Barrel burn out of 22-250 with stainless bull barrel??

I never know where to post a question like this..There should be like a general
info.Spot...

Anyway as some of you who have read my other post,know I ordered a 22-250
barrel in stainless and bull barrel...My intent is to try it for f class as well as my
rem 700 in 308,which is a good shooter.Just want to try something with a bit
less recoil,etc..
Anyway,all the guys on the sniperhide forum are saying the barrel will not last..

This shoot is 20 rounds in 30 minutes...I can see an average factory barrel
getting too hot and not lasting very long..But I figured with the bull barrel
it should not get very hot in 30 minutes and long as the velocity is kept low
and still can maintain the accuracy...I say their full of bull about this..

So I would like to hear your thoughts and or expericence about this...
I can see it if you set there all day and bang away,with no chance of a cool
down period...I have no problem with the 308 and that gets very hot in the
time allowed...SO tell me what you think...The barrel is ordered already..Thanks John:p

They are probably correct.

This depends upon A LOT of factors. My 243 and 58 gr bullets shooting CFE uses 43.8gr. The 22-250 with the same powder and 40gr bullets uses something like 2gr less. So essentially the same amount O powder, in a smaller surface area. This means much higher heat/ flame erosion. Now what does that translate to in the real world? Who knows.
Will the barrel withstand the match? Should. Will it be a 5,000 round barrel? maybe, but probably not.

In my weather right now, 1 shot per minute with my 308 wouldn't get the barrel warm enough to cuddle next to. It is in the 70-80's midday, with a 10-15 mph wind. Heating is not an issue. If you are 100+ and no wind, good luck...

Fit a water jacket like a Vickers machine gun.... You need weight anyway, right ?

If you are going to keep the velocity low why didn't you go with a .223? The .22-250 has been around for a long time and it's barrel expectancy is based mostly on varminting which can at times be hot and heavy. Probably pretty similar to an f-class match actually.

So let's say you only get 3,000 rounds out of the barrel. At 80 rounds per match (60 for record and 20 sighters), that is over 30 matches with about 500 extra rounds on top of that for load development and practice. How many matches will you attend per year? In the grand scheme of things I think you'll get your money's worth out of it.

I can chime in on this one...... I shoot .223 exclusively in F Class T/R out to 1000 yards. I run a 90 grain bullet at 2995 fps and have been doing it for several years on the same barrel. I'm over the 2K down the tube. It really shines at 300-600 Mid Range. In order to "stir the pot" with the Open Class folks, I decided to built a .22-250 AI with a 30 in 1-7 twist barrel.... running 90 grain Bergers, just like my .223. Oh yeah, I don't need a stinking mechanical front rest..... going to do it off a Bipod! Will it be hard on the barrel???? YEP!!!!!! BUT WHAT A RIDE!!!!!!!!! :o

I planto ride it out...I have the wrench and action wrench as well..I suppose I could even switch during a match...
I plan to get at least 2000 rounds thru it...I have to find out for myself...Then I can rebarrel to 6mmBR...And keep
moving forward..Something others can;t do..So if I get something like 1500 bullets I should be all set to lock and load..
And maybe 25 lbs of H 414...I appreciate your replies and still think I will get more than what some say..

I could toast a 223 if I wanted to in a day or two as well....John

After several years of compiling data and taking notes, I have came to the conclusion with most popular calibers it takes about 13 lbs. of powder to kill the guilt edge accuracy of a barrel. Of course there are exceptions to the rule.

The 22/250 is one of my favorite rounds, it just plain works. People complain that it is a "barrel burner" but most people will never get to the point where the barrel is burned out. I have had 22/250 barrels last a long time, 1500 plus rounds, and was still as accurate as day one. The biggest problem I see that happens to people is they dont properly clean the barrels, and they get to a point where the gun is not accurate, and this goes for many diferent calibers. Most people ignore carbon fouling, this is what will cause problems.

