Concentric front ring to rear ring

[Sundodger]

I am trying to mount new scope and rings to my savage 110.

I am running into a ring alignment issue that I am concerned is too much to be fixed with lapping. See the pictures below. This much off I really want to align bore them concentric, then take a bit off the caps to get the size right, but I am not even sure if gun smiths do this.

The rings are 1 piece Talley’s so I there really isn’t any adjustment in them. I have messed around with trying to get them concentric before tq’ing, but it hasn’t really helped. Other ideas I have is to enlarge the mounting holes a bit and align them before tq’ing, or tq them down with my lapping bar then heating them, neither of which I like.

What do you guys do when you run into this?

Thanks!

Top(plan) View:



Side View:

[thomae]

That's one of the reasons I like Burris Signature Zee rings.

Let's see....since you have the rings already, do any of these ideas help:
1. swapping the front and rear ring?
2. Trying each ring separately (or both together) 180 degrees out?
3. loosely fasten them to the rifle, then tighten them to the lapping bar, then finally do the final tightening to the receiver?

Those are my thoughts.

The thing to remember is that even with the pointed tips exactly touching, you don't know if the two rods are truly in line.
You can determine this by reversing the alignment rods and seeing if the butt ends match up exactly, or have a wider gap on the top or bottom or one side.

[Sundodger]

Thank you thomae for your response.

1. I can't swap them unfortunately because the front ring has to be an extended. I might have an extra rear ring I could try though...

2. I can't flip them around otherwise my scope will not fit.

3. I have done various iterations of that without success. BUT I haven't tried it with the tops actually bolting it down the top half of the rings, just holding it down in my hand. I will give that a try.

Any other things to try?

What do gunsmiths (with more tools, knowhow, etc.) do when they run into this?

[sab1]

Any other things to try?

How about calling Talley? I've heard that their customer service is quite good....

[Smokey262]

Talley can't help you. The rings you have are fine. The receiver is the problem.
The cheapest, fastest, best solution is to use Burris Signature Zee rings. You wil also need the +/-0.020, +/- 0.010, and +/-0.005 inserts

[Sundodger]

So, it seems I fixed it.

I started off by taking everything off and checking the mounting holes on the rifle. Took a piece of dental floss and strung it across the holes, no obvious misalignment, if there was, it is not a significant contributor to my problem.

With that it seems to be a fair assumption that it is somewhere in the rings/bases. I started messing with some of the assembly procedures I was doing before (bolting them in loosely, using my lapping bar to align them and crank them down). This time I left one of the base to action screws out (the front screw in the rear base), and tightened down the three screws using the lapping bar as a fixture. I checked down the empty screw hole and it wasn’t winking, but it was off by an RCH. So I inserted the screw and tightened that one down. Checked alignment of front ring to rear ring and it was much better. So with the rear base/ring tq’ed down and positioned in its maximum rotation to get concentric with the front base/ring (and hopefully the centerline of the bore) I did the same for the front. Loosened one of the screws and removed the other; put in the lapping bar, tightened the loosened screw, removed lapping bar, then inserted the last screw and tightened it up.

With a little messing around it is now as close as I could hope for. Bore sighted it and it was as close to on as one could hope for without any adjustments.

If Talley did a tight locater hole combined with a tight locater slot this would not be a problem. Assemble with a lapping bar as a fixture and it would be as rock solid as the tolerance stack up and the holes in the rifle action would allow. I understand on a round top action it has limitations, but bedding the bases could help if your just a touch farther out than the tight hole/tight slot allows. If you are too far out for that to work it’s fair to assume you have bigger fish to fry.