What Do You Do With Different Brass Brands?

[beartooth91]

For my 7mm-08, I started with 50 Winchester cases. Some have been fired once, the others twice. This is still what I use. About two years ago, I was given some brass by a couple of different co-workers. There are 32 rounds of fired R-P 7mm-08 brass and 50+ rounds of .308 brass, some with a "F C" head stamp (Federal?); the others have a "C B C" headstamp (from Brazil, I think).
I'm an accuracy nut and mostly punch paper. But, how or when would I use the other brass? I understand the .308 stuff has to be necked down. What I'm really asking here is how do you go/mix/whatever from one brand to another? With regards to hand loads, accuracy, and different brass; seems like one has to start back at square one?

[jhelmuth]

Just my opinion....

I would FL size and totally "prep" ALL the mixed brass. I would then cap them with spent empty primers and do a capcity test to ensure that the cases are sorted by capacity and group them by whatever deviation I was comfortable with (and that will depend on your goal - the more accuracy desired - the closer the groupings will be).

I would not use case weights in mixed brands, as this does not give a true indication of case capacity deltas.

Not an easy task... but if you are going for accuracy, it's the only way I can think of...


PS - Keep them B's together once you sort them!


Jim

[jhelmuth]

...also

[1] .308 is relatively forgiving - so you don't have to be as critical as say with 6.5x47L

[2] You could always use them for practice ammo, keeping them together by mfg. groups when you are shooting (so you know what was you and not the load).

[darkker]

Well here goes my process, watch folks get bent outta shape over this one :P
There is no discernable difference. My guns all run just about everyheadstamp under the sun.
IF, and this is a big IF, you REALLY want to walk the edge of pressure, then you better stick to a make; honestly you should stick to capacity. MOST folks will tell you to weight them. Nice try, but IME the weight "should be" and indicator, but it isn't. Weight is dependant on alot of things, that MAY OR MAY NOT have any relevance on actual capacity. If you want to know what something holds, weight it empty, fill it, weight it, do the math, VIOLA!!

My 10FP in 308 that I use for 1,000 yard shooting has at least 4 different headstamps in that load. My load is seated about 1/64" off the lands(my gun) shooting 175 SMK's, with Win 748. I'm about a half a grain off Sierra Max book. NOT max in my gun, but chrono's 2550 with very low ES/SD on 5-shot groups. That load with mixed headstamps holds MOA at 1,000.
Especially if you have fired them in YOUR gun, and you neck size; the capacity should be pretty much the same anyhow.
Do what you want, but I have mixed headstamps for the past 20 years without issue. 204-223-243-25-06-30-06-270-7mm-6.5*300WSM-338WM

[jhelmuth]

Well here goes my process, ...

That load with mixed headstamps holds MOA at 1,000.

Especially if you have fired them in YOUR gun, and you neck size; the capacity should be pretty much the same anyhow.

Do what you want, but I have mixed headstamps for the past 20 years without issue. 204-223-243-25-06-30-06-270-7mm-6.5*300WSM-338WM

Well... maybe I don't understand "Accuracy", but I hold my rifles to a much higher standard than 1 MOA. Even so, I will have to disagree with your statement on capacity. They will very likely NOT be the same from one brand to the next (and if they are - it would be a coincidence. You will find nore variation than you will matches).

You can "use" mixed headstamps without much issue (I'll agree with you regarding pressures) - but if sub-MOA is the goal (and for me that's less than 0.5 MOA with a target of 0.25 MOA), then you'll need to have as consistent brass as possible.

[fgw_in_fla]

I find I have to adjust the powder charge to accomadate different brands of brass. As a matter of fact, this weekends shooting excursion was just that.
Some interesting tid bits (to me, anyway...)
My .270 shoots 150gr Noslers - If I use Rem brass - 53.7gr H4831........ If I use Fed brass - 54.0gr of H4831.

The same goes for one of my '06's. 150gr Nosler using Rem brass - 53.4gr IMR4350 = .4 - .5" on a good day (like yesterday)
If I use Fed brass - 53.2gr IMR4350 to get the same result.

I do not use Winchester brass. It does not co-operate at all. I get the longest use out of Rem brass.

I can only speculate that the case volume, elasticity, neck thickness, etc... will vary the ballistics of different cases. Until I tried different types with various charges, this drove me nuts. This weekend I brought every caliber & weight I shoot with Rem & Fed brass and did a fine tune on the OCW.

Hence, the saying - "Thou shalt NOT mix different brands of brass together & expect consistancy"...

Have a wonderful day.

Frank in Fla (with a new laptop...

[darkker]

Well... maybe I don't understand "Accuracy", but I hold my rifles to a much higher standard than 1 MOA. Even so, I will have to disagree with your statement on capacity. They will very likely NOT be the same from one brand to the next (and if they are - it would be a coincidence. You will find nore variation than you will matches).

You can "use" mixed headstamps without much issue (I'll agree with you regarding pressures) - but if sub-MOA is the goal (and for me that's less than 0.5 MOA with a target of 0.25 MOA), then you'll need to have as consistent brass as possible.

