Ackley Improved Cartridges

I have become very interested in the 223ai as well as the 280ai. The 223ai would be a 24" heavy barrel model 11 used for varmints and the 280ai would be built on a Stevens 200 with the intention of mule deer and elk. My questions revolve around the real world information around the benefits of the Ackley chamberings. It seems that for every benefit I can find I also find someone giving a counter opinion.

I do have reloading equipment but I have yet to set it up. How difficult is it, or what problems are typically associated with Ackley rounds? Reading on the 280ai specifically, I've found different shoulder angles and headspacings which has become quite confusing.

I want to maintain the ability to use factory non-Ackley rounds in a pinch and to fire form the cases. What should I know about them or look into further before I start ordering barrels?

223 Ackley is the bee's knees.

I have a 22" 1:7 Criterion (.061" freebore), and I get 2950fps with 80gr A-Max and 24.9gr 8208XBR, 2750fps with 90gr Berger VLD and 24.9gr Varget (both speeds 10rd average over chronograph and verified on steel at 650yd).

I use my generic AR load (23.5gr XBR under a 77gr Nosler @ 2.225" COAL) and it shoots about 3/4 MOA - good enough for fireforming brass, banging steel, dot drills, or killin' stuff.

Plus - trim brass pretty much never.

The benefits far out weigh any negatives. I have built several Ackley cartridges and have never had an issue. The very rare case trimming is a big bonus but my favorite thing about them is the efficiency. There may be other factory chamberings out there that provide the same performance but the Ackley's have always given me better performance with less powder. My 260 Ackley for example does anything a 6.5-284 will do and my 6.5-06 Ackley will do anything the 264 win mag will do. The only difference is I am using significantly less powder to do it. Which translates into better barrel ware and less recoil.

Ive been curious about this myself. Ive heard that you can still use factory ammo? If you have .270AI you could still shoot reg .270 win? Sorry for the threadjack

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Originally Posted by charb52

Ive been curious about this myself. Ive heard that you can still use factory ammo?

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Yes, you can.

Factory ammo goes in, Ackley cases come out.

Thanks for the answers.Boilerup you touched on something I'm curious about. From my reading I've learned there is a 30 degree and a 40 degree version of the 280ai, does that come into play at all when shooting standard rounds to fire form?

They should fire form the same way but the 40° is the true Ackley chambering and gives you the most improvement.

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Originally Posted by Twostepct

you touched on something I'm curious about. From my reading I've learned there is a 30 degree and a 40 degree version of the 280ai, does that come into play at all when shooting standard rounds to fire form?

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The 30 version is known as the "280 RCBS" designed by Fred Huntington of RCBS fame. When I shot the 30 firing/forming was the exactly the same as my 40s, chamber 280 Rem brass/ammo then tickle the trigger.

Bill

Most all the dies, brass, barrels and factory 280AI loads you see today are for the 40 degree version. Check out the Nosler load data web page for the standardized 280AI cartridge specifications.

For the less popular AI cartridges where there isnt dies what do you use to size?

Maybe the most beneficial part of the ai is not having to resize hardly ever. Just neck size and go, so a Lee collet die does the trick

The standard Lee collet and seating die work for me. I also have a Redding Body Die AI version if I ever need to bump back the shoulders. Go to MidwayUSA and search for "Redding Body Die Ackley Improved" for a pretty good selection.

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Originally Posted by charb52

For the less popular AI cartridges where there isnt dies what do you use to size?

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I just buy them form CH4D.

Need dies for a 6-250 Improved 30,35, the 6.5-06 Imp 24, 28, 30 or the 700 Van Horn Express? Dave's your man! :p

His modest cartridge list >https://www.ch4d.com/products/dies/caliber-list Oh, and he'll also make dies to your prints.

Bill

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Originally Posted by jpdown

The standard Lee collet and seating die work for me. I also have a Redding Body Die AI version if I ever need to bump back the shoulders. Go to MidwayUSA and search for "Redding Body Die Ackley Improved" for a pretty good selection.

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Yup, this is the way to go, IMHO. I like the Lee collet Dies regardless, and the fact that work great with the standard and AI cases is a major plus.

Personally I go AI whenever I can, and to me the biggest gain is brass life. Powder capacity and velocity gains are secondary for me, but fun also. I am a penny pincher when I can be, and the greatly added brass life and the elimination of trimming (trimming is my most hated reloading chore) make it well worth it.

Y'all, let me sneak in a question on AI vs. Parent relating to Lee Crimp Dies. For instance, will the Lee crimp die for say a 22-250 work for the 22-250 AI ? Or, are they two separate crimp dies ?

Lin.

Mine worked on both IIRC. I don't use my crimp dies on too many things, as I mostly shoot bolt guns and find it unneeded but IIRC I tested that too just to see. Been a long time ago so forgive me for my failing memory.

Hi. I just love both the Savage Axis rifles and the AI ctgs. I am lucky because I have a lathe and the means to measure my rechambering efforts. I make all my own tooling.
I have taken some 'spare' (new) Axis rifles and rechambered them this way:

223 into 221 Fireball (because I own 221 pistols)
223 into 223 AI
223 into 22-204R Imp (my own wildcat)
22-250 into 22-250 AI
243 into 243 AI

In all cases, I have both the original Axis and the AI version. As several posters have noted, the improvement in case life is pronounced. I do have a Oheler M33 chronograph. However, because ALL my rifle ctgs are ALL HBN coated, the velocity readings would be irrevelent for this discussion.
All rifles were rechambered using new PTG reamers. Gosh, these things cut through bbl steel like styrofoam!!!!

ron