Looking for sierra load data for 150 gamekings for 30-06 dont have the data and ready to load
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Looking for sierra load data for 150 gamekings for 30-06 dont have the data and ready to load
I push my 150 gr Speer SPBT with 59 gr of H4350. My old Hodgdon manual lists a a velocity of 2968 with a 165 gr Sierra SPBT. I just checked the Hodgdon website and the loads they list for H4350 are a bit lighter. Don't know what to tell you. My loads do not show any high pressure signs, but you may want to start a bit lower and work up.
All loading data is ball park information due to variations in firearms and components.
Hodgdon's and other sites have free information and as always they tell you to make workup loads looking for signs of pressure.
https://www.hodgdon.com/
Simple Trick for Monitoring Pressure of Your Rifle Reloads
http://www.hodgdonreloading.com/relo...-rifle-reloads
Loading data for the 30-06 is conservative due to all the older rifles still being used. (60,000 psi and lower like the Hodgdon site)Quote:
Originally Posted by Haiku_Rodney
In a modern bolt action the 30-06 can be loaded to the same chamber pressure as the .270 Win. (65,000 psi)
I have a Remington 760 pump and a Remington 700 in 30-06 and years ago had a 760 pump in .270 Win and thought it was strange I had to load the 30-06 to a lower chamber pressure. The reason is that there are to many older surplus 30-06 rifles floating around so the pressure was lowered.
Another example is factory ammunition for the .303 British is loaded to 43,000 psi and modern military ammunition was loaded to 49,000 psi. And again there are too many older Enfield rifles still being used that were made during WWII or earlier. (older softer steels and heat treating methods)
Correct but what is the trim length my manuals dont have that info for what ever reason
Below the trim length on the bottom from the Hodgdon's website I first posted and you did not look at. (remember Google is your best friend when looking for information)Quote:
Originally Posted by brianlt21
Case: Winchester
Twist: 1:10"
Primer: Winchester LR, Large Rifle
Barrel Length: 24"
Trim Length: 2.484
Hornady manual
Max case length 2.494
Case trim length 2.484
Google search
30-06 case trim length
https://www.google.com/#q=30-+06+case+trim+length
h414, 4350, for max velocity ,imr 4064 for accuracy.
SAAMI says the 30-06 is 60,000, Not Hodgdon. Can you load it hotter? Of course, but that is the case with anything. Unless you are using a pressure trace, you can't say what velocity 65,000 psi is.Quote:
Originally Posted by bigedp51
My point was that the 30-06 is under loaded and rated for a lower pressure by the SAAMI because of all the older 30-06 firearms still being used. Meaning softer and weaker steels in these older firearms.Quote:
Originally Posted by darkker
And the Hodgdon's loading link below shows this for the cheap bastards like me who don't have a Pressure Trace system and strain gauges you glue to the barrel. And I have seen pressure test data for the .223 where factory ammunition only produced 49,000 psi and 6,000 psi lower than its SAAMI rated pressure.
And below is a good link "BUT" is still ballpark because brass hardness varies and thus base expansion above the extractor groove will vary also. (cheap bastards Pressure Trace system)
Simple Trick for Monitoring Pressure of Your Rifle Reloads
http://www.hodgdonreloading.com/relo...-rifle-reloads
So my question to you is do you actually think your the only one who has ever heard of the SAAMI. Or would you have felt better if I quoted from my copy of Quickload.
So don't gauge my knowledge by my post count here, I'm 67 and have been reloading for well over 46 years.
And the link below I've had book marked for a long time, go to the bottom and read about the British base crusher system. The oiled cartridges actually registered up to 40% more bolt thrust. This is for the people who tell you to lube your cases to fireform them that nearly doubles the bolt thrust.
http://kwk.us/pressures.html
A) No, I was merely pointing out the potential flaw in the logic. SAAMI standards change frequently. The 30-06 want always a 60,000psi cartridge. If it is simply a question of what the case can withstand, then most brass will go higher than that. Hornady as one example, typically tests cases to 125% of that cartridges standard. But that isn't what the case is rated to. And unless you can test pressure, you don't know what pressure you are actually running.Quote:
Originally Posted by bigedp51
Quickload isn't the holy grail most believe it is. Hartmut gets anything he wants from Eurenco, but not the case from the rest. As an example his program really struggles to accurately describe most of General Dynamics products, and especially the progressive burning powders.
