MkII G Project (or, how accurate can I get this thing!?)

Hello! Let me start with the short backstory:

My local range has 2 rimfire matches: NRA Smallbore Hunter Silhouette and ARA 50y bench. I want to build a rifle that will be legal for both, and I want to do it as cheaply/easily as possible. The club has a $500 limit for the plinker class ARA shoot, so I have to keep it under that. I think I found a way to make it happen.

Here's my list of things I need for this project:

Savage Mk. II G (Ordered / paid for) Price: $193
Rifle Basix SAV-RAT, set to 2lbs (Shipped) Price: $83.95
Stock savage weaver mounts (I already have these from a previous Mk. II FV build) Price: $0
Burris Signature Zee rings (Shipped) Price: $34
Burris offset inserts, 20moa drop (Shipped) Price: $15.89
Bushnell 6-24x40 AO Mildot (Shipped) Price: $147.67
Removable cheek riser pad, removed for NRA match (Shipped) Price: TBD
New bottom metal (already have from a previous build) Price: $0

Total so far: $474.51. Well under the limit.

Not counted in budget: Caldwell Bipod (to use for non-match shooting).

Also going to try a pillar bedding idea I had using threaded wood inserts instead of glassing / glueing in the pillars. Basically, when the rifle comes in, I'm going to measure the depth to the action studs, drill the holes out to 23/64, and install the appropriate length of threaded insert to raise the action 1/16". The plan is to have the rifle completely floating in the stock, the only contact being made is between the pillars and action studs. I also just ordered a Seekonk torque wrench, and I plan on tuning the action screws in 5in/lb increments. My ammo selection at the moment is Lapua Midas, Eley Tenex, and Wolf Match. I figure I can find a winner between those three.

The scope worries me a bit. Finding a good scope under budget is problematic, but I have a Bushnell 4-12x40 AO on another rifle, and it's plenty useable. I figure if it's close to the same as the 4-12x, it should be good to go.

I absolutely do not expect this rifle to compete with target-grade CZs, Annies, 40x's, etc. But I *do* hope to get it competitive for the classes that require a pencil barrel.

Stay tuned! I'll be sure to post pictures here as the pieces come in.

EDIT: Moving the pictures to the first post for the TL;DR people:

MilDot Hold Chart (For standard Mil Dot scopes with .25 MOA clicks):
http://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d7...psddf2f747.png

MILRAD Hold Chart (For SWFA SS MILRAD scopes with .1 mil clicks):
http://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d7...pse2a3cecc.png

Drift Chart for windage adjustment (Stopped at 225 to match Mil Dot chart):
http://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d7...ps59496263.png

http://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d7...ps0bec8c60.jpg

http://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d7...ps4718a869.jpg

http://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d7...ps1e87df9d.jpg


Sigting-in target, to verify 50y zero:
http://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d7...psf017aa73.jpg

The drop test target....pretty dead-on, I'd say:
http://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d7...psa6dda0dc.jpg

What distance do you shoot the steels?

I am curious why you went with 20MOA rings.

Hopefully that Bushnell does the job for you. Everytime I have looked at those scopes locally for my next varmint rifle I wasn't impressed. For the money I would have ordered a Mueller APT. I have 2 APV's and they are darlings.

For what it is worth my last 3 shots today with my MKIIG that is basically stock except it has DIP bottom metal, screws and trigger guard & a Simmons 3-9x32 scope (not even a 22mag)..the final 3 shots were in the same hole using Aguila Super Extra SV. Well within minute of squirrel head.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by plinkin

What distance do you shoot the steels?

I am curious why you went with 20MOA rings.

Hopefully that Bushnell does the job for you. Everytime I have looked at those scopes locally for my next varmint rifle I wasn't impressed. For the money I would have ordered a Mueller APT. I have 2 APV's and they are darlings.

For what it is worth my last 3 shots today with my MKIIG that is basically stock except it has DIP bottom metal, screws and trigger guard & a Simmons 3-9x32 scope (not even a 22mag)..the final 3 shots were in the same hole using Aguila Super Extra SV. Well within minute of squirrel head.

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Thanks for the encouraging response!

I chose a 20moa mount because that is what I use on all of my rifles. It just gives me that extra little bit of scope travel at longer ranges. The NRA smallbore course of fire is 40, 66, 77, and 100 yards. 20moa just might help a bit at 100, and I know several people that shim the rear ring to give them anywhere from 10-30moa for that match. I also occasionally really stretch the legs on the other .22 I have (Mk II FV). It's really fun to try to hit targets at 200, 300, 400 and beyond with a .22.

I checked out the Mueller scopes and they did interest me. I went with a Bushnell because that's what I had on my other .22 before I switched to an SWFA SS. It served me well and was pretty clear, but it was also only a 4-12x40.

The parts are trickling in and should be here this coming week.