I would not wory much about it, as mentioned before 22/250 work great in dog towns, and they get tortured far more than what would happen in a f class match, and they seem to be fine. The problem I would say that would be with a 22/250 is because your esentialy shooting a score match, you are handicaping yourself, as a bigger caliber makes a bigger hole, and could get you a hair bit closer to the x, or the next ring. (Considering best edge scoring.) I can usnderstand you wanting something with less recoil, if yo belive it doesn't affect your shooting you are fooling your self. Check out David Tubbs, he found that recoil affected his shooting, and got away from the 308s, and shoots 6mms all because of recoil. With that all said I think you will be fine, but you may have been better off going with a 6mm br. I find that expermintation is good, but most have tried diferent things, and there is a reason why they use what they use, that is why many times it is just better to follow the leader on what they are using.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by kschilling

I shoot .223 exclusively in F Class T/R out to 1000 yards. I run a 90 grain bullet at 2995 fps and have been doing it for several years on the same barrel. BUT WHAT A RIDE!!!!!!!!! :o

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Congratulations on 70,000+ PSI

Remind me NOT to line-up next to you.

Remind me NOT to line-up next to you. theres your reminder...In fact get way back if you can....

I had a very informative conversation with Hodgon's today....He said there should be no problem
as long as I have time in between relays to push a patch through..It,s the crud from the primers
that will kill a barrel as well....I never see anyone at the shoots clean a barrel..No wonder they
get worn out so fast...I will take his advice...He is in the business....

I also called the boys at Sierra as long as I will be using their bullets...They told me basicly
the same thing..That the barrel needs to be wiped out to get the fine grains of sand like
stuff from the primers..I never knew this..So now we all know...With the bull barrel as long as
it is not so hot you can;t hold it.there should be lots of life in it..Maybe even go as many as 3000
rounds if wiped out. So I aint to worried about it now..So maybe you have learned something
as well now...Like they also said,not to pay much attention to hear say...I will find out...

Hell I just checked my note book and I have over 3500 in the varmint contour barrel..And thats
been plenty hot..And I clen it often..No brush..I use that foamcleaner...

And 82boy---thanks for your post---well written and though out...thanks again..John

:oWow!!!!!!! It seems that some people on here think they have all the answers, when in fact they don't. To make a statement as such without even knowing the raw data for the load???? What an alarmist! Here's your reminder!!! He sounds like one of those shooters that always has the correct advise for everyone. Bunch of that stuff on SniperHide too......

Acemisser: You're right on the money! You'll enjoy it. When you get down to load development, feel free to contact me with questions. I suggest to take a look at PP 2000 MR..... amazing stuff.

82Boy: I completely agree with your "scoring" theory. Big bullets break lines.....:)

Can I weigh in? I bought a 12fvss probably 12-15yrs ago. I shot the heck out of this rifle, handloads, just shooting paper, steel, crows, coyotes, etc. After about 1500+ rds the throat was beginning to lengthen but the accuarcy was still superb. I sent the rifle to Fred of SSS way back when. I had him set the barrel back and recut the chamber. Today, I have probably put another 2000 rds through it and it still shoots amazing. In fact the last range trip I shot 3 five shot groups of 55gr Noslers with a .4 avg. The thing just keeps shooting. But, you can pull the bolt and look thru the bore and see the first 4-5" of rifling are "gone". When you measure the chamber with a stoney point, you can actually push a bullet into the bore completely. Yes, I need a new barrel. So, this 22-250 has about 3,500+ rds thru it and is at its end. Was it worth it? Absolutelty! I just like the 22-250 and if you like the caliber then its worth it. Hope your new barrel is a good one.

P.S. I'm no match shooter but love to shoot and just thought I would tell you how long my barrel lasted. BTW, this was all warm loads.

Heres my 0.02$... in 30 trips to matches and probably 30+ trips to the range for load development you going to burn well over $300+ in fuel... about the same price as a new barrel. Your barrel is going to be a lot cheaper than the bullets, powder, glass, lunches and beers with the boys after shooting matches.

