1907 basket case thread

Well, I don't know what to call this in the car world it would be more of a "build" thread. So, I picked this 1907 up for about $110 off gobroker as a basket case. I knew I'd have some work going into it, but thankfully things as of now seem to be going pretty well. I've definitely got a ways to go before getting it 100% functional but am quickly making progress.

http://i1127.photobucket.com/albums/...ps6otserkn.jpg

The pistol its self, metal grips are early. This is a 1909, last year for them. Note the fitment at the top.

http://i1127.photobucket.com/albums/...psxd1mfhps.jpg

http://i1127.photobucket.com/albums/...psdwql8n7n.jpg

This is on both sides, I'm pretty sure some idiot lummoxed it in a vise. I'm going to got a piece of 1"X1/4" bar and to popped it out using my press. Magazine fits into the well now.

http://i1127.photobucket.com/albums/...ps7zsjdjvk.jpg

Here's the actual actuator of the striker and the sear assembly. This was straight when I got the gun. If you don't leave it level when pulling the slide off the front during take down/pull the trigger, you tend to bend these. It's a really common problem. After forcing the slide off, bending this some and putting it back it works much better. Still a bit tight, may need a hair more work but it fires fine and seems to be functional.

http://i1127.photobucket.com/albums/...psfuee969s.jpg

Going to have to fab a front sight blade. It will probably be silver soldered in.

http://i1127.photobucket.com/albums/...psbk7nffwa.jpg

This is the last piece I need to figure out. The ejector is kind of hosed, so my plan right now is to drill it out, put another pin on there and get it silver soldered into place. It will also fix the missing safety I have. Hopefully not too big of deal once again. Anyone ever fix one broken like this before?

I'm tempted to hit the range and try it as a single shot. Any reason not to?

You got yourself quite a project. I've seen several missing the front sight. There was a thread on the S&W Forum on a particular 1907 that was missing the front sight and the OP found one although he didn't say where he got it from. I'm no gunsmith so I can't answer your question about it being safe to shoot. I have a 1907 that I showed in a thread in this forum that I've shot and I was thoroughly impressed with it. Good luck with the restoration and keep the thread updated with your progress.

Thought I had a spare ejector but after looking I realised it has been snapped off just like yours.

Down to one spare front sight as I gave one to a buddy last year so I'd better keep this one just in case.

Are those someones initials stamped on the side of the receiver?

I think they are, it makes me wonder if this gun went with someone into a trench a few years after it was made or something similar. The barrel is pretty well smooth, which leads me to believe it has had considerable firing time. Any way I could get a picture from a few angles? It may help with the end fabrication. Also, it's steel not aluminum correct?

Pictures of?

The ejector or the barrel? Or sight?

The ejector. I hate to be an imposition, but I was trying to heat it up to see if the rod was silver soldered in vs a 1pc construction and dropped it which means I don't have a reference to build another from. I think I'm going to end up having to hand fabricate and fit something at this point.

I just ordered an ejector up, end cost was about $50 shipped. Guy had it in a frame, I was lucky to get it I suspect. I had to dig pretty deep into google to find it. I'm definitely doing dimensioned drawings in case I ever have to get one made up.

Moving on to other projects, I decided to do some work on the front sight; the new one's going to be silver soldered on just due to ease of service and since I'm not concerned about damaging bluing on a gun that doesn't have any.

http://i1127.photobucket.com/albums/...pswz60ycoy.jpg

Here's my original sight picture. I think this was the original style sights and the later ones are better; I may dig a slide up one day and find out; I'd actually like to mill one of these for some 3 dots, and I think that it's doable on a later gun but the rear of the slide on these is too thin.

http://i1127.photobucket.com/albums/...psyejlic1y.jpg

Here's the washer I started out with. The sharpie lines are where I'm cutting to get roughly the right dimensions. I'll leave it a bit tall, dial it in and file away as needed after a test drive or two.

http://i1127.photobucket.com/albums/...psz6hlmm5x.jpg

Here's the new front sight. It's not pretty, but I'm hoping it's functional. Gotta be better than nothing. The original was a half round setup, but I thought I'd do something a bit of my own style that's a bit more modern.

http://i1127.photobucket.com/albums/...psy7pmgrqi.jpg

The blade in the notch. I'm really debating on widening the rear notch a bit. Any opinions?

Widening the notch would be a good idea. The original sights leave a lot to be desired. It's basically a point and shoot pistol with the OEM sights. You have gone this far, keep at it. So far it looks good. I wish I possessed the same skill set as you.

