I'm getting 4 to 5 inch groups @ 100 yards with the American Eagle stuff. Any body else having problems with this ammo? 1 in 7 twist, 18" barrel, 75 grain bullet.
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I'm getting 4 to 5 inch groups @ 100 yards with the American Eagle stuff. Any body else having problems with this ammo? 1 in 7 twist, 18" barrel, 75 grain bullet.
Just to be clear, this is in a Savage MSR? How many rounds through the gun? How does it shoot with other factor loads?
What is your experience level? Are you using a front rest? Off a bench? Brand and model of scope..... yada yada.
MSR 15 Recon LRP, Vortex PST scope, off the bench, rested front and rear, lots of experience, probably 80 rounds through it, no other ammo tried. I was mostly wondering if the ammo was junk.
Then you know that 12 dollar a box ammo is hit or miss. Try some FGMM
https://www.targetsportsusa.com/fede...1-p-78462.aspx
5'' group does raise some flags. Let us know how it shoots some good stuff.
When Savage makes that rifle with a 1:6, 1:6.5, I will consider it. 1:7 should be fine for the lighter bullets. Try other brands with different weight. Should be able to find a sweet spot. Was going to get there 6.5cm but waiting on this caliber to get the kinks out.
There are no other brands. Only different weights.
First try some different ammo to rule that out since it's the cheapest and easiest thing to do. After that I would recommend trying a different scope on the rifle. 5" groups @ 100 is typically a result of a bad scope that's not holding zero or something loose in the mounts.
Agree. A good rifle will shoot junk ammo into an inch and a half.Quote:
Originally Posted by J.Baker
OP,
I would also try the 60gr varmint load for testing. I've seen some pretty impressive groups with that round as well.
I put a different scope and rings on it yesterday. It is a weaver T 36 and a good scope. Although the wrong scope for this gun, I know it to work fine, but my groups did not improve. I have some of the SMK 90 grain coming but I wonder if that bullet is not too heavy for this gun. I hope to get out this coming Friday or Sunday for results, so time will tell.
This is way off topic, but while I was trying to get this gun to shoot yesterday, I struck up a conversation with a gentleman shooting a Sharps. He invited me to give it a try so I did and shot it twice. I hit the 10 ring at 100 yards using an aperture sight so I was happy. What a cool rifle
Loose barrel nut perhaps?
IF it were mine I would tear it completely down and reassemble checking everything as I go. 1:7 might be too slow for those bullets though.
I doubt it's the 7 twist.... I have plenty of buddy's running 7 twist with 75grs projs. in a standard 223... I would check everything over and try a different optic.... if that didn't work I'd send it to savage or order a new barrel from XCaliber or other reputable manufacturer...
For those who didn't read all the posts including the first one, It is a 1 in 7 twist, and I already swapped scopes. I don't think a 1 in 7 twist would be too slow. Do they come any faster?
i have the other model. i would check the following; clean the barrel if you have not, get the 90 grain federal match, ensure everything is tight etc, and if you have a bipod on a rail, make sure your mlok rail screws are not touching the barrel. i have found that the distance between the handguard and the barrel is minimal, and some mlok rail screws are long and will touch the barrel. if all that is good give it another try on bags, 50 yards then 100 yards, and with a secondary shooter. after that, send back to savage.Quote:
Originally Posted by rfhall11
Good advice. Got the 90 grain SMKs coming tomorrow. No bipod--rest with leather bag. No need for a secondary shooter. I have shot houseflies at 50 yards with my Anschutz MPR. I know what I'm doing. This problem is either the rifle, or ammo, or a combo. Thanks
Quote:
Originally Posted by rfhall11
let us know how it turns out. good luck.
Well...good ammo didn't help this turd of a gun. I ship it back to Savage tomorrow
Damn, 224 is letting my hopes down. Many guys are having group issues
I don't think the 224 is the issue... I'd lean on the platform.. Savage has never built AR's before and I expected them to be hit or miss off that start. Hopefully, they can get the bugs worked out...Quote:
Originally Posted by Stuntjake912
I’ve seen 4 builds. All different barrels. 2 ARs and 2 Bolt platforms. Only 1 of the bolt platforms would hold a subMOA group. I think it needs more twist rate, I’m guessing. Savage makes an excellent AR15, I’ve shot about 40 rounds threw a MSR Hunter, in 223. I don’t buy they have bugs in an AR style gun, it’s simple and they have the precision and R&D to easily make a semi auto.
I’m excited for the 224 to get worked out and dialed in. It has the potential to be my next coyote AR.
When you say "more twist" what do you mean? It has a 1 in 7 which is about as "more" as you can get. Maybe the barrel needs to be longer? Anyway If I'm going to shoot this Long Range, as the LRP would have you believe, it's gonna have to shoot better than it does. I'm already let down by this gun, and now I had to pay $40 to ship it back. I sure hope they find something wrong.
