FTF after DIY trigger job?

3xross · 08-02-2013, 06:20 PM

After putting 20 rounds(Winchester PowerMax 150gr.) through the rifle first buying it I decided to cut a coil and a half off the spring after watching/reading some tutorials. (I only did the spring...I did not polish the sear.) That went fine with no issues.

A few days later when I finally got my hands on some more ammo(Monarch .308 I decided to give it a try. The first shot fired and the trigger pull felt GREAT! Next shot...click! Tried the next round...click! One more try...Fire! I looked at the primers of the FTFs and they were clearly not as indented as those of the fired round. All in all I only had success with 4 of 10 rounds I tried before getting worried and stopping.

Okay, so I was hoping I would hop online and look up reviews for that particular ammo (Monarch .308 steel 145gr.) and they would be horrible and have tons of reports of the same issue. But no, mostly the reviews were positive and solid.

Sooooo...I am now freaking out thinking I have done something wrong with my trigger job although I did exactly as everything said to and no one else seems to have this problem after they do theirs.

Any ideas?

thomae · 08-02-2013, 06:31 PM

First of all, Correlation does not imply causation.
Remember that you changed more than one variable (and then your problem didn't start immediately), so there could be other causes. The fact that your problems did not immediately surface gives credence to the possibilty (not certainty) that it could be an issue unrelated to the trigger.

If it were I who had the problem, I would make sure that the firing pin's forward movement was not impeded in any way by a buildup of dirt, grit, or a particle of schmutz that worked its way into the bolt.

Have you measured firing pin protrusion?

Have you tried going back to your original ammo?

It could possibly be a headspace issue or ammo sizing issue.

I am sure that there are other possibilities....let's see what the experts have to say (I'm a rank amateur).

3xross · 08-02-2013, 06:40 PM

Thanks!

I have not went back to the original ammo only because I have not been able to get it...I have not been able to get ANY .308 in two weeks now so I'm stuck with this Monarch until I can get my hands on ANY other brass to see how it does.

I have not measured firing pin protrusion....I'm not aware of the process. I'll have to look it up.

stangfish · 08-02-2013, 06:59 PM

Ditto on thomaes remarks. Check the protrusion. Clean and lube the firing pin and bolt internals. And find someone who can measure the difference in case headspace between FTF ammo and a round fired from the gun. If the difference in case headspace between the two is more than .005 I would look at using some gauges to correct that issue.

Is the rifle new or used with a different barrel?

If you cant find any help mail them to me and I will give you the results.

82boy · 08-02-2013, 07:00 PM

Moral of the story is if you are not absolutely sure what your doing, don't do it. Just because someone post something on the internet, doesn't mean that what they did was right, or that it should be imitated.

**1S1K** · 08-03-2013, 01:50 AM

Have one of your friends with a .308 shoot (or try to shoot) some of the suspect ammo. If they have no problem with it then do all the above mentioned inspections/ checks/ repairs. ( I think this would be the cheapest way to start your troubleshooting).

3xross · 08-03-2013, 01:28 PM

Originally Posted by 82boy

Moral of the story is if you are not absolutely sure what your doing, don't do it. Just because someone post something on the internet, doesn't mean that what they did was right, or that it should be imitated.

3xross · 08-03-2013, 01:49 PM

Okay, I got a second pair of eyes with me and we figured out the problem. It IS the ammo.

I only have a crappy cell phone camera with me so I'll have to get pics later. I'll try to describe it the best I can for now.

My brother and I were looking at the difference in indention on the primers between a spent casing and an FTF and realized the light pin strike on the FTF was not the most interesting thing. The primer on the FTF was visibly seated far too low, whereas the spent round's primer was flush with the casing.
We began going through all the remaining unfired rounds and the seating was all over the place. We chose 4 rounds that looked to be good and all 4 fired. Some rounds were clearly bad...many others were too close to call but in the end the mystery is over. I had two 20 round boxes of this Monarch and roughly %70 were definitely or at this point look to be no good.

Fatalis · 08-05-2013, 09:35 PM

Sounds almost like re-boxed bad hand loads...

Nandy · 08-07-2013, 09:41 PM

Hmm, every primer will be pushed back after firing. If your firing pin is not protruding as far as it should then you would also see the same thing where the primers that are not seated deep will fire and the ones that are not will...

Fatalis · 08-07-2013, 11:12 PM

Originally Posted by Fatalis

Sounds almost like re-boxed bad hand loads...

Or, really bad Quality Control from Monarch...

Topsail · 08-08-2013, 12:26 AM

My Axis 308 with the trigger job will fire my handloads and all American made factory ammo without fail.
Brown Bear Russian ammo will require a second strike in 3-4 out of a 20 round box.

Mach2 · 08-08-2013, 04:31 PM

Glad your problem was ammo not the rifle.
However..I do have a pet peeve with any DIY trigger work that is done without a trigger gauge. Would you set the valve clearance on an engine without feeler gauges?

Topsail · 08-09-2013, 02:29 AM

I did use a trigger gauge. Trigger pull went from 6.5 lb to 4.5. Called it good at that point.

stangfish · 08-09-2013, 02:31 PM

Originally Posted by Mach2

Glad your problem was ammo not the rifle.
However..I do have a pet peeve with any DIY trigger work that is done without a trigger gauge. Would you set the valve clearance on an engine without feeler gauges?

I like analogies, I even like straw man arguments. I think the valve lash and trigger pull comparison is, well... unequivocal. But I still liked it. What if you don't know how to use a feeler gauge?