I always thought that a 110 was a long action and the 10 was a short action. But the new 110s in 223 look like short actions (308). Also, I see on GB listings for guns that are "10/110". Which is it? Thanks!
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I always thought that a 110 was a long action and the 10 was a short action. But the new 110s in 223 look like short actions (308). Also, I see on GB listings for guns that are "10/110". Which is it? Thanks!
I believe that nothing has changed but the labeling. Savage just started calling everything a 110.
Actually, the mid-80s "short actions" were also 110s, I have one from the mid-80s in 7-08 and it's clearly stamped "110".
They are going to back to what they use to us. A long action 110 and use a block or baffle for the shorter cases I have a couple of the 110’s that have the baffling in it and they are in 223.
Respectfully
Mike
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Actually, they always made two actions, short and long.
The .223s in both the new 110 series and recent 10 series were on short actions and the short action magazines had a plug in the rear and the bolts had a flange on the side to keep the bolt far enough forward to pick up the rim of .223s in front of the baffle.
My son and I have several .223s model 10s and they are all short actions with the plug in the mag and a flange on the short action bolt. The mags have the same external dimensions (3.13 inches) as a .308 or 6.5mm Creedmoor mag but the .223 mag has a 1/2 inch plug in the rear of the mag to fit the shorter .223 brass.
The bolts have the same overall size but the .223 bolts have a flange to force the bolt forward to pick up the shorter .223 brass. My new 12 FV .223 and new 6.5mm Creedmoor both have the same size mags but the .223 also has the plug and flange on the bolt that were on the old model 10s.
If you tried to use a long action mag to handle a .223, the plug would be close to an inch long instead of being about 1/2 inch.
Mid-80's would have still been dedicated long and short. It wasn't until 1988 that the short-actions were dropped and everything was built on a long-action. This was when Savage went into bankruptcy protection. Short-actions were brought back in 1998. During those years any rifle chambered for a short-action cartridge was built on a long-action receiver BUT the magazine port in the bottom was machined to accept a short-action length magazine box.Quote:
Originally Posted by PhilC
All 223's have a block in the magazine because all short-actions are setup for the .308 family of cartridges. The action is no different than a standard short-action, it's only the magazine that's affected and (on some years) the front baffle had a longer tail on one side to limit bolt travel for the shorter cartridge. The exception would be those made from 1988-1997 mentioned above when short-actions were out of production.Quote:
Originally Posted by 35Whelenshooter
Originally (from 1958-mid 1970's) everything was called a Model 110 whether it was a long or short action. It's no different than how all Remington's are simply referred to as 700's with no short or long-action distinction. Same with the Winchester Model 70's and most every other bolt-action centerfire rifle on the market.
In the mid 1970's Savage started diversifying their naming a little with the addition of a couple 111 and 112 models (i.e. the Model 111 Chieftain and the Model 112R and 112V).
Everything remained this way up through 1988 and Savage's filing for bankruptcy protection.
Short-actions had a 4.522" screw spacing and are 0.540" shorter in overall length than a long action.
Long-actions had a 5.062" screw spacing from day one and is the same screw spacing still used today (it has never changed).
As previously noted, all 110's made from 1988-1997 were built on long-action receivers (5.062" screws spacing). Those built into rifles for short action cartridges were machined with a short-action magazine opening, and those being built for long-action cartridges were machined with a long-action magazine opening.
In 1998 Savage reintroduced a true short-action receiver and instituted the two-digit model number system for them (i.e. Model 10, 11, 12, 14, 16). This new short action was shorter than the original, being 0.850" shorter in overall length than a long-action. The shorter overall length also required a shorter screw spacing of 4.275". This configuration remained in production with some specific cartridges as late as late 2007/early 2008.
In 2005 Savage updated their magazine system from the old staggered feed boxes to the new center feed boxes. With this change in magazine type came yet another change to the short actions. Overall length stayed the same (0.850" shorter than a long-action), but the screw spacing changed to 4.40". This is also when the bottom bolt release, DBM and HFP first came to be on select models.
Due to Savage's decision to "phase in" this change, the period between 2005 and 2007 was a bit chaotic as far as knowing what you would actually get when ordering a new rifle. Depending on the cartridge and inventory at the factory you might get a new rifle with the old staggered-feed configuration or a rifle with the new centerfeed configuration. Even many of the Stevens 200's which were meant to use up existing inventory of the old hardware were sold with the newer centerfeed configuration. The "standard" cartridge magazines (.308, .243, 7mm-08 for S/A; .270, 30-06 for L/A) were the first to be put into production in late 2005, and the .223 Rem/.204 Ruger magazines were the last to be put into production in early 2008.
In 2017 Savage decided to start simplifying their naming system and eliminate the alphabet soup of the old naming system to make things easier to understand. Unfortunately, after nearly 20 years of the old system this made it very confusing given they stuck with the Model 110 designation. Their intentions were good, and I like the simplification of the naming, but they probably would have been better off to keep the two-digit/three-digit system and instead just replaced the alphabet soup with actual names (i.e. 10/110 Storm, 10/110 High Country). I think that would have been far less confusing for the masses.
That pretty much sums it up. Class dismissed! :thumb:
You're right Jim. Had to double check the one I have, it was manufactured in '89 and I bought it May of that year. I should have checked before posting but you cleared it up well. :thumb:Quote:
Originally Posted by J.Baker