As you pointed out, no one since the 1950's actually says what alloy and spec they use. So using a *trick* is simply that, and not accurate.
B) I didn't, and didn't assume anything about you. But thanks for sharing.
C) As is referenced in this link, Denton has long been correlating the 2 systems. But as you pointed out your experience, you should know that a correlation is all can be deduced. Likely you remember the big hoopla over the original system change. When it was discovered that VERY carefully calibrated crushers, when used above @ 45,000 psi routinely show variances on the order of 20,000+ psi with the same actual load. So back to not using case measurements as any form of accurate measurement system by an average reloader.
Cheers
There is no flaw in my logic, the .270 is a necked down 30-06 case and loaded to 65,000 psi.Quote:
Originally Posted by darkker
The next thing your going to say is the Remington 700 chambered in 30-06 I have is made of lower grade steel.
Or that my Remington 760 should not have been chambered in the higher pressure .270 Win.
There is no flaw when the SAAMI selects a lower chamber pressure due to the older rifles still being used.
There is no flaw when the loading data for the 6.5x55 Swedish Mauser is for the older Krag and Mauser actions and the newer actions can take more pressure.
And there is no flaw in the standard of measuring the case expansion just above the extractor groove for high pressure.
And all reload data is ballpark information because of the wide variations in firearms and components and "WHY" you make workup loads.
Below is a brass hardness test by my buddy Catshooter, the Remington case will show base expansion long before the Lake City case with much harder brass in the base. Catshooter later posted the results of Federal brass that was the softest tested.
How Hard is Your Brass? 5.56 and .223 Rem Base Hardness Tests
http://bulletin.accurateshooter.com/...ardness-tests/
And you need to catch up on your reading, they have tested brass since the 1950s
Cartridge Brass Alloys Revealed by X-Ray Spectrometers
http://bulletin.accurateshooter.com/...spectrometers/
The only flaw here is you stroking your ego and thinking your the only one who knows how to reload or check the case for signs of over pressure.
Have a nice day...... and get a life dude.
https://www.dropbox.com/sh/kdopwcxcq...pringfield.pdf
https://www.dropbox.com/sh/kdopwcxcq...pringfield.pdf (it's safe to download)
https://www.dropbox.com/sh/kdopwcxcq...pringfield.pdf
http://www.alliantpowder.com/reloade...aspx?gtypeid=2
http://stevespages.com/page8a.htm
http://load-data.nosler.com/load-dat...6-springfield/
--------------------------------------------------------------------
Quickload predictions...
Cartridge : .30-06 Spring. (SAAMI)
Bullet : .308, 150, Sierra SPBT 2125
Useable Case Capaci: 60.887 grain H2O = 3.953 cm³
Cartridge O.A.L. L6: 3.150 inch = 80.01 mm
Barrel Length : 24.0 inch = 609.6 mm
Predicted Data for Indicated Charges of the Following Powders.
Matching Maximum Pressure: 58000 psi, or 399 MPa
or a maximum loading ratio or filling of 107 %
These calculations refer to your specified settings in QuickLOAD 'Cartridge Dimensions' window.
C A U T I O N : any load listed can result in a powder charge that falls below minimum suggested
loads or exceeds maximum suggested loads as presented in current handloading manuals. Understand
that all of the listed powders can be unsuitable for the given combination of cartridge, bullet
and gun. Actual load order can vary, depending upon lot-to-lot powder and component variations.
USE ONLY FOR COMPARISON !
Powder type Filling/Loading Ratio Charge Charge Vel. Prop.Burnt P max P muzz B_Time
% Grains Gramm fps % psi psi ms
--------------------------------- -----------------------------------------------------------------
Alliant Reloder-17 98.1 57.7 3.74 3054 99.5 58000 9506 1.075 ! Near Maximum !
Ramshot Hunter 106.8 61.9 4.01 3053 97.5 58000 9856 1.084 ! Near Maximum !
Norma URP 106.5 59.1 3.83 3047 98.9 58000 9610 1.089 ! Near Maximum !
Bofors RP19 ~approximation 106.5 59.1 3.83 3047 98.9 58000 9607 1.089 ! Near Maximum !
Hodgdon H414 100.9 59.9 3.88 3047 96.7 58000 9812 1.087 ! Near Maximum !
