it and tell me what it is pushing against.

[LeeH]

guess you do not understand how it really works in there.

the spring is contained on the firing pin. and pushes against something to cause a reaction. now you think about it and tell me what it is pushing against.

Like I said BRAIN FADE!!!....I stand corrected!!

Thanks

LeeH

[Blue Avenger]

I had to lay a bunch of parts to to see it.

[Baryngyl]

It has been over a year, is there any updates on how this is going?


Michael Grace