What is the general concusses on lub when putting a SS barrel into a steel receiver ? I was thinking about picking up a small tube of either "Kopper Koat", or one with "moly" in the compound./
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What is the general concusses on lub when putting a SS barrel into a steel receiver ? I was thinking about picking up a small tube of either "Kopper Koat", or one with "moly" in the compound./
No copper
Nickel anti seize
That would work. I use Permatex Antisieze building bicycle wheels too. Stainless spokes and alloy nipples do not seize after 10 years in place.
OK, I'll check who has a small tube of Permatex, after all, " a little dab will do you"
There are a bunch of different permatex anti seize. Make.sure you look at the.label. auto parts.storeQuote:
Originally Posted by Shooter0302
A little dab of Anti-Seize on the ear piece of the telephone receiver when the boss picks it up? Priceless!! That crap gets on EVERYTHING!! A little dab will do ya.
I did a search and Permatex makes a nickel lub.
https://www.permatex.com/products/lu...ize-lubricant/
Love the meme Robinhood!!!
All I've ever done is to heat and coat with FL, wipe excess off as directed. Never had any seizing issues.
FL ?? all in all I think I'll make my own, 2 parts Hi Temp wheel bearing grease& 1 part Boron Nitride HCPL grade, got some left over from when I was trying HbN coated bulletsQuote:
Originally Posted by darkker
Dykum paste is better for that application, aka; "Blue Ear". Put it on a black phone ear piece and the boss will have a blue ear for days, it doesn't wash off.Quote:
Originally Posted by Nor Cal Mikie
Not that I would ever do anything like that!
Bill
Permatex Prussian blue is a good one also.Quote:
Originally Posted by BillPa
I see a few of you'll are in the category described by Robin Williams in the movie "Good Morning Vietnam"
Frog LubeQuote:
Originally Posted by Shooter0302
Nickel anti seize of any type.
the copper stuff should be outlawed. It may have a use but I never found it.
I don't know why anybody would put anti seize on barrel threads.......it's not needed and it's messy. I've never seen a barrel threads seize. A drop of oil won't hurt.
I don't like the grind of metal on metal. Call it a mechanic thing.
Nickel Anti seize is what is recommended for stainless and you are integrating stainless and steel, possible galling and or interactions.
Certainly if someone does not want to its fine, my NSS Action Wrench also has toque spec and that is based on lubed.
I am not good around paint or glue but I don't have a problem with anti seize.
Metals with galling tendencies are normally identified with 300 series stainless, aluminum and titanium. none of my barrels are either of those materials so galling is not a concern for me. a drop of 3in1 is all I use.
Well the nickel anti seize is what is recommended for Savage
I build a lot of AR's too and those hard core AR guys are ready to fight about mil spec. this and mil spec that. Only thing you can use on that barrel nut is this special moly grease.
I am a why not guy and use anti seize on the Savage and moly grease on the AR. Oil or grease or anti seize or nothing would probably work in either case.
But really why not. It sure can't hurt to follow the instructions
Yep
So...who's the big authority that's recommending nickle anti-seize for Savage rifle barrels? Surely it's not Savage.....surely it's not SAAMI....surely it's not AGI....and surely it's not some accomplished benchrest shooter like Tony Boyer or Speedy Gonzales who routinely change barrels multiple times in one match.
This recommendation had to come from a pipe fitter, not a gunsmith......but they are your guns, do whatever makes you feel safe.
...... Did you just call me Shirley....:cool:
Well I certainly am not Shirley though I worked with a guy by that name, he went verbally postal on the Forman one day (he had done ti with me when no one was around) , sort of the guy named Sue thing, what he didn't know was the Forman's half brother was standing behind him with a 4 x 4. Said half brother was also the Boxing Champion of the S.W. Pacific in WWII. Not a big guy, very pleasant person, I would not have wanted to mess with him. I got to watch him get fired, something to be said for standing your ground but not complaining and let them hang themselves.