Winchester 760 100.9 59.9 3.88 3047 96.7 58000 9812 1.087 ! Near Maximum !
Vihtavuori N550 103.3 59.2 3.84 3044 98.8 58000 9707 1.095 ! Near Maximum !
Ramshot BigGame 99.2 57.5 3.72 3032 99.6 58000 9324 1.090 ! Near Maximum !
SNPE Vectan SP 11 99.3 57.6 3.73 3031 99.6 58000 9310 1.090 ! Near Maximum !
IMR 4895 95.6 53.7 3.48 3020 99.7 58000 9239 1.100 ! Near Maximum !
Somchem S365 107.0 59.7 3.87 3012 100.0 52746 9403 1.126 ! Near Maximum !
Norma 203B 96.9 54.4 3.52 3007 99.6 58000 9127 1.101 ! Near Maximum !
Alliant Reloder-15 96.4 54.1 3.51 3007 99.4 58000 9174 1.101 ! Near Maximum !
Raufoss RA11 96.4 54.1 3.51 3007 99.4 58000 9174 1.101 ! Near Maximum !
Bofors RP11 ~approximation 96.4 54.1 3.51 3007 99.4 58000 9174 1.101 ! Near Maximum !
Hodgdon BL-C2 91.2 55.9 3.62 3006 100.0 58000 9022 1.103 ! Near Maximum !
Norma 204 105.2 61.0 3.95 3005 94.2 58000 9570 1.085 ! Near Maximum !
Norma 203 old 98.6 55.9 3.62 3004 99.9 58000 9028 1.111 ! Near Maximum !
Winchester 748 88.7 53.6 3.47 3004 100.0 58000 8717 1.095 ! Near Maximum !
Rottweil R903 100.8 56.0 3.63 2997 99.9 58000 8950 1.112 ! Near Maximum !
Bofors RP4 NT ~approximation 106.3 60.6 3.92 2995 96.2 58000 9392 1.095 ! Near Maximum !
Hodgdon H4895 92.9 52.1 3.38 2993 99.8 58000 8923 1.101 ! Near Maximum !
IMR 3031 96.2 50.5 3.27 2993 100.0 58000 8275 1.100 ! Near Maximum !
Hodgdon H380 97.7 56.0 3.63 2992 98.5 58000 9200 1.105 ! Near Maximum !
IMR 4320 98.3 54.3 3.52 2991 99.6 58000 8846 1.086 ! Near Maximum !
ADI AR 2206H 93.2 52.3 3.39 2989 99.6 58000 8950 1.102 ! Near Maximum !
Somchem S355 100.6 55.2 3.58 2988 99.8 58000 8930 1.108 ! Near Maximum !
Lovex S070 105.3 58.5 3.79 2982 96.8 58000 9282 1.107 ! Near Maximum !
PB Clermont PCL 516 94.1 56.2 3.64 2981 98.5 58000 9069 1.097 ! Near Maximum !
SNPE Vectan SP 9 93.9 54.4 3.52 2981 99.6 58000 8871 1.098 ! Near Maximum !
Accurate 4064 103.0 54.0 3.50 2978 100.0 58000 8467 1.133 ! Near Maximum !
Accurate 2520 93.4 54.0 3.50 2978 100.0 58000 8469 1.115 ! Near Maximum !
Lovex D073.6 93.4 54.0 3.50 2978 100.0 58000 8469 1.115 ! Near Maximum !
PB Clermont PCL 507 90.4 53.0 3.43 2974 100.0 58000 8652 1.100 ! Near Maximum !
Ramshot TAC 87.9 52.9 3.42 2973 100.0 58000 8633 1.100 ! Near Maximum !
IMR 4350 105.9 59.1 3.83 2972 95.9 58000 9141 1.093 ! Near Maximum !
Somchem S321 88.7 53.6 3.47 2971 100.0 58000 8666 1.106 ! Near Maximum !
Bofors RP7 NT ~approximation 99.2 56.2 3.64 2968 96.8 58000 8960 1.083 ! Near Maximum !
Vihtavuori N530 89.6 50.6 3.28 2966 100.0 58000 8554 1.099 ! Near Maximum !
Lovex S062 97.4 53.2 3.44 2966 100.0 58000 8588 1.110 ! Near Maximum !
Hodgdon VARGET 98.8 53.6 3.48 2965 99.2 58000 8795 1.094 ! Near Maximum !