They'll send it back to you with a group from some factory load that shott 2" at 75 yards and say nothing is wrong.
I hope that's not the case. A 2" group at 75 yards would be considered very wrong to me. I'm may be overly optimistic, but I expect Savage Arms to stand behind their products.
If this gun doesn't shoot better when I get it back, I will consider myself to be ripped-off--sell it---and be done with new Savages. That would be a shame because I am a good customer.
I also have a Model 12 LRP 6.5 Creedmoor which will get 100% of my attention for long range stuff. I won't be without.
Quote:
Originally Posted by miscverb
The above is exactly the course of action I would take. Good luck with the gun!!
I have the same problem as the OP. Brand new .224 recon LRP ... groups of Fed AE 75gr. are 4-5 inches, sometimes better. To test I took my Bergara B-14 HMR in 6.5 CDM with me ... bang ... .75 MOA off the same rest ... I would post pics here of the groups if the forum would have the option. I ordered some Fed. Sierra Matching 90 gr to see if they shoot better. If not Savage can have this rifle back!
What does the bore look like?
Definitely come back here with your results please.Quote:
Originally Posted by WillysWheeler
Got tons of groups on paper ... just can't attach pics here ..Quote:
Originally Posted by rfhall11
Good or bad?
I've not been having the same issues as you guys have, although I haven't shot any of the 75 grain loads either. I've shot only the 90g MK's and 90g Fusions, and had good luck with both as far as accuracy. I've shot it with temperature in the 30's, and in the mid 80's so far. At about 60 degrees the factory FGMM is running right around 2600 fps out of the 18", my handholds at the same temp are running about 52 fps faster. I shot a 7 shot group with the handloads the other day that measured right around 1.5" spread at 200 yards. Also shot a group at 520 yards that had a spread of 4.875". I don't believe that the 1:7 twist is your issue with the 75's. The only problems I've had with any of the factory ammo was from the first case of FGMM that I bought was blowing primers, the second case, I've had no issues with pressure and I've been through about 160 rounds of those.
Don’t think we will know until the new barrels with 6.5 or 6 twist comes out. That will tell the tail.
Been gone for a month now and no repair in sight.
Junk, Savages are the lowest form of a firearm next to highpoint. I will give you 250 for it. you pay shipping.:p
Well, Savage worked with me after I expressed my disappointment and frustration. They are sending me a brand spankin new 12 F/TR in .223. It's more my style of gun anyway. I's an upgrade at no cost to me. They have redeemed themselves (as long as I get this gun in the next few weeks) so no more hard feelings and lesson learned.
So, even though the OP has switched platforms, I can weigh in here on the accuracy concerns. I have shot at least 40 rounds of each of the four types of the 224V ammo offered by Federal, including the American Eagle. This is all bench shooting, front bipod and rear bag, good optics, and an experienced shooter. Granted, it is a bolt gun, but I can shoot 10-shot sub MOA groups @ 100 yards with my 12BVSS chambered in 223.
By far, the best grouping rounds @ 100 yards are the 60gr Varmint rounds, showing MOA or better potential. The American Eagles do not shoot nearly as well and IMO are just for fun, and another way to get Valkyrie reloading brass which is difficult to find right now. The groups are much larger with both of the 90 grain bullets as well.
I am interested in shooting the 224V at longer distances. So I plan on handloading and ladder/group shooting with 75gr Hornady ELD bullets and Berger 80gr match bullets to see if I can get better performance with a heavier round than the 60gr. From what I have read so far, a 1:7 twist should be able to stabilize either of these with ease.
Funny thing, it seems to also be pretty difficult to find anyone who has AR15 224V barrels faster than a 1:7 twist since most of the barrel providers are out of stock. It is also hard to find the Hornady ELD bullets (not ammo) in 75gr or 80gr, so I think there are several others out there who want to try the same thing :)
Looks like Ballistic Advantage will be putting one out if they already haven't.
Hornady just came out with an 88gr ELD in .224 which is the same bullet they will be using in their 224V Match factory ammo. I ordered some of the bullets and plan on trying those out next (hand loading). The slightly lower mass may help with shooting in the 1:7 twist over the Sierra 90 gr BTHP. The Hornady 88gr BC is really good for its size.
So I have 200 rounds of new Starline 224V brass, 75gr Hornady ELDs, 80gr Noslers, and 88 gr Hornady ELDs. I am going to load some ladders using Alliant RE 17 and see what happens. It may take a few weeks but I will report back with results.
To the OP, you and I are in the same boat. I just posted a new thread detailing my issues. I'd love to compare notes with you.
See post #39. Gun is gone