Ok, so a lot to report. My new ejector showed up, I was trying to do some work on the original to fix the broken post and it went missing never to be found again. Just my luck. I had to perform the slow process of fitting the injector by coloring it with a sharpie, re-assembly of the gun, gently releasing the slide, breaking it back down, seeing where the metal was contacting and repeating several times. Quite a bit of work, but worth it in the end.

http://i1127.photobucket.com/albums/...psoxhnvtkw.jpg


Since I have an early sighted gun I replaced my cocking lever. The reason why is there's a small "nib" that's broken off on the side of mine, and that's what keeps the sear from being engaged when the safety is and in turn keeps the gun from firing after you pull the trigger and disengage the safety. I now have a functional safety.

I ended up breaking my sear trying to tweak the shape. I think a huge portion of it had worn down, and in turn I had to do the work.

Besides that, I have a range report! I took the gun out tonight, and the extractor spring is likely weak. It wouldn't engage except a couple of the rounds, when it ejected reliably. If I can't get an ejector spring I'm going to order the Wolff Universal kit that includes 2ea of 10 different springs and see which one fits. Ammo was Fiocci 60gr JHP which seemed to actuate the gun just fine, but didn't extract. Point and shoot accuracy would have been defense acceptable at 15 foot which wasn't bad considering it was with no front sight blade and a barrel that's pretty well smooth.

Had to replace a sear once as well, not a fun time.

Actually not terrible, what killed me is my MIG is acting junky I was going to try and fix the old one. The metal in this gun seems to be heat treated through and through which makes it hard and brittle. Not a bad thing in a lot of ways (resists peening) but the grain size on the broken sear and the extractor seemed to be crystalized through and through. Taking the actual breech plug apart was hard, and even that was probably 20-30 minutes of real work.

Wolff Universal Extractor spring kit on order. While waiting for it I got my front sight mounted. The sharpie is to show where I think it will be filed down to at some point, likely during a future range trip. I used a Silver Solder kit I bought for about $8 from the local Airgas.

http://i1127.photobucket.com/albums/...pskts1y4hl.jpg

Looks good!

She needs a bit more work in the looks department. I'm thinking about trying to hot blue this one using the sodium hydroxide/potassium nitrate method. I want to do a bit more work on the frame to try and get better grip fitment before I bought another early (as in SN 1000 range) one that's rough looking but less rough than this one and I'm probably going to use it as a reference to do a bit of tweaking on the mag well, filing the sight down to the proper height and make the grips fit a bit better.

Anyone ever retrofit a different safety into one of these? I got another hammer with the intent of fixing this one, and it doesn't seem like this safety is of a good design which is consistent with what I've read. The hammer drops after the trigger is pulled and the safety is disengaged.

I too have a similar SAVAGE '07 which I also got on Gunbroker for a very low price, as it was being offered as 'Parts Only' and was claimed to be frozen and inoperable and looked aweful. I had a hunch it was actually just relaly gru=imy with old hardened grime, so I took a chance.

Once I had it home it took a lot of soaking in Solvent and patience to get it field stripped and it was covered inside and out in light rust, and some kind of crud and debris.

I used some Bronze Wool and all in all, that and lots of Lighter Fluid, then light Oil, and it came out looking pretty good! Inside I was able to clean well with Lighter Fluid and tiny Brass Wire Brushed ( this over several days to get all that old crud loose and able to be cleaned off ).

My recoil Spring was broken so I too sent off for a new "Wolff" Spring.


Here is what the front sight would look like for this early era:

http://media.fotki.com/1_p,rrbdwbdds...MG_6315-vi.jpgHosted on Fotki


http://media.fotki.com/1_p,rrbdkbkss...MG_6460-vi.jpgHosted on Fotki

I admire all the work you are putting into yours!

I hope you can get everything working well and full function.

I think the really 'early' examples are very cool and I like their details.

Yours should have the fully round checkered Safety ( later ones, it was flat on one side somewhat where it rests against the Stock when in 'Fire' mode).

Yours is definitely better in terms of finish than mine. I'm going to try my hand at bluing it I Think! The formula I'm going to use is 5lb sodium hydroxide to 2 parts potassium nitrate to a gallon of water. I have a paint can I'm going to mix it up in and put it on a burner. Should be a real interesting experiment! I'll probably do the slide first as the frame needs more tweaking to get the grips right.

Second one is here, I used it to file the front sight down on the first one so that I could get a better idea of how high it should be. I think it's closer to the condition of yours, it actually seems to have some finish left. I may refinish anyways, it's not enough to ruin the value of it I Think.

http://i1127.photobucket.com/albums/...ps8g3xi1xg.jpg

The ejector is significantly shorter than the other gun, it seems to have had some material welded on. I think a crude repair. I had to tweak the mag from my other one (didn't come with a mag) so that it would work, but it seems fine in both guns after some effort. Some aspects of the mechanism are the same, but others (the safety/ejector block, the frame, the barrel) are not. It's definitely a series of first year production run changes.