Shooting sports aren't cheap but in comparison to power boats, new Harleys and other toys that you have to make a $300+ a month payment for 72 months just to the bank.

Shoot the barrel, don't abuse it and when you need a new one laugh at the guy that spends $300 a month on his Harely that sits in his garage 6 months a year while its snowing and raining outside.

I agree....shooting 3000 rounds it will cost over $1200 to kill a $400 barrel.

I understand the concern about "barrel burners". I have 3 myself.

But I have to ask. Are you going to shoot it or did you buy / build it to look at?

It's going to burn. Period. They all do to some degree. Shoot it or take it home, put it on the coffee table & use it for conversation.

Just 2 cents from you 'ol uncle Frank....

Hasn't any one on this forum ever heard of rethroating a barrel, you send it back to the barrel maker and it cost about $100.00 and you only lose 1/4 to 1/2 inch of barrel length, it,s the perfect time to turn it into an AI version or you can just rechamber it, EX 223 to 22-250 there are lots of options with out having to chuck the barrel.

Tanks Dean

:PS I don't want anyone shooting beside me especially if they have an F-in muzzle brake, so I am going to start saying to the guy in the next bench, that I am running a full case of pistol powder in my 338 EDGE:

This may be hard to believe but my 22-250 VLP just went over 4100 rds this past weekend and still shoots under 1/2" with 50gr Hornady and 36.3 gr Varget. The throat is probably 1/2 way down the barrel but I just can't bring myself to replace it when it still shoots as good as it does.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by kschilling

I can chime in on this one...... I shoot .223 exclusively in F Class T/R out to 1000 yards. I run a 90 grain bullet at 2995 fps and have been doing it for several years on the same barrel. I'm over the 2K down the tube. It really shines at 300-600 Mid Range.

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by darkker

Congratulations on 70,000+ PSI Remind me NOT to line-up next to you.

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by kschilling

Wow!!!!!!! It seems that some people on here think they have all the answers, when in fact they don't. To make a statement as such without even knowing the raw data for the load???? What an alarmist! Here's your reminder!!! He sounds like one of those shooters that always has the correct advise for everyone. Bunch of that stuff on SniperHide too......

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2900fps plus in a 223 with a 90gr bullet is doable with a 30-inch barrel and the right powder. In fact, it's all spelled out in an article published on Accurate Shooter awhile back. It mainly focuses on the 22BR with 90gr JLK's, but does include the following paragraph discussing the use of 90gr JLK's in a 223.

Quote:

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Better BC for Service Rifle Competition
I am primarily a Service Rifle shooter, shooting an AR. Being aware of the self-imposed limitations of shooting the AR Service Rifle, particularly at long range, I had always endeavored to gain every advantage for myself. When the .224 90gr Jimmy Knox (JLK) VLDs came out about four years ago, I jumped on the bandwagon with a passion. I was easily able to obtain 2750 FPS with the 90 out of the tiny .223 case using VV N540, moly and CCI 450 primers. This familiarity with the quirks of the 90 JLK led me to build my wife a prone rifle in .223. I had John Holliger chamber a 30" PacNor in 6.5 twist for the rifle. John Holliger is absolutely the guru on the on 6.5 twist barrels, having pioneered them. I have had 5 or 6 6.5 twist PacNors that John has done, and every one has been a hummer. Using the 30" barrel, I was able to push the 90 JLK to 2900 FPS with no problems. The 90gr's BC has been listed from .560 to .590, and pushing it at 2900 fps, it was obvious that, as far as a .22 was concerned, the 90 JLK was the best wind-bucking bullet out there.

Source: http://www.6mmbr.com/T2K22BR.html

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However, in a standard length barrel (26" or less) everything I've seen lists the high end for velocity to be around 2,550 to 2,700fps, so in this case getting 3,000fps would very likely be a hot/high pressure load.

All good information..I keep on shootin that thing..I is pretty accurate with the 60 grain
SMK's...Haven't got into first place yet,but it aint over yet either..lol

Your barrel will probably last about 6 seconds.

http://www.accurateshooter.com/techn...t-barrel-life/

interesting read,but I find it very hard to beleive that the life of a barrel is over in a few seconds...I aint real...