Holding your rifle to a standard of SUB-MOA at 1,000 yards is fine. But if you look at the OP's # of posts, and the wording he used in his question; he isn't looking to win any F-class matches. Likely he is talking about basic reloading of a bone stock rifle. For THAT premise, the minor variations(Unless running full max pressures, or a poor powder choice) won't matter.
Which is why the "pressures" comment you agreed with, is possible. Are they technically different? Of course they are! Is it significantly different? Likely not. Again, based on the "general reloading premise". If you want to win a F-class type competition, then you better be deadnuts-on with ALL variables...

As you noted which most people don't understand, is that capacities generally don't have much correlation to weight. Which really is the crux of the whole issue: Manufacturing. There is a general spec that all cases are built to, whether or not they hit exactly that mark is dependant upon the process, etc.

The other issue is "WHO" makes them, and for what purpose. Lots of folks still think that "Winchester" makes the best brass. Truth is, Winny sold that division and hasn't made any cases since 2007. Most people don't realize who actually makes what, and WHO their main market is. I.E. General Dynamics, is the ONLY smokeless manufacturer left in the U.S. They are a Government Defense Contractor... Their main market is NOT what makes the reloaders world: Hodgdon, or the Power Pro series.

Here is a slightly older measure-up of 223 cases for capacity comparison:
http://www.ar15.com/archive/topic.ht...&f=42&t=318330
The average is 30 grains. The difference isn't with the cases that most THINK should be different.

[82boy]

Best thing to do is throw it into a bucket, and take it to one of them scrap metal places.
Scrap has been around 1.50 to 2 buckas a pound. You would be suprised what a 5 gal bucket of brass weighs in at.

[BobT]

Best thing to do is throw it into a bucket, and take it to one of them scrap metal places.
Scrap has been around 1.50 to 2 buckas a pound. You would be suprised what a 5 gal bucket of brass weighs in at.

+1

I don't use fired brass from any source except me, then I know for sure how many times it has been fired and if it has been abused. Just to add to what Frank said, my .25/06 handloads with Remington brass (reformed .30/06) and Norma brass are a full grain apart in their powder charge.

Bob

[beartooth91]

All three of my Savages are stock rifles, for now. But, I pretty much only punch paper and I'm looking to squeeze every bit of accuracy out of the rifles. I neck size with collet dies, trim everything to the same length, measure every loaded case, etc. Once I get a ball caliper, I'll make the necks uniform. My accuracy goal is sub-0.5 MOA.
I guess the follow-on question is what do you do as the brass ages and you start discarding some? Do you stick with a dwindling brass supply, until some point, then go with all new?

[darkker]

Sub MOA at what distance??
With 1 exception EVERY gun I have owned will do sub @ 100, without being ubber precise in reloading.
SUB MOA at 1,000? A stock gun certainly has the potential to do that, but very well may not be able to; regardless of loading and case prep.

Of the 5 guns I regularly shoot and reload for, I don't run at max loads. Typically the brass will need to be annealed, and the primer pockets begin to get enlarged. At that point I will put them in the scrap bin to take to town sometime.

[jhelmuth]

darkker...

I respectfully disagree (on your comment that sub-MOA at 1000 for a "stock" rifle [sic] is "very well may not be able to") as long as we do not include "junk" stock in the mix. Handloads are all about finding a rifles "sweet spot" in a load. MOA is just that... Minute-Of-Angle, so whether at 100 or 1000, you should be fairly consistent. We all know a 100 yard load may not make a 1000 yard load - but that is a result of physics (extrenal balistics) and would apply to a custom rifle as well.

Apparnetly I understood beartooth91 pretty well afterall....

Look.... this is (I hope) more of a hypothetical question with respect to actually "trying" to achieve accuracy with a mixed bag of headstamps. Me personally, I wouldn't bother. But there IS a possibility to achieve the desired results IF (and not a trivial IF) you can get case volumes to be nearly identical. Any decent handloader knows that consistency is gonna dictate accuracy. After that, all you have to do is find the right node for the rifle at the distance you want to shoot.

PS - Obviously you can't achieve sub-MOA if that istace is beyond the shooters ability to cancel out the variables of conditions. Again... that applies to stock or custom rifles.

[jhelmuth]

...also

[1] .308 is relatively forgiving - so you don't have to be as critical as say with 6.5x47L

[2] You could always use them for practice ammo, keeping them together by mfg. groups when you are shooting (so you know what was you and not the load).

Best thing to do is throw it into a bucket, and take it to one of them scrap metal places.
Scrap has been around 1.50 to 2 buckas a pound. You would be suprised what a 5 gal bucket of brass weighs in at.

That's a great idea... I wouldn't personally go through such an exercise, and taking that "scrap" cash and applying it toward some nice new brass of my liking makes a lot of sense! (and cents...)

[darkker]

Well we disagree, I'm happy to agree to disagree :)

[lal357]

for my f class guns i want consitency (sp) so i only use one case brand as my other guns (ar-15,short range deer guns ect) i use what i have in the box .i keep my brass seperated in zip lock bags and keep them in ammo cans.
no never thought about keeping my used brass and selling them for scrap i'm changing my brass this month for new (primer pockets loosing up)

[LHitchcox]

My friends often give me once fired brass of different headstamps. I sort it by brand and use the different brands for different loads. No mixing of headstamps within a load.