.223 or .22-250

[Alleycat]

Hey folks, I'm new around here but not new to Savage's. Love my Mod 99's.
Anyway I've always wanted a small bore centre fire and all this talk about the Axis's acuracy, and the price, have me thinking I'm going to trade in one of my safe queens in on one. Problem is I'm torn between a .223 or a .22-250.
I'd be using it targets, yotes and other small critters and I doubt ranges beyond 300 yards yet the blazing speed of .22-250is appealing to me for some reason. Any opinions?

Another quistion I have is since the twist on these is 1 in 9 does that rule out shooting light bullets (under 50 grains) acuratly?

Cheers
A

I should have put this in the "Help me decide" category...sorry

[cheapshot]

IMHO, 22-250 all day, every day. Winchester white box ammo has always been very accurate for me and 22-250 ammo is much easier to find right now. Not discounting the 223 but the 22-250 is such a screamer. If the .223 can do it (in a bolt gun), the 22-250 can do do it better and twice on Sundays.

[Ranger3]

Are you reloading? If so the 22-250 is the ticket? If not the 223 is cheaper to shoot.

[bootsmcguire]

223 is cheaper to shoot and brass is readily availabe for the taking on most public shooting ranges, just pick it up. Many AR shooters are not interested in cleaning up the brass they have strewn around (notice guys I said many not all).

However the 22-250 can do pretty much everything the 223 can do and more. So if the slightly elevated cost per round doesn't bother you then of the two choices, this is the way I would go.

Now i don't wanna be that guy and start suggesting things not presented by the OP of the thread, but I am going to this time. If you have a serious need for speed and flat shooting, then I say grab yourself a 243 Win and load her up with some 55gr. loads and beat them both. Easy to reload and I know Winchester (and I think remington) both have factory 55gr loads widely available. Plus with the 243 you can still grab a box of 100gr loads and drop a deer or two if needed.

Just some thoughts.

[Alleycat]

Thanks for the replies fellas. Some very good points indeed but I had to laugh when I read bootsmcguire's post. He was reading my mind as I, for some reason out of the blue, started considering a .243 as well . I am by no means an experienced reloader but i have the equipment here and have never put it to use yet so that was plan two of this rifle purchase...get into reloading a little more. Which ever i choose I'm sure I'll be back here looking for advice and hopefully bragging about a good shooting savage as well.


Thanks again

A

[Alleycat]

So I went to a new local gunshop with a friend and this is what we ended up with. Twin stainless .243's (thanks for suggesting .243 boots) I wasn't really looking for stainless one but that's all the shop had left in this caliber. I went to a skeet shoot right after the purchase and a bunch of our buddies checked out our rifles and I was surprised by the positive feed back. l Can't wait to try them out!!

Thanks fellas

[bootsmcguire]

You'll like the Stainless. So much easier to take care of as far as rust and such, especially if you are taking it in the field. You're gonna love it. Read up on some of the D.I.Y. modifications to get get that thing shooting even better. There are several great threads in the Axis boards here, and some articles in the Savage FAQ section.

Feel free to give us a report once you've given them a good shakedown at the range.

[Rogeritall]

For me personally the .223 was my choice. Everything I'll be shooting at will be at 300 yards and less. The .223 can do everything the .22-250 can do out to at least 250 yards. For me shooting anything below 300 yards, you are just burning more powder with the .22-250. Now if you live where you can stretch your yardage way out there, then a .22-250, or even a .243 win starts making more sense.

As far as reloading, I do reload and I can still reload .223 cheaper than I can .22-250. The bullet selection is exactly the same, and the brass and powder are cheaper. The brass is less expensive for the .223, and you use less powder per load. Just my humble opinion.

[Alleycat]

For me personally the .223 was my choice. Everything I'll be shooting at will be at 300 yards and less. The .223 can do everything the .22-250 can do out to at least 250 yards. For me shooting anything below 300 yards, you are just burning more powder with the .22-250. Now if you live where you can stretch your yardage way out there, then a .22-250, or even a .243 win starts making more sense.

As far as reloading, I do reload and I can still reload .223 cheaper than I can .22-250. The bullet selection is exactly the same, and the brass and powder are cheaper. The brass is less expensive for the .223, and you use less powder per load. Just my humble opinion.

I hear you and I agree. What made me go with the .243 this time around was the fact that I can use it on critters, target shooting and when fall rolls around I can also bring it deer hunting. Were not allowed to use anything under .243 for deer in my area. If this thing is even close to being the shooter people tell me it is then maybe I'll just have to get another on...lol Shush now, don't tell the wife...

[bootsmcguire]

Just one is never enough.

[pdog2062]

It's a disease with no cure,just keep on scratching the itch and learn to live with it

[bootsmcguire]

Just wait 'til the itches get worse and worse and come more often. LOL.

