Problem with 10 FCP-K??

Hello,

I am new to the forum and I joined to find out more about the 10 FCP-k. I've had one for about a year and a half, .308, and I've really never been able to group well with it.

I've tried different techniques. I adjusted the trigger, I made it quite light.

I thought maybe I didn't set the action to stock properly, since there is a little procedure to go through, so I took it apart again. Then, I don't know what I did, but I stripped the head of the rear action screw and couldn't get it out. Darn. I drilled it out and was able to remove it with a bolt extractor bit. I ordered new action screws from Savage and set it again. Scope base and rings are Ken Farrell Inc., so they are high quality and are torqued correctly.

Knowing it might be me, I have let others shoot the rifle with similar results, including an ex-military guy that I work with who is an avid shooter. He grouped a little better than I did, but not better than 4 inches.

I never did try high quality ammo, so I'm going to try better match ammo, but if it still doesn't group, shouldn't I send it back to Savage??

A couple of things to try and consider: what scope are you using? Have you mounted the scope on a known good rifle to see if the scope is still good? What ammo are you currently shooting? Have you checked if the barrel and tang are both free floated?

That's a good point about the scope. I haven't checked that. I'll mount it on another rifle and see. The scope is a Trijicon Accupoint, TR23 5-20 x 50.

The barrel is supposed to be free floated. I don't know how to check it otherwise, it's the accustock. It looks like it's free floated.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by drmike5000

Hello,

I am new to the forum and I joined to find out more about the 10 FCP-k. I've had one for about a year and a half, .308, and I've really never been able to group well with it.

I've tried different techniques. I adjusted the trigger, I made it quite light.

I thought maybe I didn't set the action to stock properly, since there is a little procedure to go through, so I took it apart again. Then, I don't know what I did, but I stripped the head of the rear action screw and couldn't get it out. Darn. I drilled it out and was able to remove it with a bolt extractor bit. I ordered new action screws from Savage and set it again. Scope base and rings are Ken Farrell Inc., so they are high quality and are torqued correctly.

Knowing it might be me, I have let others shoot the rifle with similar results, including an ex-military guy that I work with who is an avid shooter. He grouped a little better than I did, but not better than 4 inches.

I never did try high quality ammo, so I'm going to try better match ammo, but if it still doesn't group, shouldn't I send it back to Savage??

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To check free float simply take a piece of paper or dollar bill and wrap it around the barrel. Then slide it down the barrel towards the action. It should be able to slip between the barrel and stock almost all the way to the action.
Second thought...if adjusting action screws, go buy yourself a 40 dollar torque wrench from harbour freight and make sure it is in inch/pounds NOT foot/pounds. You should finger tighten both screws. Then have the rifle point up with the butt on the ground. While pushing down on the barrel, tighten front screw to about 20in pounds, then the back one. Then tighten the front to about 45-50 in/lbs then again the back one to the same.

As for the scope...what rings and bases are you using. Dont skimp on these. buy some good ones like talley, leupold, ect. Make sure they are nice and tight but do not over tighten the scope rings or you can damage the scope. Also, using BLUE lock tight will make sure they dont back out under recoild.

What ammo are you trying. Most rifles will shoot one ammo/grain weight of bullet well and another like crap. Whenever I buy a new rifle I will purchase maybe 3-5 boxes of different brands and weights of bullets. Usually you will find one it likes. Then once I do that, I go and buy 3 boxes of that exact ammo and call it a day. Now you have enough rounds for a few hunting seasons.
Match ammo MAY not work. My brothers savage hated nosler, and federal premium ammo but with fusion 150grains and remington corelock 160 grs it shot sub moa. The key is to try a few until you find some your rifle likes. It sucks and can cost a decent chunk of change especially if you have a picky rifle but I bet if you do everything I listed, you will find something your rifle likes.

Hello,

I have a Ken Farrell Inc. base and rings. They are high quality. http://www.kenfarrell.com/

I use the same rings on a target AR with a heavy barrel and I shoot sub MOA with that (when I'm lucky). That's with my hand loads, though. I'm not loading .308 yet, not until I get this figured out. This is the only gun I would load .308 for.

Because of the problem, I recently took the action off and set it again, similar to the way you are suggesting- though not necessarily torquing it the way you stated. I just followed the instructions in the manual, which are not as detailed. Both screws are torqued to 60 lbs. at this point.

I got some match ammo, 168 grn. I'm going to try it this weekend and see how it shoots. Admittedly, I was using just Winchester standard .308, NATO spec, so it's 147 grn. I also have used other similar ammo, which I know is not high quality. I wasn't expecting sub MOA, but I would have expected at least some predictability.

If it's still no good, I'll go through the rolls, check the scope on another gun, take it apart again and re-set the action, etc. If it's still no good, I guess I'll send it back.

When I say it's not grouping, I don't mean sub moa, I mean the average four or five shot group is like 6 inches. Looks like I shot the target with a 12 gauge and 00 buck.

Oh, yes the barrel is free floated. You don't even have to slip the paper, you can see with your eye it's free floated. I know this from setting the action, which I just did last night again. There's a visible space between the barrel and the stock.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by drmike5000

Hello,

I have a Ken Farrell Inc. base and rings. They are high quality. http://www.kenfarrell.com/

I use the same rings on a target AR with a heavy barrel and I shoot sub MOA with that (when I'm lucky). That's with my hand loads, though. I'm not loading .308 yet, not until I get this figured out. This is the only gun I would load .308 for.

