time between shots so barrel doesn't get too hot???

I'm having a hard time keeping groups beyond 150 yards. It's a Trophy Hunter Package 30-06 that I added on a Hoque over molded stock and one piece DNZ Game Reaper mount for the Nikon scope.

I've tried Fed. Fusion and Hornady Superperformance GMX both 165gr. Both took about three rounds before settling into good 1 moa groups at 100 yds. Once I started trying to confirm the Spot on hold overs it all went to crap. I couldn't group good enough to even verify the hold overs.
I used to shoot M24 and SR 25's at work for quite a while. I feel like my position is stable.
While shooting this gun I really didn't think about putting any significant time between shots. With the light barrel I wondering if this could be part of the issue. I also wonder if I should try another load. I have a week before my first tag so I'm feeling the pressure.

Any help is greatly appreciated.

Andy

I know my 30-06 with a standard barrel can only handle about 4-5 shots before getting too hot to hold with a bare hand. I wait about 8-10 minutes before shooting another group of 4-5.

I recently went to a precision rifle course where everyone would shoot a group and then walk the range to check targets (but really it was just built-in barrel cooling time). The instructors even told me and another guy shooting 300 Win Mag to only fire 3-round groups at certain points to help us keep the barrels cool. I had never realized before this course just how important barrel temp can be.

That is called barrel drift, always extract your brass immediately to prevent "heat soak" that and leave your bolt open as long as possible between shots, so the heat can escape from both ends of the barrel it makes a big difference, take this advise from some one whose Bull Barrels get to hot after only two shots.

Dean

Yeah, I have a 30-06 A-bolt that gets hot after 2 shots and each successive shot thereafter progressively drifts 1 inch right. Walks right off the paper! For hunting purposes, with a sporter barrel, I don't see any point in shooting more than 2 shots without stopping 5-10 mins and letting the barrel cool. Some barrels will behave differently.

My strategy is to bring two and sometimes three rifles to the range shooting one while the others are cooling off. Rifles are stood muzzle up with bolts open to allow the chimney effect to circulate cool air through the barrels.

During the warm summer months I mostly shoot heavy barrel small bore target/varmint rifles. I switch them out every 10 to 15 rounds. During the colder seasons I shoot my large bore hunting/sporter rifles switching them out every 3 to 6 rounds. The cooler the ambient temperature the faster I can shoot and the quicker the resting rifles cool off.

There are several methods that can be employed to cool barrels quickly such as using fans, ice water, cold packs, wet towels, etc. But I find it more convenient to just shoot several rifles at a time.

That is pretty much what I do too a T.

Dean

Same for me even brought the pistol out to the rifle range last time to provide between groups entertainment.

I think the heat issue affects barrels differently. Some barrels that are stressed relieved don't move POI at all other than minor shifts due to velocity differences (some temp sensitivity). Some barrels have wild POI shifts due to heat. I seen both pencil barrels and bull barrels exhibit this behavior. It never hurts to keep your barrel though.
As far as the ammo. My wife's Rem 700 '06 shoots rocks sub moa. By far the best shooting stock barrel I've ever dealt with. I have loads from 110gr- 208gr bullets from Barnes x to SMK's. I absolutely will not shoot hornady Superformance ammo. Remington corlokts shoot moa. Superformace at best shoots 2 moa. My hand loaded 165 GMX shoot 1/2 moa so it's not the bullet. Try some different ammo until you find what it likes and then buy a bunch (just for hunting) from the same lot. Use it just for hunting that way you always have a go to load.

but a timeless topic......

I switch between my .223 and a 17 hmr, when the .223 barrel heats up. I can go for about 10 shots, two 5 shot groups with a bit of time in between to reload the clip.
I always set up enough targets, maybe different for each gun. You can shoot .17 hmr's for a long time before you get any real heat going. Especially with a bull barrel.
What's your technique ?

I have polar opposite barrels. Heat is a real problem out here in summer. Even in the shade it only takes a few rounds for the barrel to get hot. I shoot 5 round groups and have waited 10 to 20 min between groups when I needed the barrel to 'cool'.

1. Axis .223 heavy barrel shooting 77SMK's. It shoots into 1/2MOA or less with cold or hot barrel. I've shot it until it was too hot to touch and it still groups well. The groups do drift about 1MOA from cold to very hot (about 30 rounds, or 6 groups). I got 'lazy' shooting that rifle since I didn't have to ever let it cool between groups.

2. 12BVSS .308 (26" stainless varmint weight barrel). Takes about 5 rounds from cold to 'settle'. Then 5 rounds at a time and it needs to be allowed to cool. If I fire more than 10 rounds nonstop the groups will open up. I have to keep the barrel cool enough that I can hold it with my hand. FWIW, I can also see the change in velocities as the barrel heats.

Out here in the summer it takes a LONG time to cool, even with a shade. Some folks carry forced air cooling systems (small vacuums with a tube that fits in the chamber). I've seen people pour water over their barrel after a long string.

I've thought about getting those stick on heat strips so I can monitor the barrel temp. I guess I need to bite the bullet and get one of the harbor freight IR temp tools.