I second the Mueller scopes. I have a 4.5-14 X 40 APT on my BTVLSS and love it. It's the first mil dot scope I've owned, pretty cool to shoot. I bought the scope for the ability to focus down to 10 yards and the fine crosshair it has. One of the things I learned years ago from shooting a bow is if you want to shoot small you have to aim small.

They seem to be nice scopes, but I've already ordered the Bushnell.

Mil-Dots are great when you get the hang of them, but they are only really usable in 3 situations: Fixed-power scopes, FFP variable scopes, or at the zoom setting where the dot spacing is exactly 1 mil (roughly 3.6" at 100y). I prefer the fixed-power method...it makes different calculations so much easier when dividing / multiplying by 10, 20, etc.

I am a combat vet and served (among other roles) as the DM for my platoon. Rifles are my hobby and at one point were what kept me alive. That being said, you are 100% correct...aim small = miss small. Of course, you have to have a rifle capable of hitting close to where you're aiming in the first place ;)

Back OT: The trigger arrived today. I use the RB trigger on my other Mk. II and I love it, so I'm hoping this one turns out just as good.

I shoot rimfire silhoutte with a Mark II BRJ and found that it didn't like the expensive ammo any better than the Fed Auto Match so that is what I run through it.

The scope will get you by but I find that those tiny little turkeys get hard to see behind a large crosshair so I use a fine duplex, others like a small dot.

Also, bear in mind that weight limit NRA has for silhouette. It will work against you in the BR stuff.

We have a competition section that includes silhouette and BR. You may want to check there.

Thanks for the response. I've checked the weight limit, and the rifle will (as a best guess so far) be legal for both. The scope is a hair over 1.22 lbs, and the rifle is 5.5. That's 6.7, which leaves 1.8 for rings and trigger, which are well under that.

I'm not concerned with the weight limit hurting BR, because the "plinker" class was designed for shooters to use bone-stock hunting-style .22's. I already have a BR-specific Mk II anyway. This is just for the fun of it mainly, and if it fails miserably, I'll still have a very usable squirrel gun.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by shanejohnson2002

This is just for the fun of it mainly, and if it fails miserably, I'll still have a very usable squirrel gun.

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I like that thought process :-)

Good news: More stuff arrived today: DIP bottom metal, scope, rings, 20moa base. Basically, I have everything *except* the actual rifle. But, it shipped today. Next week is going to be good, I think!

I changed from the 20moa inserts to a fixed 20moa base. The total cost is still under my limit and it'll be easier to transfer "normal" 0moa rings onto a canted base if I ever change scopes in the future.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by shanejohnson2002

Good news: More stuff arrived today: DIP bottom metal, scope, rings, 20moa base. Basically, I have everything *except* the actual rifle. But, it shipped today. Next week is going to be good, I think!

I changed from the 20moa inserts to a fixed 20moa base. The total cost is still under my limit and it'll be easier to transfer "normal" 0moa rings onto a canted base if I ever change scopes in the future.

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I think that was a good idea with the base. Did you go with a DIP base or EGW or something else? I really like DIP's products (and EGW too). I have purchased a small fortune in DIP products.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by plinkin

I think that was a good idea with the base. Did you go with a DIP base or EGW or something else? I really like DIP's products (and EGW too). I have purchased a small fortune in DIP products.

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I like DIP products, but I went with EGW because that's what I have on my 10 FCPK. The price was about the same between them both.

I plan on going all-DIP on my next project rifle: A MkII BTVLS for my lefty fiancee. Mainly because they offer theirs in a matching silver finish.

Shane
Basic rifle. Ten power SS 10x by 42. Added the Rhineland Arms Leopard stock. The Vortex flash hider is to keep the threads clean till my can comes in. This gun holds MOA @ 100 yds, dings iron at 200 and can be boringly accurate. DIP bottom metal ( had to do some inlet work on the stock). EGW rail, SWFA 30 MM rings. I am going to pillar bed it soon.
Twenty one inch pounds on the action. Great gun, buying a 93r17 FV and put the Tacticool stock that was under this at first on that one. 17 HMR is ammo that is easier to find around here. I shoot Wolf Target, and SK Standard anyway, so the price is no different. Good luck.

http://i.imgur.com/RB5uTE5l.jpg

That isn't the same barrel as the one I'm getting. I also have an fv in a tacticool stock that is, as you said, boringly accurate. I still expect the pencil barrel to do well, but probably not quite as good as your/my heavies.

Update: Rifle has arrived. I put all the parts and pieces in it, except for the cheek riser. I'm going to try without it a few times to see what happens.

A few notes:
1) The RB trigger is awesome. They say it's a 1lb minimum...I set it up exactly at 2 and it's crisp and clean with just a bit of resistance. I think I will try the overtravel trigger guard eventually, but for now this works.

2)The Zee rings were interesting...I've never used them before (I have DNZ Game Reapers on most of my other rifles). The top half screws were almost too short, you have to press the ring down a bit to get them to bite. Once they do though, it's there.

3)The crown on this rifle is a standard hunting-style rounded crown. I may re-crown it later, but I'll see how it shoots first.