The earlier Safetys will seem loose when in the "FIRE" mode.

At some point, they changed that by adding an internal over center pressure Spring Detent or whatever it would be called, so the Safty is snug and stays put, when in "FIRE" position.

Mine, the Safety sort of swings around where ever it likes, unless it is actuall fully in the "SAFE" position, and oh well, just how it is...Lol...

As for refinishing, for me, I like the old 'beaters' with low Blue, which have not ever been refinished...they have their own look, and, it is a good look to my Eye.

The Giant Book which is all about the SAVAGE Pistols, ought to elaborate on their engineering changes.

I got a copy recently on ebay then loaned it out so I have not read it yet, but, it was not expensive, especially for such a large and thick Book, chock full of great images and info.

I just checked ebay and there is one listed for 39 bucks.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Savage-Pisto...EAAOSwQJhUbv4X

Sometimes a seller has one for less, I think I paid like 32 bucks for my copy.

Once I can finally read my copy, I am hoping to find out more about some of the many 'along the way' small changes the '07 Pistols had.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Drac0nic

Yours is definitely better in terms of finish than mine. I'm going to try my hand at bluing it I Think! The formula I'm going to use is 5lb sodium hydroxide to 2 parts potassium nitrate to a gallon of water. I have a paint can I'm going to mix it up in and put it on a burner. Should be a real interesting experiment! I'll probably do the slide first as the frame needs more tweaking to get the grips right.

Second one is here, I used it to file the front sight down on the first one so that I could get a better idea of how high it should be. I think it's closer to the condition of yours, it actually seems to have some finish left. I may refinish anyways, it's not enough to ruin the value of it I Think.

http://i1127.photobucket.com/albums/...ps8g3xi1xg.jpg

The ejector is significantly shorter than the other gun, it seems to have had some material welded on. I think a crude repair. I had to tweak the mag from my other one (didn't come with a mag) so that it would work, but it seems fine in both guns after some effort. Some aspects of the mechanism are the same, but others (the safety/ejector block, the frame, the barrel) are not. It's definitely a series of first year production run changes.

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My Safety ( Serial Number 3 thousand and low change ), the 'Button' aspect is fully round.

Your two, the left top one, looks like a little 'Ear' or something, and, the second ot bottom one, looks like it is Round but with a little flat on the side where it meets the Stocks when in "FIRE" position.

If I am correct, then, there were at least three different shape Safety 'Buttons' early on.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Oyeboten

My Safety ( Serial Number 3 thousand and low change ), the 'Button' aspect is fully round.

Your two, the left top one, looks like a little 'Ear' or something, and, the second ot bottom one, looks like it is Round but with a little flat on the side where it meets the Stocks when in "FIRE" position.

If I am correct, then, there were at least three different shape Safety 'Buttons' early on.

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I'm trying to figure out if the safety was changed or not, based on what I'm reading I think that the early gun had the small safety.

Range report today, I took both shooting. Not a lot of rounds through them, but I did find out that the mag lip tweaking I did feeds well in both guns. (I need to pick another mag or two up.) The big issue I'm having right now is one has a broken extractor that needs more material added so it's not ejecting right, the other one is not extracting properly. I have changed the spring out, is there another form of tuning I need to do to the extractor?

Ammo was a combination of some very old Federal FMJ I had laying around and some Fiocchi 60GR JHPs (I think they're supposed to be a drop in for the Silvertips on a Seecamp.) Both rounds fed well.

My circa 1909 SAVAGE did 100 percent Textbook perfect 'Stovepipes' with brand new off the shelf Winchester Silvertips. Which I take to suggest, not enough "ooomph" to cycle the Slide far enough back and or energetically enough, for full ejection.

Had 100 percent perfect function with Sellier & Belloit FMJ, and Magtech ( plain RNL Lead in this latter one ).

I have a brand new WOLFF Mainspring in mine, which may be what was up, since most every one else always says the WInchester Silvertips funciton fine in theirs ( and most of these old SAVAGE .32s, may well have a somewhat tired Recoil Spring ).

I could post some close ups of the Ejector in mine, if that would help?

I have 2, and I can tell you the ejector on one is way too short (almost 1/4") so I know that's the issue. I'm going to look for someone to add material to it with a TIG then file it into shape. The extraction on the one is what's weird. Fiocchi is generally considered "hot" ammo.

I had one a long time a go, sold it to a buddy you guys make me want it back !!!