ADI AR 2208 98.5 53.6 3.48 2965 99.2 58000 8795 1.094 ! Near Maximum !
Somchem S341 92.2 55.7 3.61 2964 99.5 58000 8647 1.100 ! Near Maximum !
Lovex S065 103.9 57.0 3.70 2963 97.8 58000 9015 1.109 ! Near Maximum !
SNPE Vectan SP 7 92.1 55.5 3.59 2961 98.4 58000 8865 1.109 ! Near Maximum !
IMR 4064 99.5 52.7 3.42 2959 99.4 58000 8654 1.098 ! Near Maximum !
Accurate 2495 95.8 50.9 3.30 2958 100.0 58000 8143 1.138 ! Near Maximum !
IMR 8208 XBR 91.6 51.4 3.33 2956 100.0 58000 8462 1.100 ! Near Maximum !
Norma 202 93.7 51.7 3.35 2955 100.0 58000 8243 1.107 ! Near Maximum !
Raufoss RA4 107.0 60.1 3.89 2955 93.4 54897 9421 1.111 ! Near Maximum !
Bofors RP4 ~approximation 107.0 60.1 3.89 2955 93.4 54897 9421 1.111 ! Near Maximum !
Vihtavuori N540 96.0 54.4 3.53 2954 100.0 58000 8371 1.106 ! Near Maximum !
Norma 201 90.3 51.8 3.36 2954 100.0 58000 8540 1.115 ! Near Maximum !
Bofors RP3 NT ~approximation 101.1 56.4 3.65 2953 97.8 58000 8811 1.093 ! Near Maximum !
Rottweil R907 102.3 56.4 3.65 2950 95.8 58000 9020 1.106 ! Near Maximum !
Vihtavuori N150 105.8 56.0 3.63 2950 100.0 58000 8390 1.106 ! Near Maximum !
IMR 4007 SSC 99.1 56.4 3.66 2949 95.8 58000 9013 1.106 ! Near Maximum !
Hodgdon H322 89.5 48.8 3.16 2948 100.0 58000 8012 1.098 ! Near Maximum !
Hodgdon H4350 107.0 58.8 3.81 2946 95.4 56328 9076 1.107 ! Near Maximum !
Rottweil R902 96.1 52.0 3.37 2945 100.0 58000 8434 1.116 ! Near Maximum !
Accurate 2460 87.5 52.7 3.41 2941 100.0 58000 8262 1.121 ! Near Maximum !
Lovex D073.5 87.5 52.7 3.41 2941 100.0 58000 8262 1.121 ! Near Maximum !
Accurate 4350 107.0 57.4 3.72 2932 97.9 50888 9397 1.169
Rottweil R901 92.2 49.2 3.19 2931 100.0 58000 8109 1.125 ! Near Maximum !
Lovex D073.4 86.1 51.8 3.35 2930 100.0 58000 8140 1.116 ! Near Maximum !
Accurate 2230 86.1 51.8 3.35 2930 100.0 58000 8140 1.116 ! Near Maximum !
Bofors RP2 NT ~approximation 92.8 51.7 3.35 2929 99.8 58000 8306 1.099 ! Near Maximum !
Vihtavuori N135 102.2 52.0 3.37 2927 100.0 58000 7739 1.113 ! Near Maximum !
Vihtavuori N140 95.8 52.7 3.42 2927 100.0 58000 7920 1.106 ! Near Maximum !
ADI AR 2209 107.0 59.7 3.87 2926 92.6 52471 9460 1.129 ! Near Maximum !
ADI AR 2210 85.2 49.4 3.20 2923 100.0 58000 8096 1.102 ! Near Maximum !
Lovex S060 93.3 51.0 3.30 2918 99.6 58000 8265 1.100 ! Near Maximum !
Alliant Reloder-12 89.3 51.1 3.31 2914 100.0 58000 7801 1.104 ! Near Maximum !
Hodgdon Benchmark 90.6 50.1 3.24 2914 100.0 58000 8045 1.103 ! Near Maximum !
Alliant Reloder-19 107.0 60.1 3.89 2908 92.6 50787 9482 1.149
ADI AR 2206 92.7 51.4 3.33 2907 99.8 58000 8138 1.100 ! Near Maximum !
Norma MRP 107.0 62.7 4.06 2904 93.0 46532 10135 1.188
Winchester Supreme 780 107.0 63.3 4.10 2902 93.0 53611 9095 1.126 ! Near Maximum !