Be as skeptical as you like; that won't change the reality. In terms of actual time firing with a bullet moving down the barrel, the lifespan of a rifle barrel is genuinely miniscule.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by MZ5

Be as skeptical as you like; that won't change the reality. In terms of actual time firing with a bullet moving down the barrel, the lifespan of a rifle barrel is genuinely miniscule.

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much like our own lives compared to the stars!

been a long time now..But I got around 3500 rounds thru it befor it
went north south and etc..Did pretty well with it..Anyway,I am thinking of
bulding another one only with a varmint weight barrel..Just wanted to touch
base again.Rizo:(

Interesting on the primer aspect. Bench shooters clean a lot, long range not much from what I read.

Of course there is all the other shooters.

I am on the side of the shoot it and enjoy it. Take the best precautions you can while doing so but it will wear out.

Its why I got Savages. I can change the barrel and I can get what barrel I want (pretty much)

It also why I now have 3, it breaks up the rounds per gun and they all will last longer.

The latest is a 270, odd choice but I got a great deal on the package, I am going to play with it though no great hopes as its a pencil, family had a 270 and lots of stuff for it form bullets to dies. If it shoots good I will have fun, If not the XC 308 goes on it and long term is will get the 7.5 x 55 Swiss.

I've come to believe that barrels are just an expendable part of shooting. If I get two seasons out of one these days I'm happy, that means I got some good shooting in and lived another couple years. The timed matches with sighters are where they get hot and nothing you can do about it except keep shooting..

[QUOTE=kschilling;136035]:oWow!!!!!!! It seems that some people on here think they have all the answers, when in fact they don't. To make a statement as such without even knowing the raw data for the load???? What an alarmist! Here's your reminder!!! He sounds like one of those shooters that always has the correct advise for everyone. Bunch of that stuff on SniperHide too......


HUH??

Quote:

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Originally Posted by RC20

Interesting on the primer aspect. Bench shooters clean a lot, long range not much from what I read.

Of course there is all the other shooters.

I am on the side of the shoot it and enjoy it. Take the best precautions you can while doing so but it will wear out.

Its why I got Savages. I can change the barrel and I can get what barrel I want (pretty much)

It also why I now have 3, it breaks up the rounds per gun and they all will last longer.

The latest is a 270, odd choice but I got a great deal on the package, I am going to play with it though no great hopes as its a pencil, family had a 270 and lots of stuff for it form bullets to dies. If it shoots good I will have fun, If not the XC 308 goes on it and long term is will get the 7.5 x 55 Swiss.

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Exactly

The advantage of.a.savage

Order a new barrel and.most.likely you will have it.in a week. Back in business.

Want a different cartridge. Just order a barrel and switch it.out. you can change back and forth in 30 minutes

Rebarrel a conventional bolt gun and you will be lucky to have.it.in 6 months

Quote:

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Originally Posted by acemisser

been a long time now..But I got around 3500 rounds thru it befor it
went north south and etc..Did pretty well with it..Anyway,I am thinking of
bulding another one only with a varmint weight barrel..Just wanted to touch
base again.Rizo:(

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I don't think that's too bad. For the avg Joe that shoots a few boxes a year that rifle could be passed down to his kids. Good luck on your next build.

Congrats, and thanks for the update Ace!!


[QUOTE=243LPR;379067]

Quote:

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Originally Posted by kschilling

:oWow!!!!!!! It seems that some people on here think they have all the answers, when in fact they don't. To make a statement as such without even knowing the raw data for the load???? What an alarmist! Here's your reminder!!! He sounds like one of those shooters that always has the correct advise for everyone. Bunch of that stuff on SniperHide too......


HUH??

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I don't think he liked the fact that I pointed out a 90gr bullet going 500fps over SAAMI max, is a bomb waiting to happen. Velocity doesn't come from angels, it comes from pressure.