Warm/Cold Barrel

http://i65.tinypic.com/30djaef.jpg[IMG]

Pictured is my zeroed rifle results on a 100 yard target
Shot#1 = 8 ring @ 10:00..... Cold barrel center (approx.) of previous trip to range
Adjusted scope 2-1/2" right
Shot#2 = 9 ring@ 12:30....Cold barrel
Shot#3= 9 ring@ 2:30.....Warm barrel
Shot#4= 9 ring@ 1:00....Cold barrel
Shot#5= 9 ring@ 2:30...Warm barrel

Rifle is Axis XP W/Standard trigger (Adjusted w/ home gunsmithing to 2# pull) 6.5 Creedmoor. Weaver 3X9 scope.
Ammo is my reload 40gr. Hodgdon H4350, 143 gr. Hornaday ELDX bullets.
Shots in lower left hand target are factory "Black" 140 gr. HPBT Hornaday. Cheap ammo to get more brass fitted to my rifles chamber for neck resizing only.

Analysis: I bought this rifle for a "beater" / loaner for my grandkids. It is the ONLY plastic stocked, "black" rifle in my gun safe.
At this point, I have probably shot 50-60 rounds total down the bore and the rifle is beginning to come on line.
Either the cold or the warm barrel 2 shot groups can be covered with a dime.
The scoped rifle sells for $279.95 at Academy Sports in Houston.
IMO a bargain!

Warm or cold, I'd say that's a dead deer. You'll probably find that it settles in a little more once you get 100-150 rounds through it.

The first shot out of a clean cold barrel is the one I think is the most Important !!!!

We have to agree to disagree. First shot out of a CLEAN cold barrel will not impact in the same place as subsequent fouled barrel shots. I hunt with a fouled barrel.

You're fortunate to hunt in Texas and not New York. Dragging a fouled barrel through a couple weeks of rain, snow and condensation from temperature changes does nothing to lengthen their useful lives.

Stumpkiller, FYI it has rained nearly every day for the past month at my ranch near Del Rio. Texas. I do not "Drag" my rifles thru any mud and the barrel is always protected from rain drops..i.e. I do not point it "up" when carrying. The elevation of my ranch is approx. 2400' ASL, so it receives a fair amount of snow. Same for how my rifles are carried in snow weather.
At my age, ALL of my rifles will last far beyond my "useful life" and my sons are fully aware of rifle maintenance procedures.
My sympathies are with hunters from New York. Not only must you deal with bad weather, but anti-gun politicians are a dime a dozen.
It is common knowledge, in Texas, that a clean barrel will not shoot to the same point of aim as a fouled barrel. Been there, done that.:deadhorse:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Bad Bob

Stumpkiller, FYI it has rained nearly every day for the past month at my ranch near Del Rio. Texas. I do not "Drag" my rifles thru any mud and the barrel is always protected from rain drops..i.e. I do not point it "up" when carrying. The elevation of my ranch is approx. 2400' ASL, so it receives a fair amount of snow. Same for how my rifles are carried in snow weather.
At my age, ALL of my rifles will last far beyond my "useful life" and my sons are fully aware of rifle maintenance procedures.
My sympathies are with hunters from New York. Not only must you deal with bad weather, but anti-gun politicians are a dime a dozen.
It is common knowledge, in Texas, that a clean barrel will not shoot to the same point of aim as a fouled barrel. Been there, done that.:deadhorse:

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That is why, when I hunted, that I zeroed with a cold, clean barrel. Yep, took a lot longer at the range, but it worked.

For my paper rifles I rarely clean and shoot from a warm barrel.

It's all good.

I hunt a clean barrel. (My Daddy taught me never to sleep while a gun is dirty). :deadhorse: My current "sporter weight" deer rifle drifts left as it heats up after the third shot. I can shoot 1/2" to 3/4" three shot groups on a 1" target plaster but a five shot group, 20 to 30 seconds between shots, invariably is 1-1/2". Fresh & clean or dirty after cooling down.


Can't remember the last time I needed a second shot on the same day of deer hunting. ;-) Twice I've had to drag two deer out. Never again.

One thing I have noticed is that if I forget to bump the stock when torquing the action screws that the first shot will be high. I was playing around to see if it had a favored torque value and discovered this. One of the reasons I will be doing a bedding & pillar job after the deer season.

When hunting I run a dry patch down the bore before I head out in the AM and, when I come back in, I either leave the gun sit in the cold barn or garage so it doesn't get condensation, or bring it in for a cleaning and wipe-down if it has been a snowy/rainy day. I'm not worried about rain or snow in the bore. It's the condensation and misc. crap (hemlock needles seem to be a favorite).

Killer, I use a boresnake to clean, after the season. Then sight in with the clean barrel before the next seasons start. All my rifles in safe have clean bores, except for the one I am using to hunt in the current season.
As I said in opening post, the Axis is my ONLY black/plastic stocked rifle...all the rest are walnut, polished blue and range from .22-250 to .45-70 (Pre 64 Winchesters, Ruger #1's, Marlins and Brownings).

:beaten:

Never meant to imply gun abuse for your practices.

Just mentioned that with my climate, powder, primers, cleaning methods and mixed handling that I wouldn't sleep if I had a gun that had gone through a season with a fouled bore.

You are obviously making it work for you. :tea:

YES Stumpkiller ditto, try that here in Michigan cold clean barrel here my friend !!!

I have been if anyone could explain why a dirty barrel would shoot more accurate?
I shot at the senior games a few years ago, The shooters were split some cleaned after each round some never cleaned. I do know that if you shoot a lot your barrel will stay accurate for longer.

Wow I am new to this typing. And do not know how to correct. I wanted to say stay accurate if you keep it clean.

I think that as your barrel wears the dirty barrel keeps the lands closer. Some replace a barrel depending on how many shots its takes to regain accuracy after cleaning.

Just for grins the other day I tracked my groups at start and end. Axis II .223 HB. 100yds, really calm day, about 40F.

First group was .6" and was .75" above aimpoint. Last group (after about 40 rounds and barrel too hot to touch) was a ragged hole about .3" and about .9" above aimpoint.

Yes, this rifle loves 69gn SMK's and Varget powder. 200yd group was 1.3"

Quote:

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Originally Posted by azguy

I have been if anyone could explain why a dirty barrel would shoot more accurate?
I shot at the senior games a few years ago, The shooters were split some cleaned after each round some never cleaned. I do know that if you shoot a lot your barrel will stay accurate for longer.

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After the first shot your barrel is dirty. So, unless you clean between shots, only one round during a string is from a clean barrel.

The question is, how often do you clean. There have been quite a few opinions on this. Some will clean after each string. Some after each day. Some not much at all. Some will not clean until they notice an increase in group size. Some claim not to clean for hundreds of rounds. One I read said he never cleaned the barrel.

Some say that the crud 'fills the pores' of the barrel, making it smoother and more accurate. Others claim the opposite is better. Even others will try to 'polish' the bore smoother.

Then there is the issue of barrel being worn out by cleaning. If you use a bore snake or a rod that touches the bore (like a take down rod) then you may cause more wear than shooting through the crud.

Everyone has their own ideas and techniques depending on how much they shoot and how often.

There's a guy on YouTube named TiborasaurusRex, an extreme long range shooter, who very rarely cleans his rifles. His claim is that his barrels reach a copper lined equilibrium. This equilibrium allows for his barrels to shoot both cold and hot similarly.

David

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