4) The rear action screw would not turn up to 15 in/lbs. It kept biting into the wood. I got a flat washer and that solved the problem.

5) The barrel is indeed free-floated. Very nice, Savage. Very nice.

6) The DIP bottom metal is very obviously a vast improvement over stock. It's thicker and sits outside of the stock though...I may try to inlet it a bit. But I'll shoot it first and see what happens.

Next up, ammo testing. Hopefully today or tomorrow I can make it out to the range and take some pictures.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by shanejohnson2002

Update: Rifle has arrived. I put all the parts and pieces in it, except for the cheek riser. I'm going to try without it a few times to see what happens.

A few notes:
1) The RB trigger is awesome. They say it's a 1lb minimum...I set it up exactly at 2 and it's crisp and clean with just a bit of resistance. I think I will try the overtravel trigger guard eventually, but for now this works.

2)The Zee rings were interesting...I've never used them before (I have DNZ Game Reapers on most of my other rifles). The top half screws were almost too short, you have to press the ring down a bit to get them to bite. Once they do though, it's there.

3)The crown on this rifle is a standard hunting-style rounded crown. I may re-crown it later, but I'll see how it shoots first.

4) The rear action screw would not turn up to 15 in/lbs. It kept biting into the wood. I got a flat washer and that solved the problem.

5) The barrel is indeed free-floated. Very nice, Savage. Very nice.

6) The DIP bottom metal is very obviously a vast improvement over stock. It's thicker and sits outside of the stock though...I may try to inlet it a bit. But I'll shoot it first and see what happens.

Next up, ammo testing. Hopefully today or tomorrow I can make it out to the range and take some pictures.

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Excellent! Yes, the wood is THE weak point of the Savage MK IIs and 93s. The front action boss is the issue. It is a ***** to pillar bed. I was going to but chicked out. I will find another way to bed the rifle! Looking forward to the pictures. Just a point:..don't waste time with cheap ammo, you will not like it. Mine loves Wolf and SK. Remington Eley is my new love in it, but again, it is all hard to find now.

The only ammo i use for matches is lapua Midas, but i got a couple of boxes of eley tenex to try. I figure 2-3 5 round groups should tell me which one groups best up front, and then I'll start tuning the action screws.

UPDATE: Took it to the range on Sunday. The ammo test was inconclusive...I couldn't get it to group under 1" or so at 50y. Fliers everywhere. Could have been me, too, but I took out the FV and it made cloverleaves at 50. I'm going to try again this coming weekend. If it still doesn't work, I will see what options I have. Right now, I'm thinking the Tubb's Final Finish kit, the screw-in pillars I mentioned earlier, and shimming the barrel in different places to tune it.

I think the Eley grouped slightly better than the Lapua, but only slightly. The washer I had on the rear action screw actually coned into the hole in the stock, so I replaced it by stacking a finishing washer on top of a smaller flat washer. It seems to be holding much better.

UPDATE: No pictures (my phone died....next time I go will be a week from Wednesday, and I"ll take some then). I got the scope dialed in, and then started tuning the action screws. It really seems to like 25 in/lb on front and back, so that's where I left it. I still get the *occasional* flyer, but I was more than pleased with the results. By the time I was done tuning, I was able to fairly consistently keep every round inside a 1/2" circle at 50y. This was with Lapua...I still had enough boxes that I wanted to burn it up before I switched back to Eley. I may not switch again.

For the heck of it, I decided to stretch the legs on it and shoot at the 200y target. A quick calculation told me there was not enough angle on the scope, so I set the zoom to 8x to give me enough field of view and the parallax to 200, and aimed at the bottom post (after the last mildot). It was boringly easy to nail the 8" gong.

I'm *extremely* happy with the rifle so far. I still want to get it glass/pillar bedded, and I want to play around with putting shims under the barrel to tune it. As-is though, it's good enough to compete with next season.

Shane
I made this up for Wolf Match. I have shot it with all others, (SK Standard, Eley Tenex) and for tactical hold over, it is dead on. Copy it and laminate it and keep it with the gun...


http://i.imgur.com/dEMPJ.jpg

Quote:

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Originally Posted by russ10x

Shane
I made this up for Wolf Match. I have shot it with all others, (SK Standard, Eley Tenex) and for tactical hold over, it is dead on. Copy it and laminate it and keep it with the gun...


http://i.imgur.com/dEMPJ.jpg

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Thanks, but with my rifle, it won't be valid at anything but 12x. I don't have an FFP scope on this rifle so the reticle stays fixed across all zoom ranges. Besides, the method worked just fine....can't ask for more than that.

You can do it, but the math does not make it practical..yes, stay with your system. But if you get a 10x, here ya go! You can pass it on..

I did keep it...i have a fixed 20x on my fv that this would work very well fur. Thanks!

remember to double your hold over.....this is for 10 X. I found that out the hard way!

The mils on the 20x are still true mils (3.6"@100y)...this should still work. The reticle is just bigger to compensate for the power level.