Some interesting observations here Charlie.
No doubt, most of the battle is learning your gun.
That's a thought on the IR thermometer. I do a lot of work with my hands, they're calloused, and it often seems nothing is too hot to my touch.

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Originally Posted by charlie b

I have polar opposite barrels. Heat is a real problem out here in summer. Even in the shade it only takes a few rounds for the barrel to get hot. I shoot 5 round groups and have waited 10 to 20 min between groups when I needed the barrel to 'cool'.

1. Axis .223 heavy barrel shooting 77SMK's. It shoots into 1/2MOA or less with cold or hot barrel. I've shot it until it was too hot to touch and it still groups well. The groups do drift about 1MOA from cold to very hot (about 30 rounds, or 6 groups). I got 'lazy' shooting that rifle since I didn't have to ever let it cool between groups.

2. 12BVSS .308 (26" stainless varmint weight barrel). Takes about 5 rounds from cold to 'settle'. Then 5 rounds at a time and it needs to be allowed to cool. If I fire more than 10 rounds nonstop the groups will open up. I have to keep the barrel cool enough that I can hold it with my hand. FWIW, I can also see the change in velocities as the barrel heats.

Out here in the summer it takes a LONG time to cool, even with a shade. Some folks carry forced air cooling systems (small vacuums with a tube that fits in the chamber). I've seen people pour water over their barrel after a long string.

I've thought about getting those stick on heat strips so I can monitor the barrel temp. I guess I need to bite the bullet and get one of the harbor freight IR temp tools.

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Pretty much the same thing here in Georgia along with much higher humidity than New Mexico.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by thebeav

but a timeless topic......

I switch between my .223 and a 17 hmr, when the .223 barrel heats up. I can go for about 10 shots, two 5 shot groups with a bit of time in between to reload the clip.
I always set up enough targets, maybe different for each gun. You can shoot .17 hmr's for a long time before you get any real heat going. Especially with a bull barrel.
What's your technique ?

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Exactly what I do with my Savage 110 in .223 and .17HMR. I`ll shoot a 3 or 5 shot group with my .223 then put it to rest in the rack for a good 10 minutes or so and switch out to my 17 which has a bull barrel. I`m probably overdoing it with the .223 as far as resting time is concerned, but I`ve read enough about heat to know it`s not a barrel`s friend.

I use heat strips on all of my target barrels because You can't judge the effect of barrel temperature unless you know the temperature of the barrel (so you can determine when the barrel is getting too hot to maintain accuracy).
1) You determine the effect of temperature by measuring your results, but it requires that you measure deviations from the aim point at different barrel temperatures and you have to record the data along with temperature to determine the effect. The good news is that it takes a few rounds even on a very hot day before you see any effect.
2) The calibration of the temperature strip is moot because you are only interested in when the temperature measured by the strip results in degradation.
I use strips that indicate from 85 to 140 degrees. By 140 degrees, I generally can see the differences.
When my barrels reach about 120 degrees (on my temp strips), I have measured that my bullets drop about 0.25 inches at 100 yards. When you are shooting 5-round groups that average under 0.4 inches, 0.25 matters.

In Northern VA, on a summer morning it takes 3 shots to reach the beginning of the 85 deg indicator and about 10 shots to get to the 120 deg indicator.
By mid-day in summer is can take 2 to reach 85 deg and 6-8 to reach 120 deg.

In winter at 40 degrees, those numbers double.

I have a barrel fan that tends to reduce the time to get the barrel back to 85 degrees to half as long as letting is sit in the shade. In the hottest days of summer, it helps but it is not very efficient.
Our range put a rack for letting your rifle cool in the air-conditioned range house a couple of years ago and it is very popular with the members who care about maintaining accuracy on a hot day.

If You don’t mind My asking, where do You shoot “CF” ?

Thanks ... “GG”

I’m guessing here, (and I could be wrong), but I believe he shoots somewhere in Virginia?? LOL!

GrenGuy,

Northern VA - Arlington-Fairfax Chapter of the Isaak Walton League, in Centreville.
I'm also a RSO for our Rifle-Pistol range.

RSO= Really Sensitive Observer :surprise:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by CFJunkie

GrenGuy,

Northern VA - Arlington-Fairfax Chapter of the Isaak Walton League, in Centreville.
I'm also a RSO for our Rifle-Pistol range.

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Thanks CF. I helped build a lot of houses in Centerville. The IWL is a fine organization. My place is about 90 miles west in the valley. Thanks for all the good data You provide for us. GG

If it’s a hunting type barrel contour I’d expect 10 rounds in normal succession to stay put without any wondering I could lay off to heat. If it’s a truck axle it better stay put indefinitely. Assuming in both cases that the stock fits correctly. If not there is a heat treat issue with the barrel that we can either accept as - is or replace it.

If the temp is much above 80, I won't waste my time. I often will not go shooting from June until October

In the past I have shot 3 rounds followed by 5 minutes in the car with the A/C full blast on the barrel. Nowadays I take 2 centerfires and a rimfire and alternate