Rottweil R904 107.0 59.2 3.84 2900 91.8 53992 9022 1.125 ! Near Maximum !
Alliant Reloder-10x 87.0 46.1 2.99 2899 100.0 58000 7534 1.116 ! Near Maximum !
Somchem S361 107.0 64.0 4.15 2898 91.3 56434 8867 1.117 ! Near Maximum !
IMR 4831 107.0 57.5 3.73 2896 97.8 49822 9135 1.174
Accurate 2700 100.0 58.0 3.76 2894 95.5 58000 8459 1.111 ! Near Maximum !
Accurate 2015 88.6 48.1 3.12 2889 100.0 58000 7463 1.122 ! Near Maximum !
The columns you need to look at is...
First column = Propellant name
Second column = % of case fill
Third column = Powder Charge weight in Grains (gr)
Fourth column = Powder Charge weight in Grams (g)
Fifth column = Velocity in FPS
Sixth column = % of propelland burnt [ Irrelevant unless you're shooting at night and want to reduce muzzle flash]
Seventh column = Pressure in PSI
Eigth column = Pressure at the muzzle in PSI [irrelevant]
Ningth column = Barrel time in Milliseconds (ms) [irrelevant unless you have quickload and know exactly how to tune with it]
Reduce and work up, and most importantly, HAVE FUN and good luck.
At this point, aren't you glad you asked the question? lolQuote:
Originally Posted by brianlt21
But years ago when the 06 was more popular, the go to powder for many was 4064.
Old Jack OConner was no doubt paid by Winchester for his unbiased opinions.
But one thing he taught me was that 4320 was about the same as 4064, but far easier to measure due to grain size.
I still use and prefer it over 4064 in the 06, 308, and 280.
50 to 52 gr with your 150 game king would be a good hunting load.
A) Yes it is, and yet you aren't whining about any other 30-06 based case being lower/different than the 270, can they not "take it"? Your logic was telling someone that they can accurately load a car to a pressure, without any pressure measuring device. That is false.Quote:
Originally Posted by bigedp51
B) You are the ONLY one talking about weaker guns/steps in this thread.
C) Right, but without being able to actually measure it, it's a useless statement. Will the Mauser folks tell your what that rifle is "rated for"? They'll answer the CUP rating for whatever it is chambered for. Again, you CAN load higher, but not too A PRESSURE level unless you can accurately measure pressure. Accurately measuring pressure is the whole point you can't seem to wrap your head around.
D) There is, as you pointed out several times in your own post, and I did previously. Measuring unknown, or known crusher brass is NOT ACCURATE. If it was, we wouldn't have moved past it to Conformal transducer or any of the other electric methods.
E) Also not true. Data is pressure tested, even if they don't list lot numbers tested, or specific pressure data.
F) They have been testing brass far longer than that amigo. They were testing pressures and cases first with lead crushers, then Copper, now electric methods. The 1950's is when Olin stopped listing nominal case specs for their components.
G) I merely offered a differing view. Somehow that has spiraled you into this wild social justice warrior. In fact I don't know if it's you trying to be like the popular SJW kids today, or if you've always been a jerk, but it's OK to have a different opinion and even discuss the views without pretending you are the second coming. If spitting insults at anyone who disagrees and an inability to have a reasonable discussion is your game; maybe stay away from any human contact.
The only thing flawed here is your over active ego.
Too bad your so full of yourself that you think you know more than anyone else.
Meaning the Internet is full of midgets sitting at their computer pretending to be giants.
I wonder how many reloader have "any" type of pressure measuring equipment.(less than 99.9999999999999999%) The rest of us look at the primers or measure base expansion.
You said my "E" above was not true and yet if the case capacity on a .223 case varies from 28.0 to 30.6 with the same powder charge there is 6,000 psi difference in chamber pressure.
Oh my, that must be why they tell you start low and work up your loads, too bad that advice is so flawed for the people without pressure measuring equipment.
I have to go now, I'm going to neck down a 30-06 case to .270 and blow up the world. (darkker's flawed theory of brass strength and reloading)
Have a nice day............Dude
I run 50.0gr VARGET under 150gr Core-Lokt's with relatively good accuracy out of my R700.......
Use load at own risk, no real pressure signs in my rifle but your mileage may vary.