[Willoughby]

223 can shoot up to 90gr bullets

[Westcliffe01]

Out of a Savage 1:9.25 barrel, 75gr HPBT is as heavy as it will go. Forget about Bergers in that weight or higher. I will say that the ballistics of the 75gr are vastly improved over the 55gr bullets if you do shoot out past 200 yards. Otherwise, you must live in a place where the wind does not blow. I have seen my 55gr Vmax bullets deflected 24" and more with a light wind at 300 yards. Where I live, I have wind basically all winter, and much of spring and fall. The damage done to a coyote from the 75gr match bullets also goes way past what one gets from a 55gr. Bad if you want to sell fur, good if you need the critter dead right now.

223 can shoot up to 90gr bullets

[wbm]

Have a heavy barrel Savage in 22-250 and shoot the 68gr Hornady match bullet in it. With Superformance powder it is SMOKIN! and a heck of a lot of fun to shoot way out there.

[Willoughby]

90 % of the velocity
for 1/2 the powder
and the ability to bigger projectiles
and more of them-affordability
give the nod to the .223
at least for me

[junkman1967]

I just bought an Axis in 223 for my son's birthday. Im going to load up some 55g bullets over 25g of 748 and see how it works. This load works well in my AR. Im trying to develop a good load for coyotes and PD out to about 200yds. I am going to buy another one in 22-250 for myself and work some loads as well. Any suggestions would be appreciated.

[bootsmcguire]

90 % of the velocity
for 1/2 the powder
and the ability to bigger projectiles
and more of them-affordability
give the nod to the .223
at least for me

I follow the powder conservation = affordability part, but I am lost on why the 223 can use bigger projectiles and the 22-250 can't. All things being equal but the chamber, then why can the smaller case work with heavier bullets and the larger case can't?

Just curious as to your thoughts on that.

[bootsmcguire]

I just bought an Axis in 223 for my son's birthday. Im going to load up some 55g bullets over 25g of 748 and see how it works. This load works well in my AR. Im trying to develop a good load for coyotes and PD out to about 200yds. I am going to buy another one in 22-250 for myself and work some loads as well. Any suggestions would be appreciated.

Loads for a 22-250? Can't go wrong with a 55gr V-Max or Sierra Spitzer over Varget or RL15. My load for my last 22-250 was 34.0gr Varget capped off with a WLR primer and pushing a 55gr Sierra Spitzer. Shot 1/2 MOA and was consistent. RL15 did nearly as well, but my barrel just seemed to prefer Varget.

[Willoughby]

I follow the powder conservation = affordability part, but I am lost on why the 223 can use bigger projectiles and the 22-250 can't. All things being equal but the chamber, then why can the smaller case work with heavier bullets and the larger case can't?

Just curious as to your thoughts on that.
just going by reloading book data
hogden -lyman
shows up to 90 gr for 223
don't remember what the heaviest was for 22-250
but it was considerably less
I also wonder why you couldn't shoot a heavy bullet in a 22-250
maybe someone here has or knows why there not listed in load data
may be the twist

[bootsmcguire]

Ahh ok, you were using available data in a loading manual to base your statement. Gotcha.

Just checked a couple of my books, and they have data for the 80gr bullets but not the 90's. IIRC the Sierra Manual has data for the 90's in 22-250, but I could be mistaken.

[wbm]

Have a friend that shoots 80gr SMK's in a 1-8 Twist 22-250. In order to use a 90gr in a 223 you would have to have a faster twist rate than 1-9. Also the 90gr will take up a LOT more space in the 223 case than in the 22-250.

[CharlieNC]

I have both 22-250 and 223, and the 223 is cheaper and just more fun to shoot. At my 300yd range I love busting the steel while watching it swing through the scope due to minimal recoil. The 22-250 doesn't have enough recoil to bother you either, but there's just something special about the 223 that just makes it plain more fun. Still no problem getting good, cheap once-fired military brass. Don't know for sure, but it seems like it's easier to find fast twist 223's vs 22-250's in order to shoot heavier bullets; plan on trying my hand at F/TR soon so the heavies will come in handy.

[Willoughby]

Quote (Ahh ok, you were using available data in a loading manual to base your statement. Gotcha)
its available if you want to look it up
hogden list 70 gr as the heaviest for 22-250
besides its common knowledge to those who regularly look a reloading data
its also common knowledge to those who regularly look a reloading data
that the powder charge decreases as projectile weight increases
that's the most likely cause for 223 being able to shoot heavier projectiles
I guess you could shoot a 22-250 with 50% -75% fill with heavies

[wbm]

hogden list 70 gr as the heaviest for 22-250

Sierra V Manual: 80gr Sierra Match King 36.6 IMR-4831 @ 3050fps.

its also common knowledge to those who regularly look a reloading data
that the powder charge decreases as projectile weight increases

Shazaaam! Who knew?