Best powder for both .223 and .308?

[DennisH87]

In an effort to keep things simple and cheap I'm going to try to find a powder that will work in my AR, .223 Savage and my newest .308 F-class build. I've been using Hodgons Benchmark in both my .223's with great success. I developed a load that will shoot excellent in both rifles out to 600 yards. Now with the addition of the .308 I will need a new powder because benchmark, to my knowledge, isn't suitable for 155gr - 175gr bullets in the .308. What ever powder I buy I'm going to buy it in an 8 pound canister so that the lot is the same and it's such a pain in the butt to find a powder source around here.

So the question is what is the best powder for both the .223's and .308, will handle heavier bullets in .308, and will get me the velocity needed to push the large pills out to 1000 yards?

From what research I've done, BL-C(2) and Varget will work but I'm not sure about BL-C(2)'s ability to get the velocity I need in the .308. I like the idea of using BL-C(2) because it's a ball powder and it meters extremely well. My RCBS powder measure doesn't like Varget at all. It catches and makes reloading difficult plus it is temp sensitive from my experiences with it.

Let me know what you guys think

Thanks in advance,

Dennis

[jon8777]

Varget is temperate sensitive? Everything I have read is Varget is an excellent choice for a non temperature sensitive powder. I've only just started using Varget, so I can not confirm or reject my findings.

[earl39]

BLC-2 will get the speed you want.

[M.O.A.]

Varget isn't temperature sensitive in my 223 I zeroed at 90° and have shoot at 20° and below with no change but any way its a good powder IMO.

[DennisH87]

I had problems with varget being temp sensitive in my .22-250. Plus it meters terribly. It may be different it the above cartridges or I could have just got a bad batch. Who knows. The main reason I don't like it is because the granulates stick in my powder measure so bad that I've spilled an entire tray of charged cases when it jerked lol. I really want to try BL-C(2) but I'm hesitant. I need to do more load research on it before I order 8 pounds. I will be ordering it from Midwayusa.com and they stick you with a $27.50 Haz Mat fee plus an aditional $9.99 and then probably another $11.00 for shipping no matter if you get 1 pound or 8 lbs. Ever since Sinclair Int. relocated to I think Missouri I don't have a reliable source for powder and primers anymore. They used to be a stone's throw away from where I worked. Gander Mountain is about worthless for powder selection and availability and if they do have it they want an arm, leg and my first born child.

[M.O.A.]

I would just get 1# first if it were me you don't want to be stuck with it if it don't shoot ;-)

[stomp442]

I run IMR 4064 in both my 223 and 308 with excllent results. Very similar burn rate to Varget. I have never had good reslults as far as grouping goes with Varget but always have with 4064. Just my .02

[DennisH87]

Has anyone had success with benchmark using 155 - 175 gr bullets in .308? I've found a couple loads online for the 155gr bullet weight but nothing larger. They listed it as being a 100-400 yard load.

[darkker]

Varget is quite sensitive in cartridges that it was NOT designed to be insensitive in, particularly the 223. Google the name: Dr. Denton Bramwell Has done lots of testing on primers, powder, and barrel temp testing. He has done much of the Varget debunking.

For a dual duty powder, you REALLY should give consideration to Win 748.
What the military calls WC750, used in the M118LR.

[rjtfroggy]

I have gone through a lot of what you are trying to do.What I now use is IMR 4895 for everything I shoot from 22-250 to 7mm rem mag.. With a lot of reseach and inquiries I was able to find a load for all of them and have found the velocities from the Sierra manual are pretty close.

[You-Two]

For good metering look at: Ramshot TAC, H4895, IMR 8208XBR, RL15, AR-COMP, and CFE223. RL15 is very popular in both the .223 and .308, along with Varget. AR-COMP is supposed to be a more temp stable version of RL15.

[davemuzz]

Varget

[glassbeaver]

Varget or TAC. Safe bets too as there are a million buyers for them if you decide you don't like them. It's true that varget is possibly the worst metering powder EVER, but most people trickle anyways if your loading for precision.

[darkker]

If loading for precision, you know that volume dispensing and weight are NOT the same thing. Trickling up to a "weight" defeats the purpose of volume.
Volume, pertaining to extruded powders, takes advantage of the moving BD & BR; that weight can't account for.

Extruded powders, unlike ball powders, don't use coatings to control the BR. That is done with geometry. So while the sound may bother you, if you get some cutting of grains, the effect is all but nil.

[Grit #1]

Winchester 748
Best regards,
Grit

[Deerhunter 28]

Varget

X2
I use it in .223-.308


PSE EVO 57 Lbs.
Blacked out

[helotaxi]

It's true that varget is possibly the worst metering powder EVER

Except for 3031, 4895, 4831 or any other large grain extruded powder. I've had much better luck metering Varget than 4831SC for sure. The 4831SC bridges in the powder measure something fierce while Varget just drops right on down. If the measure handle hangs up when dropping the charge, that one gets dumped back in the hopper. +/- 0.1gn is pretty easy other than that.

The problem with going purely with volume on the large kernel extruded powders is that they don't settle into the measuring chamber consistently and thus the volume might be the same, but the density of that volume can vary greatly. At that point you might as well just throw some powder in a case randomly.

[Curtis12]

I would have to say Varget too.
I get good fill ratios and the velocity I want. I think it meters fairly well, certainly not like ball powder but much better than the powders I use in my 6.5x284 (H1000 and H4831sc).
I shoot 55 or 60gr .223's and 168gr .308's at mid range (400 meters) and Varget works very well for either cartridge.

Curtis

[Jamie]

I would've said Varget 4 years ago BUT I get great groups with Ramshot Powder and they meter like salt. I now use Ramshot in a multitude of calibers, TAC in .223 and .308 and Hunter in just about everything else.

[davemuzz]

I would've said Varget 4 years ago BUT I get great groups with Ramshot Powder and they meter like salt. I now use Ramshot in a multitude of calibers, TAC in .223 and .308 and Hunter in just about everything else.

But which Ramshot powder for which caliber? The OP was asking for ONE powder to handle both the .308 and the .223. I've tried many different powders for the .308 and have always found that the most consistent powder was Varget for shooting 150 or 165gr. bullets. And for shooting anything above 65gr. to 75gr. for the .223 in a 1-9 twist or faster barrel, again, Varget is the powder.

Metering is an issue, however I use the RCBS electronic scale to get precise powder drops for each load. So, I don't have the issues associated with a drop powder dispenser.

FWIW

Dave

PS...But I would like to know what powders you are using for what cartridges. I know the Ramshot powders are much less expensive, and when I load "bulk" for shooting mild loads for my 100 year old military Swede, "cheap" is the operative word!!!

[M.O.A.]

He said tax for 223 and 308 ;-)

[davemuzz]

He said tax for 223 and 308 ;-)

MOA.....You do like to instigate!! You were the kid in 7th grade and up who always made the noise, tossed the penny, or did something to tick off the teacher...and someone else got the blame.

[M.O.A.]

What he say tac for both you ask what powder he was talking about for both and I told you .there wasn't any negativity there and none intended. All is well that ends well.;-)

[JCalhoun]

H4895 works well in just about everything. It will be a bit sluggish when you try to run the heavy .308 bullets at 1k but if you run the 155 to 168 VLD's and such you'll be fine. TAC is a good performer also and meters very well. It will less impressive at 1k though.