Savage Model 30, Series E, 20ga - need some help - with pics

New to the forum here, and have my first Savage.

It's a Model 30 Series E 20 gauge, 28" barrel shotgun in great shape that I picked up for a fair price from a friend's friend's father who died. Unfortunately there is little information on the web about these older, inexpensive guns. I can't find a take-down manual, anywhere. It will make a good kick-around gun.

I really don't need another full choke pump 20 ga, and may consider reducing the barrel length to open the choke.

1) How can I tell what the choke is? I've read that older Savage shotguns used *, **, and *** to signify Full, Mod, and IC. I can't find any * marks on this gun. I have a 1st year production Winchester Model 12 20 ga (full choke) and it's muzzle measures .582 at about 1/4" into the barrel with a cheap caliper, and this Savage 30 measures .597 when measured the same way. This is using a 6" Brown and Sharpe dial / slide caliper and the measuring end has flats, so that's making my measurements several thousandths smaller. I'd really rather base the choke on a gun marking, if possible. I think .611 is an IC choke in 20 ga.

2) The marks I do find look like a "3" in a square box, as well as a "52", and what looks like "SP1" or maybe "SPL". It's hard to tell since the stamp appears to be struck at an angle. (see below). Anyone know what these stamps mean?

3) How can I remove the barrel? I can unscrew the end cap but it won't come off, and nothing else feels looser after I loosen the cap. I've read that they can be loosened and then the barrel will rotate counter-clockwise (when viewed from the receiver) but it won't budge. It may be old and tight.

From what I can tell, this was made in the late 1970's with a S/N C663###.

Any help is appreciated! I shot it at the trap range this weekend but didn't hit much with it. Near the end I realized it does seem to shoot a bit low.

Thanks everyone, and thank you for any information you can provide!

http://i781.photobucket.com/albums/y...ps5e4207a4.jpg

http://i781.photobucket.com/albums/y...ps37ef3c91.jpg

http://i781.photobucket.com/albums/y...ps5e00212d.jpg

http://i781.photobucket.com/albums/y...psb0b7e7cd.jpg

http://i781.photobucket.com/albums/y...psf2fbe259.jpg

http://i781.photobucket.com/albums/y...psfa53b346.jpg
http://i781.photobucket.com/albums/y...psaba8a549.jpg

The SP1 stamp is the "Savage Proof" stamp that merely indicates it was proof tested at the factory.

The circled 52 stamp should be an assembler/inspector stamp that's simply indicates which employee assembled the firearm.

The squared 3 is a new one for me so I'll wait and see what Mad Dog has to say on that one. My Model 30L from 1960 has no such marking, just the SP stamp, an assembler's stamp, and one other encircled one right by the rib that is to faint to make out.

Thank you Mr. Baker.. so to your knowledge, Savage didn't as a standard mark the choke on these barrels? Kinda seems odd to me that they would not. Based on what you described, there is no choke indicator on yours, either. Maybe it's under the barrel.

Do you know of any instructions on how to disassemble this gun, or to at least remove the barrel? I still need to search the YouTube videos further. When I unscrew the end cap, nothing else seems to get loose. I think I can figure out how to remove the trigger group.

Also, is there another Savage or Stevens model that's very close to this one? I heard the 77 was close. I might have more luck finding a "close" manual for a more popular and similar model.

Sorry for all the questions. I bought the gun today because it just kinda called to me, and it's in good shape.

I was successful in removing the barrel. Just loosen the nut at the end of the barrel until it stops, then rotate the barrel clockwise (when viewed from the receiver) as hard as you can, and wiggle it while rotating. Eventually I saw it had turned a little - the alignment changed - so I kept going and after a couple minutes of working with it, it came loose. The threads were kinda dry and rusty, but I was able to clean it up and put the barrel back on.

When I get time I'll remove the mag cap (a retaining screw is revealed when the barrel is removed) and clean out that tube. I know it's dirty because the red plastic follower kinda hangs, and feels sticky.

Also, here's a good exploded view of the Model 30, Series E, on Numrich's site:

http://www.gunpartscorp.com/Manufact...tm?results=All

One more thing, there was one additional stamp on the bottom of the barrel - it's a small spade shape, I maybe could fit a BB inside the spade.

Okay more, I did read on another site that a guy had a Stevens model 67 (similar to Model 30) and he had a numeral "1" in a square stamp. I have a numeral "3" (see pic above). I'm hoping this is the choke designator, that he has Full (1) and mine is Improved Cylinder (3), but who knows. Maybe this replaced the "*" designator from before? Can anyone confirm?

Again, any info anyone can offer on the choke would be helpful. I know, I should just measure it with a bore gauge, but I need to locate a good one.

My only knowledge of choke markings were as you originally stated, with *, ** or *** being used. Joe (Mad Dog) informed me that they also often didn't mark the barrels if they were full choke - which is what mine turned out to be. Mine was made in 1960 so it's a good bit older than yours and there are a few noticeable differences.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v6...a.jpg~original

It was made in 1978 and looking at the 1978 catalog all I can get close to is ruling out the IC choke. They made the 28" barrel for the 20 ga in modified and full choke. Like Jim said they usually marked the mod chokes and left the full unmarked so I'd hazard a guess that it's a full choke as well.

Thanks Mad Dog, good information, and thanks for dating it. I figured it was a later model by the "C..." S/N.

I saw a post on Shotgunworld where a guy said that he recalled the numbers in the square being a choke designator (1=Cyl, 2=IC, 3=Mod, 4=Full) but that doesn't match what you're saying, and if you have the catalog I'd believe that over his info. I bet you're right, it's a full choke.

That would explain why I couldn't hit many clays with it this last weekend!

I'll plan on patterning it when I'm at the range next time - that way I'll know for sure.

BTW, is there any chance your Savage catalog is shareable? I have yet to see or find any published materials on the Savage Model 30. They must not have made many of these guns, I've spent hours searching (and I'm pretty good at it) and can't find much of anything. It really surprises me that even savagearms.com doesn't have old scanned images of manuals, online.

I'd keep an eye on Ebay, sometimes the 70 catalogs show up and sell cheap.