Because of the problem, I recently took the action off and set it again, similar to the way you are suggesting- though not necessarily torquing it the way you stated. I just followed the instructions in the manual, which are not as detailed. Both screws are torqued to 60 lbs. at this point.

I got some match ammo, 168 grn. I'm going to try it this weekend and see how it shoots. Admittedly, I was using just Winchester standard .308, NATO spec, so it's 147 grn. I also have used other similar ammo, which I know is not high quality. I wasn't expecting sub MOA, but I would have expected at least some predictability.

P.S. the reason why you hold barrel down while butt is against ground while torquing action screws is to ensure the recoil lug is sitting flush in the stock. This is important!

P.S. the reason for holding the barrel down with the butt against the ground while torquing the action screws is to ensure the recoil lug sits flush inside the stock. This is IMPORTANT!

If it's still no good, I'll go through the rolls, check the scope on another gun, take it apart again and re-set the action, etc. If it's still no good, I guess I'll send it back.

When I say it's not grouping, I don't mean sub moa, I mean the average four or five shot group is like 6 inches. Looks like I shot the target with a 12 gauge and 00 buck.

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Yeah that is what I am saying with your groups though...my brothers rifle did exactly like 4-5 inch groups with the noslers and with the federal premiums then we for ****s and giggles tried the fusins and corelokts and dang...the fusions were right around 1inch and the core lokts were .75moa!!! so dont write the rifle off yet!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by drmike5000

Hello,

I have a Ken Farrell Inc. base and rings. They are high quality. http://www.kenfarrell.com/

I use the same rings on a target AR with a heavy barrel and I shoot sub MOA with that (when I'm lucky). That's with my hand loads, though. I'm not loading .308 yet, not until I get this figured out. This is the only gun I would load .308 for.

Because of the problem, I recently took the action off and set it again, similar to the way you are suggesting- though not necessarily torquing it the way you stated. I just followed the instructions in the manual, which are not as detailed. Both screws are torqued to 60 lbs. at this point.

I got some match ammo, 168 grn. I'm going to try it this weekend and see how it shoots. Admittedly, I was using just Winchester standard .308, NATO spec, so it's 147 grn. I also have used other similar ammo, which I know is not high quality. I wasn't expecting sub MOA, but I would have expected at least some predictability.

If it's still no good, I'll go through the rolls, check the scope on another gun, take it apart again and re-set the action, etc. If it's still no good, I guess I'll send it back.

When I say it's not grouping, I don't mean sub moa, I mean the average four or five shot group is like 6 inches. Looks like I shot the target with a 12 gauge and 00 buck.

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The reason for holding the barrel down with butt of stock against the ground while torquing the screws is to ensure the recoil lug sicks flush in the stock...this is important! I do suspect it may be your scope or ammo though.

OK, thanks. Hopefully it's just the ammo. I certainly hope it's the not the scope or the rifle.

I did push down on the barrel quite a bit, so hopefully I set it right.

I'll take it out this weekend.

You might also want to make sure the base screws haven't bottomed out early against the bolt or something leaving you with the impression they were tight. Sometimes there is a tiny bit of difference in the screw lengths. What weight bullet are you shooting and what brand of ammo? I have an -06 that will shoot 125gr bullets that look like a shotgun pattern and stack 168s into nearly the same hole. I have never had any luck with Tula 147gr it's just something to go boom and whet the appetite for a mag dump from the AR. Most old mil sup ammo isn't much better. You might give her a good cleaning and try some Federal gold medal match in 168gr or 175 gr. It's kinda pricy but known to shoot well in most rifles. Make sure when removing installing the action screws you use a wrench that fits precisely there should be no play wiggle or slop when it's put into the hex slot or another stripped bolt head is possible. I think the action bolt torque spec for your rifle is 65 inch pounds. Also here is an article on torque tuning a Savage rifle though I don't think it's gonna make 4" difference but it may help.. http://www.accurateshooter.com/techn...torque-tuning/ Good luck and let us know if you figure it out.

Also, double check to see that the tang is floated too.....

Rifle is fine. I just got back from taking it out. I went with my two young boys and their 10/22, so we were shooting at 50 yards. At 50 yards I was shooting less than an inch.

I tried this PPU 168 grn match ammo. Seems to work well with the gun.

I think it was a combination of resetting the action with screws torqued to 60 lbs, and the better ammo.

Nice to know it's not me or the rifle. The scope, I'm still not sure. It took a lot of clicks to get shots to the center.

That gun was made to shoot the Federal 168 gr. Gold Medal Match (Sierra Match King ie SMK) may wish to try those, see page 27 owners manual.
That rifle should group pretty easily inside 3"@ 300 yds and inside 4 1/2" at 400 meters.

I have the same gun Im shooting 155 amax that are 1/4 moa it didnt like the 168 .

fcp-k is a shooter. you just need to find the ammo it likes. took me a while to find out my fcp-k in 223 prefers the heavy stuff. 77gr federal GMM.

So, some pictures to show my progress. I appreciate all the advice. 50 yard shots because I was with my kids and they were shooting .22.

Better than before.


http://www.savageshooters.com/webkit...829/image.tiff

http://www.savageshooters.com/webkit...ff4/image.tiff