That said as I have stated on maybe 8 occasions, NSS with their action wrench gives both torque specs and the use of anti seize.
As those two go together, I think its a credible source and solid advice form my experience with machinery (not sure how far back you want to go, my dad was a mechanic so I grew up around it)
My personal take is it stops metal to metal grinding, its required to meet the torque spec as without it you have to guess what dry is translated to.
Me, I have no issue with someone who wants to use coconut oil, devcon, pear juice etc. I found NSS recommendation matches my experience and am using it.
So, if someone asks, that is what I reply with citing the source and recommending the action wrench they supply (its got all the right stuff and it even has toque specs for the main clamp bolts as well as the action fastener.
At the very least its a good starting point for someone who does not know this stuff and at worst its a good finishing point as well and I continue to go with it.
NSS doesn't actually build guns,...... take that for what it's worth.
:rolleyes: Theoretically you could elongate the chamber by torquing a lubricated barrel/action joint. I wonder if that would cause a situation not fixed by primary extraction.
^ Cool ^ ... How many foot pounds does it take to turn a 30/06 chamber into a 30 Gibbs? ;-))
You asked for the citation and got it.Quote:
Originally Posted by sharpshooter
Someplace I have it that Savage uses 90 ft lbs (and it has to be with whatever "gunk" they put on the threads.
Having taken off 3 now, I can tell you its a hell of a lot tighter that 50 ft lbs. That may be the gunk or it may be the toque.
I know what 90 to 100 foot pounds is supposed to feel like. It's not the torque.
It's the "GUNK"
Apply a little heat and the nut behaves as 100ft/lbs should.
Well I change barrels often on my switchbarrel. Don't use anything.close to 100 foot lbs. More like.40 and I do use a torque wrench.
I soon plan to Loctite the barrel nut to the barrel. That way I can just spin the barrel off and spin the next one on lining up the index marks and headspace should be consistent.
I will say with anti-seize a little goes a.long way.
I don't either, I sternly suspect you don'tQuote:
Originally Posted by sharpshooter
Unless I see something that does not track, I will accept their data.
No issue with following it so far, pushing 500 rounds down each barrel.
One with the NSS nut and one without.
Agreed, I think it was AGI (?) video that advocated the 90 ft lbs.Quote:
Originally Posted by FW Conch
That seems out of line.
The one barrel came off with something around 50 ft lbs feel. The other one was stuck and stuck good.
Both had goop, hotter chamber temps may have weakened the goop (or time, 15 years old roughly). It had it but it was not stuck, nice easy removal with the breaker bar the NSS nut tool.
My BIL is going to Switch Barrel on His Batt action, shouldered barrel, for His 1,000yd rig. He will shoot the 6Dasher barrel in the absence of wind, and go to 6x47 Lapua when the wind kicks up. His very competent Smith says the barrel should be torqued to 100ft/lbs to insure good harmonics. This may be where the 100fp figure is coming from? I have always felt that 40fp's was plenty on My Savages. With My Shooting, I doubt any improvement in harmonics would even be noticeable?
LOL!Quote:
Originally Posted by RC20
You mean from scratch?
HahahahahaQuote:
Originally Posted by foxx
OK, I will be the one....Quote:
Originally Posted by RC20
Sharpshooter = Sharp Shooter Supply
This gun right here is my 6mm Dasher. But on really windy days I switch to a 6x47.Quote:
Originally Posted by FW Conch
Does he also have 2 brothers named Leroy? Or maybe the smith does? lol
But that aside, ive watched as what I perceived to be a pretty good smith spin a barrel on by hand, chamber a case, then test fire the gun.
Not to say he didn't torque it later, but he sure didn't while I was watching.
Granted, that was in the old days, and maybe he didn't own a torque wrench.
