How tight do you pack your bags

Grit #1 · 10-09-2011, 02:36 PM

Was just wondering what opinions everyone has on how tight to pack the bags and what sand are you using. I started out shooting BR 50/50 25+ years ago and I am using the same bags today with a Hart front rest with one of their original windage tops. I have my bags packed so tight you couldn't get another gain of sand (zirconium) in if you wanted to. My rear bag is a Protektor Model A(? bag is so old I can't read the mod #) short bunny ear. I have been shooting F-class for about 3 years now and I have seen some pretty loose bags. Some aren't even packed with sand. I saw one guy who packed his with walnut hull.
Best regards,
Grit

82boy · 10-10-2011, 10:37 AM

There is a million things you can pack you bags with, lead shot, corn cob, rice, and many other things, but sand is what is most common. I guess that is why they are nicknamed "sand bags." Even with sand there is different types of sand, from play ground variety, to the heavy sands, and even some things that are called sand, and they look like sand but they are not sand, an example is coal slag. Some people even mix sands to get a top notch mix. Dave Dorman (RIP) use to sell super fabric bags made off of protektor bags, and I was told he used a mixture of coal slag, and zircon.

When I buy my bags I buy them pre-filled, heck it cost a bit more in shipping, but I cant buy heavy sand, and fill them myself cheaper. I bought a bag of coal slag last year (Available at any true value.) http://www.idealtruevalue.com/servlet/the-80507/Detail cost about $10 bucks for 50 lbs, and this stuff is heavy. I think it is just as heavy as zircon sand. I have also been told that most Zircon sand is not truly zircon.

Getting back your your question. I find that on a front bag if you fill them too full the rifle will bounce in the rest, you need to leave some wiggle room. A bit of information I was handed down from a few shooters is you want to have sand between the gun and the rest because it will gobble up mistakes. On the rear bag, I fill them as full as I can get them. Last your bunny ear bag is a number 14.

acemisser · 02-09-2013, 10:40 PM

Rice here Uncle Bens to be exact..lol dry saw dust works well....

82boy · 02-10-2013, 12:08 AM

Here is an article that was written by a good friend of mine Tom "Speedy" Gonzales. For you all that may not know Speedy, he is an acopmlished benchrest shooter, who is a member of the NBRSA hall of fame, he is a top gunsmith, and is a teacher at the colorado gunsmithing school.

SAND BAGS & HOW TO FILL THEM

By Speedy

Back in the old days, about the time Fred Flintstone was still alive, I worked for Pat McMillan for free, from time to time to learn all his secrets.
One day little Speedy was filling some new sand bags out behind Pat's shop, stuffing them with more sand than Taco Bell put beans in their Burritos. When Pat stepped out the back door and inquired as to what in the hell was I doing packing them there bags the way I was.
I looked up at him with eyes like a kid with his hands in a cookie jar. My reply must have sounded like Homer Simpson "Doooh". Finally I said "I don't know, Boss. I just thought you were supposed to fill these babies up and go shoot.
I got that "You dumb ******* look" from Pat and I knew it was lecture time.
Speedy! Speedy! Speedy! (Now, I knew I had best go get a coke and a sandwich. We were gonna be here a while). This was what he told me.
You can not have two bags filled so hard that you gun bounces on them in the process of firing round at your target, especially if you have a rig with a very flexible stock. The bags must be set up in a manner for them to absorb the initial shock of the firing pin moving forward and igniting the primer. Then maintain their shape and absorb the second shock wave as well the rearward thrust and torque of the rifle.
What happens to the rifle when this is not done? Well let me tell you. The rifles have a very bad tendency to jump and roll in the bags. This causes many of those wild, lost shots that one can't explain. You know! The one that should have been in there and is now sitting all by itself like the red headed kid nobody likes. (I’m not talking about you Bill Dorsey, I still love ya man!)
Charles Huckaba, Ken Terrell, Larry Baggett and some of us Texas shooters talk about this phenomena quite often. We have all agreed that -

1 : You can not have two hard bags in your set up.
2: Heavy sand magnifies these phenomena.
3: If you are a bag squeezer, pack ears hard and leave bag pliable enough to squeeze for the movement required. You may pack front bag as hard as rules permit.
4: Free recoil shooters pack both bags firm, but not so hard as to allow stock jump. Especially if you have a stock with a very flexible forearm.
5: We use play ground sand also know as silica sand. I sift mine to get any large impurities out then mix it with 25% to 50% with Harts parakeet gravel to the desired hardness that I am looking for. The bird gravel keeps the sand from packing itself into that solid as a brick state. Speaking of bricks another thing that happens when shooters employ that heavy zircon sand is the ears form a low spot under them from recoil and then tend to rock back and forth with the rifle causing many low shoot to crop up. Edgewood make an Edgewood/Speedy rear bag these are specially reinforced under the ears to eliminate this scenario.
One last note if you use the new Cordura bags keep them sprayed with a good silicon spray or "Rain-Ex". This keeps them from getting sticky.

Speedy

acemisser · 02-10-2013, 04:17 PM

wonderful story...But no advertisement's in it...Makes a lot of sense...I found that kitty litter also works for the front bag..But I do not use a front bag any more..Thanks for the story..