Just my opinion but it seems to me there is quite a bit of difference between torquing a barrel with a shoulder into a conventional action and tightening a barrel nut on a savage action
I can see a conventional barrel torqued at 100 ft/lbs. Not meant to come off until a gunsmith rebarrels.it. you are also tightening the actual barrel shoulder up against the.face of the reciever.. Not a nut over the barrel that can only pull the threads tight.
yobuck, I don't know the name of the smith, but he is about 40 minutes NW of Harrisburg, and apparently well known. Must be close to Your neck of the woods?
Apparently there are more than a few "Leroys" out there doing the switch barrel thing in the 1,000yd game?
My BIL has only been at it for about 2 years, and is following the lead of the guys that are competive, but He is already doing well. Not surprising, since he is an inherently good shot.
I only get to hear about this stuff through His efforts to impress Me ;-))
But alas, We are wondering away from the subject of barrel thread lubricants :-((
Just joking, but the 2 similar cartridges did catch my attention. lolQuote:
Originally Posted by FW Conch
The location you mentioned would be Mark Kings area, or possibly Kevin Cram. Both very good smiths.
Tell your BIL to tell the fat old shooter hello for me. One of my old mentors who gave me my first click chart.
Does your BIL hunt?
Basically, Ed does not hunt. He may still hunt woodchucks, but probably not so mutch since He is way into this long range stuff. Some years back, He went to Texas to help his other BIL eradicate some non indigenous species from a game ranch. He took an Audad on a dead run at 425yds, witnessed. He also took a 160 score typical white tail, etc.
The name Mark King sounds familiar.
Lube or no lube is an important aspect of torque.Quote:
Originally Posted by FW Conch
I have no disagreement with someone who chooses not to lube or even if they smack the nut wrench with a hammer to set it, their gun they can do what they want.
If they ask I don't agree with that but they certainly can do what they want.
the lube aspect though is a serious component of a recommended torque.
You should not use a torque that has been listed with a specific lube.
Back when I was doing engines we did not use anything willy nilly. If the book called for peanut butter, we used that (and that was an actual product though they did not use that name, its what mechanics called it as it looked like that, toxic as all hell as I recall)
If they called for engine oil on the threads, we used engine oil and not peanut butter.
If they called for anti size, we used anti seize and the type they specified.
I don't think the Savage barrel nut is in that category of head bolt or con rod camp bolts spec for critical.
I do think if you are going to go with the NSS instructions , then you use both the lube specified and the Torque.
I don't like guessing and that was solid information for staring out (and as noted, people have their own methods) the NSS has h worked fine, I will stick with it.
Smacking with a hammer seems to work fine as well but that is not how I do it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by RC20
:caked:Quote:
Originally Posted by Robinhood
Fred's done that a time or five as well. Rimfires, centerfires, muzzleloaders, a cannon... I bet if you ask real nice he'll even post some pictures of his creations.Quote:
Originally Posted by foxx
Quote:
Originally Posted by RC20
Just turned this thread into solid gold.
:)Quote:
Originally Posted by Robinhood
I'm sure Fred got a chuckle out of that one.
Crickets....
Wondered how long it would take......:rockon:
Hehe. That's the shiznit right there!!!!!Quote:
Originally Posted by sharpshooter
Ok guys, saw it and thought I would just let it go.
I was asked for the citation and got what I consider a smart reply back.
Sharpshooter, President of the US, you name it, that does not sit well.
Maybe one of you all might call Jim and ask him where it came from? No, just more smart stuff. So is the egg on my face or yours?
One thing my dad taught me, if you are right son, don't ever let anyone bull you down. I stood up to a whole construction crew on one occasion, I was right, they were wrong and due to my standing up, they didn't blow up the engine on their brand new dozer. I didn't get a swollen head, I went back to work. I made mistakes before and I have made them since.
.
So roll on tide, roll on, get it out of your system, maybe we can then go back to helping people.
Well looks.like another Internet thing that no one knows the source.
If you do a search all the.other shooting forums have the same information
Guess it.really can't hurt. I will just keep doing it.